Author Topic: Who would you recruit into the Einherjar?  (Read 3724 times)

Offline beachhead1973

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Re: Who would you recruit into the Einherjar?
« Reply #15 on: November 29, 2011, 12:31:32 AM »
I didn't mean the pagan ones - most of them are much less violence than the "one percenters".

I'm thinking of outlaw bikers.  The type who enjoy fighting (basically over nothing).  Hell Angels, Outlaws, Bandidos - and their fellow riders.  Their love of fighting and their disregard of external authority are similar to how the Vikings lived.

Richard

good points, reminds us that not every Einherjar has to be a "good guy" he/she could as easily be a Stasi wetwork specialist, Einsatzgruppen or anything else on the sith-side of the scale.

Offline Silverblaze

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Re: Who would you recruit into the Einherjar?
« Reply #16 on: November 29, 2011, 06:24:03 AM »
I was actually referring to the 1%'s as well. 

Many einherjar would likely not be remotely good or honorable people.

Offline ARedthorn

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Re: Who would you recruit into the Einherjar?
« Reply #17 on: November 29, 2011, 10:10:35 AM »
Define honor.

The Vikings had a code of honor- and a pretty serious one- just one we wouldn't necessarily immediately grasp. More of a dedication/bravery/braggery(was actually a virtue for them) thing. A serious look at their gods will show that- Tyr was their god's king before Odin- only lost the position because he lost his hand... which he sacrificed to bind Fenris (which he didn't need to sacrifice if he'd been willing to renege on a bet).

As for being anti-external authority... that's at least a little shaky... they had a lot of respect for their kings, as long as their kings had respect for them. The Vikings would've hated modern culture, because the leaders of today (which the vikings would've seen as anyone with wealth) weren't taking care of their warriors or their people... so yeah- anti-current-external-authority, but not anarchists- not even vaguely.

Plus I doubt the Valkyrie would care much about political agenda or personal life... they're recruiters for the final battle, not for the next big revolution. The only thing they'd care about is making sure their recruits are willing to fight in it- whatever the reason. Viking-style honor would be perfect, but not necessary... at minimum, sufficient dedication to any cause that could line up....

Offline vonpenguin

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Re: Who would you recruit into the Einherjar?
« Reply #18 on: November 29, 2011, 01:26:49 PM »
The light brigade. That is all.

Offline mdodd

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Re: Who would you recruit into the Einherjar?
« Reply #19 on: November 29, 2011, 02:25:25 PM »
Audie Murphy
One year's forum service, nearly two
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“And the people next door oppress me all night long. I tell them, I work all day, a man's got to have some time to learn to play the tuba. ― Terry Pratchett.

Offline Silverblaze

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Re: Who would you recruit into the Einherjar?
« Reply #20 on: November 29, 2011, 04:00:57 PM »
Define honor.

The Vikings had a code of honor- and a pretty serious one- just one we wouldn't necessarily immediately grasp. More of a dedication/bravery/braggery(was actually a virtue for them) thing. A serious look at their gods will show that- Tyr was their god's king before Odin- only lost the position because he lost his hand... which he sacrificed to bind Fenris (which he didn't need to sacrifice if he'd been willing to renege on a bet).

As for being anti-external authority... that's at least a little shaky... they had a lot of respect for their kings, as long as their kings had respect for them. The Vikings would've hated modern culture, because the leaders of today (which the vikings would've seen as anyone with wealth) weren't taking care of their warriors or their people... so yeah- anti-current-external-authority, but not anarchists- not even vaguely.

Plus I doubt the Valkyrie would care much about political agenda or personal life... they're recruiters for the final battle, not for the next big revolution. The only thing they'd care about is making sure their recruits are willing to fight in it- whatever the reason. Viking-style honor would be perfect, but not necessary... at minimum, sufficient dedication to any cause that could line up....

(click to show/hide)

/rant

(click to show/hide)

Honorable was me dumbing down or simplifying what took a half wall of text to say.  My bad.  In general I don't feel the need to extrapolate on my "expertise" on topics.  Honor was a poor word anyhow...99% of the planet either doesn't know what the original dictionary definition of the word nor would anyone's personal honor match.

In my opinion, most people ( you know non experts on pagan cultures of old or especially vikings ) would assume literally stabbing someone in the back or killing them in their sleep (generally preventing that warrior [the one who died in his sleep] from going to Valhalla) for a woman or trinket would be classified under unhonorable behavior.  There are plenty of theives, liars, murderers, and rapists in Valhalla as we speak.  I think these tidbits of information may be important while selecting people for that list.

So sorry I wasn't clear.

/shoots troll dead
« Last Edit: November 29, 2011, 04:05:19 PM by Silverblaze »

Offline ARedthorn

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Re: Who would you recruit into the Einherjar?
« Reply #21 on: November 29, 2011, 10:45:40 PM »
Umm... ok?

1- trying to further refine the image of Einherjar/Vikings-in-general that I was putting forward.

2- trying to contest your statement
Many einherjar would likely not be remotely good or honorable people.
as well as R_C's
I'm thinking of outlaw bikers.  The type who enjoy fighting (basically over nothing).  Hell Angels, Outlaws, Bandidos - and their fellow riders.  Their love of fighting and their disregard of external authority are similar to how the Vikings lived.
without being an arse, by giving benefit of the doubt, and then explaining myself.

3- so much for that. If I came across troll-ish, or like I was talking down to you... sorry. I point to your own complaints about the written word as possible culprits.

Simple form:
Love of fighting? Good. By itself? Not good enough.
Disregard of external authority? Not a deal-breaker, but not really in-character either.
Complete lack of Honor? Definitely a deal-breaker. They have to be driven by something important enough they'd be willing to die repeatedly pursuing a fight they knew they were going to lose...
Lack of 'Goodness'? Probably ok.

Copy?
« Last Edit: November 29, 2011, 10:53:51 PM by ARedthorn »

Offline Becq

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Re: Who would you recruit into the Einherjar?
« Reply #22 on: November 30, 2011, 02:46:06 AM »
While I haven't studied the subject, I did a bit of looking and found some information from the Prose Edda which seems to qualify as a primary source (written around 1220).  In any case, according to it, "all those who fall in battle are [Odin's] adopted sons" and are known as Einherjar.  This includes "all those men that have fallen in battle since the beginning of the world".

So if you go by that, then the only requirement is that you must die in battle.  Depending on interpretation, this might require the candidate to die fighting (because if they were fleeing or were a noncombatant, then they might not themselves be "in battle" despite dying on a battlefield due to a battle).  No requirement for skill, or overt levels of heroism, cultural background, etc.  (There is mention of oaths sworn to Odin, so I assume there's an opt-out clause for those who choose not to join up, which might weed out those who don't like to fight enough that they want to continue fighting until the end of the world.)

I guess it depends on how you define the Einherjar at your table.

Offline beachhead1973

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Re: Who would you recruit into the Einherjar?
« Reply #23 on: December 03, 2011, 04:07:14 AM »
Audie Murphy

Bingo, I agree completely.

I'll rep my country's answer to the say question; Tommy Prince