Author Topic: Sponsored Magic Master List  (Read 92854 times)

Offline Sanctaphrax

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Re: Sponsored Magic Master List
« Reply #15 on: May 15, 2012, 03:26:08 AM »
Like with Superior Pyromancy would you get any bonus to attacks made with fire?

Also could someone post the power Hellfire, cause I lost my copy of the books somewhere and can't find em.

You get whatever bonuses you would have anyway. No extra ones.

Can't post all of Hellfire, but the gist is that it counts as fire for Evocation and as diabolism, entropomancy, or disruption for Thaumaturgy. It also gives +1 to power/complexity when used to harm and has vague evothaum capabilities.

Offline Thugorp

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Re: Sponsored Magic Master List
« Reply #16 on: May 18, 2012, 11:31:16 PM »
Eh, it's pretty broad. But it's still just Ritual with the speed and methods of Evocation. Given how narrow the normal Evocation of this power is, I don't expect it to be a problem.

But who knows, maybe it could use a little narrowing. Any suggestions?

PS: Adding these to the list now. They're still editable, so don't take this as a declaration that they're done.

I actually agree with Vargo Terrace, it seems to braud. I might suggest changing the, "thoughmaturgy," to ritual, that way the evothum really would just be ritual at the speed of channelling, or you could just limit the evothum, or(what I would do) just remove it.
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Offline Sanctaphrax

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Re: Sponsored Magic Master List
« Reply #17 on: May 20, 2012, 04:48:13 AM »
I am sorry, I do not have the foggiest clue what you are trying to tell me. Could you please explain further?

Offline computerking

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Re: Sponsored Magic Master List
« Reply #18 on: May 21, 2012, 06:13:37 PM »
Just a mention, but you were considering putting my version of Superior Divination up here.
http://www.jimbutcheronline.com/bb/index.php/topic,25794.msg1369320.html#msg1369320
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Offline Sanctaphrax

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Re: Sponsored Magic Master List
« Reply #19 on: May 22, 2012, 05:56:35 AM »
Yeah...the plan was (and is) to include it in the next list update. Which might be a ways off, because I've been distracted.

On the other hand, I could probably get it done pretty if I kicked myself into action. I'll try to get it done soon.

Offline computerking

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Re: Sponsored Magic Master List
« Reply #20 on: May 22, 2012, 06:49:21 PM »
Here's a stab at another, it's overly complicated, I think, and may need a bit of help...


SUPERIOR TRANSFORMATION [-2]
Description: A master wizard can refine his skills in a particular area so fully that his abilities are qualitatively different from those of a normal mage. While normal specialization simply makes one faster and stronger and more effective, this level of focus provides entirely new capabilities. Listens-to-Wind is so practiced at Self-Transformation that he more than held his own against a Naagloshii in a shifting combat in the infamous “Turn Coat” Case File.
Musts: You must have both Evocation and Thaumaturgy with at least some specialization in Both Transformation and Water Evocation in order to take this power.
Sponsor: This magic is self-sponsored.
Agenda: As self-sponsored magic, this power lacks an agenda.
Evocation: Superior Transformation does not provide any form of Evocation.
Thaumaturgy: Superior Transformation does not provide any form of Thaumaturgy.
Evothaum: Superior Transformation allows its user to cast Transformation rituals with the speed and methods of Evocation.
Extra Benefits: You may use Superior Transformation Evothaum (and 4 Fate Points) to bestow the “True Shapeshifting” and “Modular Abilities”  Powers on yourself for a scene, provided a successful casting of at least 6 successes, with remaining shifts contributing to Modular Abilities’ variable pool, which must be used for Creature Feature powers thematically in sync with any shape the wizard takes.
Note: Because this power requires Evocation and Thaumaturgy, it grants no focus slots and does not have its cost reduced when the user already has spellcasting powers. Additionally, Changing one’s own shape may incur additional difficulties to casting rolls, depending on whether the form can speak (+2 difficulty “No Incantations”) or perform proper movements(+2 difficulty “No Gestures”) required for effective spellcasting.
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Offline Sanctaphrax

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Re: Sponsored Magic Master List
« Reply #21 on: May 23, 2012, 05:36:33 AM »
I don't think this is very good, unfortunately.

For a few reasons.

Firstly, I don't think LtW uses Transformation magic. I think he's a biomancer.
Second, the extra benefit is super clunky and questionably balanced.
Thirdly, the additional difficulty stuff is totally pointless.
Fourthly, I see no reason to require people use water magic for this.

I'm honestly not sure how (or if) this can be salvaged. The second problem looks really hard to overcome.

Offline computerking

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Re: Sponsored Magic Master List
« Reply #22 on: May 23, 2012, 07:49:35 PM »
I don't think this is very good, unfortunately.

For a few reasons.

Firstly, I don't think LtW uses Transformation magic. I think he's a biomancer.
Second, the extra benefit is super clunky and questionably balanced.
Thirdly, the additional difficulty stuff is totally pointless.
Fourthly, I see no reason to require people use water magic for this.

I'm honestly not sure how (or if) this can be salvaged. The second problem looks really hard to overcome.

I think I threw too many things into one questionable power. Let me go through it a bit and pare down.

The Water Magic comes from a WoJ where he once mentioned that Listens to Wind and the Alphas use Water Magic (Presumably to shapeshift). So that can be washed away under the "Thaumaturgy lets you manipulate elements even if you don't have the corresponding Evocation" rule.

 I used Transformation magic because it's less technical in theme than biomancy, which would require more working knowledge of the body, instead of a more mystical rearranging of one thing into another. I think that either Biomancy or Transformation could be used for that benefit, honestly. I just prefer using the Functional category rather than the Thematic one.

The added difficulties can (And should) get thrown out, as they're a reference to something that a GM should handle, not the power itself. My bad.

As for the big problem, I may have rushed it making the power, and therefore added too much of what I was thinking. The only real benefit it should give is a  Fate point discount to get both powers (And the extra shifts of Modular Abilities). The rest of it is basically bad and making it look clunkier than it should be.

I'll work on it.
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Offline computerking

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Re: Sponsored Magic Master List
« Reply #23 on: May 23, 2012, 08:01:04 PM »
Here's a new, streamlined version, The Extra Benefit Balance question is fixed, with the removal of Modular Abilities. But now it's leaning toward "Not So Special". Perhaps a different Extra benefit altogether would be best...



SUPERIOR TRANSFORMATION [-2]
Description: A master wizard can refine his skills in a particular area so fully that his abilities are qualitatively different from those of a normal mage. While normal specialization simply makes one faster and stronger and more effective, this level of focus provides entirely new capabilities. Listens-to-Wind is so practiced at Self-Transformation that he more than held his own against a Naagloshii in a shifting combat in the infamous “Turn Coat” Case File.
Musts: You must have both Evocation and Thaumaturgy with at least some specialization in Transformation in order to take this power.
Sponsor: This magic is self-sponsored.
Agenda: As self-sponsored magic, this power lacks an agenda.
Evocation: Superior Transformation does not provide any form of Evocation.
Thaumaturgy: Superior Transformation does not provide any form of Thaumaturgy.
Evothaum: Superior Transformation allows its user to cast Transformation rituals with the speed and methods of Evocation.
Extra Benefits: You may use Superior Transformation Evothaum (and 4 Fate Points) to bestow the “True Shapeshifting”  Power on yourself for a scene, provided a successful casting of at least 4 successes.
Note: Because this power requires Evocation and Thaumaturgy, it grants no focus slots and does not have its cost reduced when the user already has spellcasting powers.

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PS: %^#@ Orbius. This may or may not be relevant to the discussion, but whatever.

Offline Sanctaphrax

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Re: Sponsored Magic Master List
« Reply #24 on: May 24, 2012, 03:21:00 AM »
Perhaps a different Extra benefit altogether would be best...

I think so. What we have here is just permission to use the temporary powers rules.

I honestly don't know what would be best for Superior Transformation.

My first instinct is usually to make Superior magics remove irritating little foibles in the kind of thaumaturgy that they enhance. Like Superior Warding removes the need for thresholds while Superior Conjuration removes the fake-looking-ness of conjured objects.

No idea how to use that approach with Transformation And Disruption.

On a related note, I've been wanting to write Superior Crafting to represent Luccio's Sword-making skills. It'd let you make items with multiple effects, and it'd let you give other people items that they could sustain with their own slots. But I can't think of a fair way to write the latter effect.

You seem like the person to ask here...so how would you go about that?

PS: I'd also be interested in hearing any ideas that you have for Superior Biomancy.

Offline Sanctaphrax

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Re: Sponsored Magic Master List
« Reply #25 on: May 25, 2012, 04:19:39 AM »
Reworded Superior Divination and Transcendent Swordsmanship.

Not totally confident in these rewordings. If you see something off, tell me.

SUPERIOR DIVINATION [-2]
Description: A master wizard can refine her skills in a particular area so fully that her abilities are qualitatively different from those of a normal mage. While normal specialization simply makes one faster and stronger and more effective, this level of focus provides entirely new capabilities. Martha Liberty, the reputed Spymaster of the High Council, is so practiced at Divination that Scrying a needle in a haystack is no harder than finding Waldo for her.
Musts: You must have both Evocation and Thaumaturgy with at least some specialization in Divination in order to take this power.
Sponsor: This magic is self-sponsored.
Agenda: As self-sponsored magic, this power lacks an agenda.
Evocation: Superior Divination does not provide any form of Evocation.
Thaumaturgy: Superior Divination does not provide any form of Thaumaturgy.
Evothaum: Superior Divination allows its user to cast Divination rituals with the speed and methods of Evocation.
Extra Benefits: Superior Divination expands the line-of-sight restrictions of Evocation, permitting its user to cast spells on targets that she sees through scrying or through other forms of divination. Spells targeted this way may not have a power greater than half the strength of the scrying effect that they are targeted through.
Note: Because this power requires Evocation and Thaumaturgy, it grants no focus slots and does not have its cost reduced when the user already has spellcasting powers.

TRANSCENDENT SWORDSMANSHIP [-4]
Description: Legends speak of heroes who fought dragons with nothing but sword and mail. These heroes fought creatures with nearly endless power and some of them actually won. Transcendent Swordsmanship channels the power of the heroes of old and uses it to do the impossible with swords.
Sponsor: Transcendent Swordsmanship is sponsored by the spirits, or perhaps the legends, of long-dead heroes.
Agenda: Transcendent Swordsmanship drives its user to destroy evil and to prove his own worth as a hero.
Evocation: Evocations cast with Transcendent Swordsmanship often resemble air or metal evocations, and they almost always emulate sword techniques.
Thaumaturgy: Transcendent Swordsmanship allows its user to cast rituals that tap into the legends of dead heroes, as well as rituals that summon spiritual warriors.
Evothaum: Transcendent Swordsmanship does not grant the ability to use Thaumaturgy with the speed and methods of Evocation.
Extra Benefits: A character with Transcendent Swordsmanship replaces his Conviction skill with his Might skill and his Discipline skill with his Weapons skill for the purposes of spellcasting.
Note: Foci made to boost Transcendent Swordsmanship spells are almost always swords. That being said, there's nothing stopping Transcendent Swordsmanship from becoming Transcendent Axemanship in the hands of a specific character.

Offline computerking

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Re: Sponsored Magic Master List
« Reply #26 on: May 26, 2012, 12:07:14 PM »
I think so. What we have here is just permission to use the temporary powers rules.

I honestly don't know what would be best for Superior Transformation.

My first instinct is usually to make Superior magics remove irritating little foibles in the kind of thaumaturgy that they enhance. Like Superior Warding removes the need for thresholds while Superior Conjuration removes the fake-looking-ness of conjured objects.

No idea how to use that approach with Transformation And Disruption.

On a related note, I've been wanting to write Superior Crafting to represent Luccio's Sword-making skills. It'd let you make items with multiple effects, and it'd let you give other people items that they could sustain with their own slots. But I can't think of a fair way to write the latter effect.

You seem like the person to ask here...so how would you go about that?

PS: I'd also be interested in hearing any ideas that you have for Superior Biomancy.
The more I re-read Transformation, The more I think you're right. Here's  What I came up with...


SUPERIOR BIOMANCY [-2]
Description: A master wizard can refine his skills in a particular area so fully that his abilities are qualitatively different from those of a normal mage. While normal specialization simply makes one faster and stronger and more effective, this level of focus provides entirely new capabilities. Listens-to-Wind is so practiced at Biomancy that he more than held his own against a Naagloshii in a shapeshifting combat in the infamous “Turn Coat” Case File.
Musts: You must have both Evocation and Thaumaturgy with at least some specialization in Biomancy in order to take this power.
Sponsor: This magic is self-sponsored.
Agenda: As self-sponsored magic, this power lacks an agenda.
Evocation: Superior Biomancy does not provide any form of Evocation.
Thaumaturgy: Superior Biomancy does not provide any form of Thaumaturgy.
Evothaum: Superior Biomancy allows its user to cast Biomancy rituals with the speed and methods of Evocation.
Extra Benefits: You may use Superior Biomancy to produce minor alterations in your own physical Form (Eye color, Height, Skin tone, Hair length/color, etc.) as a Mundane Effect, Producing an effective disguise. Under scrutiny, the effectiveness of this disguise is determined by a Lore roll.
Note: Because this power requires Evocation and Thaumaturgy, it grants no focus slots and does not have its cost reduced when the user already has spellcasting powers.
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Offline computerking

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Re: Sponsored Magic Master List
« Reply #27 on: May 26, 2012, 12:46:46 PM »
On a related note, I've been wanting to write Superior Crafting to represent Luccio's Sword-making skills. It'd let you make items with multiple effects, and it'd let you give other people items that they could sustain with their own slots. But I can't think of a fair way to write the latter effect.

You seem like the person to ask here...so how would you go about that?

SUPERIOR CRAFTING [-2]
Description: A master wizard can refine his skills in a particular area so fully that his abilities are qualitatively different from those of a normal mage. While normal specialization simply makes one faster and stronger and more effective, this level of focus provides entirely new capabilities. Warden Anastasia Luccio in her prime (and original body) was so talented at Crafting that she created the Warden Sword, the most useful tool against warlocks the White Council has ever used.
Musts: You must have both Evocation and Thaumaturgy with at least some specialization in Crafting in order to take this power.
Sponsor: This magic is self-sponsored.
Agenda: As self-sponsored magic, this power lacks an agenda.
Evocation: Superior Crafting does not provide any form of Evocation.
Thaumaturgy: Superior Crafting does not provide any form of Thaumaturgy.
Evothaum: Superior Crafting does not provide any Spells at the speed of Evocation.
Extra Benefits: A Superior Crafted item may be made usable by a specific other person without any reduction in uses or strength. You may use Superior Crafting to produce an Enchanted Item with multiple effects, allowing for an item to be used to perform multiple separate functions with separate pools of standard uses. A Master Crafter may “compress” the uses of all of an enchanted Item’s  effects into a single pool consisting of the total of all effects’ uses. Additionally, “Compressed” crafting items may be reduced in its number of uses to allow its upkeep to be met by a user with a lower Lore than its creator, at a cost of 1 use per level below. 
Note: Because this power requires Evocation and Thaumaturgy, it grants no focus slots and does not have its cost reduced when the user already has spellcasting powers.
 

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PS: %^#@ Orbius. This may or may not be relevant to the discussion, but whatever.

Offline Sanctaphrax

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Re: Sponsored Magic Master List
« Reply #28 on: May 26, 2012, 08:26:50 PM »
I really like Superior Biomancy. But I think I'll add a second option to the Extra Benefit, namely using Lore for medical care, because otherwise people with True Shapeshifting will get less mileage out of this.

Not so sure about Superior Crafting. I think you're onto something, though unfortunately this can't properly model a Warden sword.

As I see it, Superior Crafting has three effects.

1. No cost to make items for specific other people. My reading of the rules allows this normally, but it is a bit ambiguous.
2. Can compress multiple Enchanted Items into one, letting them share uses. I like this a lot, but we might have to impose some kind of limit on it.
3. Can lend out items at almost full power, paying a small tax to do so. I'm a bit nervous about this one.

Offline computerking

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Re: Sponsored Magic Master List
« Reply #29 on: May 27, 2012, 09:57:08 AM »
I really like Superior Biomancy. But I think I'll add a second option to the Extra Benefit, namely using Lore for medical care, because otherwise people with True Shapeshifting will get less mileage out of this.

Not so sure about Superior Crafting. I think you're onto something, though unfortunately this can't properly model a Warden sword.

As I see it, Superior Crafting has three effects.

1. No cost to make items for specific other people. My reading of the rules allows this normally, but it is a bit ambiguous.
2. Can compress multiple Enchanted Items into one, letting them share uses. I like this a lot, but we might have to impose some kind of limit on it.
3. Can lend out items at almost full power, paying a small tax to do so. I'm a bit nervous about this one.
Yes, I made effect 1 because the rules only have 2 options: Only the creator can use the item, or the item can be used by anyone for the cost of 1 strength.

Here's an example of Effect 2 : Instead of an item that has 2 separate effects , such as veiling its user(1 use per session, 1 slot) and causing a smoky cloud (Block vs Perception, 3 uses, 2 slots, the second slot was used to increase the uses per session), A Superior Crafter can compress those 2 effects, so that they have a 4 use pool for both of them.

To extend this example to Effect 3, Say the Crafter has Lore 5. The Veil or the Cloud would have a strength of 5. But in order for a Lore 3 user to maintain the item, the Crafter can reduce the number of uses per session to 2.

In regards to the Warden Swords, My power would allow for both the effects to be compressed into a 6 use pool, reduced by 3 uses to allow for most Wardens to be able to maintain the item. Lore 3 sounds like a good level for a Warden to be trained to before they are trusted with a Sword...
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PS: %^#@ Orbius. This may or may not be relevant to the discussion, but whatever.