pull spell, others?

[dlw32]

newbie looking for validation on a spell; am I close? (it's meant to be my PC's rote spell, ignore the notes like "with the Staff"):

Traxi (Pull; with the Staff):
Type:  Earth Evoc Attack
Power:   6 Shifts of power
Control:  Discipline (+2 Staff Focus, +1 Earth Specialization) vs Target's Might
Duration:  1 or more attack
Effect:  Control the earth’s magnetic field to draw something metal to you. If the object is held the spell power is compared to the holder’s Might, otherwise, use the spell’s power as a Might check on the lifting chart (pg 321).

Also, is there a place where we can look at spells people have put together? I love the flexibility of being able to pull a spell together on the fly, but I'd like to see what other people have done and verify what I'm doing.

[Deadmanwalking]

As described, that would technically be a Maneuver, not an Attack. Other than that, looks good.

[greycouncilmember]

As described, that would technically be a Maneuver, not an Attack. Other than that, looks good.

From your pespective, could you explain what you mean by it's technically a Maneuver?  what would that mean and how would that play out in combat? 

[dlw32]

I guess I was focused on it being a disarming spell. If I'm trying to pull something (a gun?) from someone's hand, wouldn't that be an attack?

I can see if the object isn't held, it looks more like a maneuver.

What if I use it to attack; like if the guy is between a folding chair and me?

[WillH]

Disarming someone is a maneuver. You give them the aspect disarmed.

[greycouncilmember]

Disarming someone is a maneuver. You give them the aspect disarmed.

This is where things get confusing for me with Maneuvers.  In game terms, if a person has the aspect disarmed, how does that actually prevent them from using their weapon other than just saying disarmed?  They can spend the exchange getting rid of the aspect to get their weapon back right? 

[WillH]

You get rid of aspects placed by maneuvers with another maneuver. But, given the inherent temporary nature of something like disarmed, I could see saying it can't be made sticky, regardless of how many shifts you get.

[Bernd]

But, given the inherent temporary nature of something like disarmed, I could see saying it can't be made sticky, regardless of how many shifts you get.

Why is that? You still need a maneuver to get your weapon back or draw your backup pistol. I'd call it an Athletics roll against mediocre (+0). If it's not sticky, you get your weapon back or draw a new weapon for free, if it's sticky you have to ready your weapon (whichever it is) and need your whole action.

[WillH]

Why is that? You still need a maneuver to get your weapon back or draw your backup pistol. I'd call it an Athletics roll against mediocre (+0). If it's not sticky, you get your weapon back or draw a new weapon for free, if it's sticky you have to ready your weapon (whichever it is) and need your whole action.

Doing any of those things is at most a supplemental action. It makes no sense to require a maneuver to do any of those things. That's why, in a lot of cases, it doesn't make sense to allow disarmed to be sticky.

[Myrddhin]

Drawing a weapon is a supplemental action (YS 213). I'd say that "Disarmed" could be sticky so long as the subject took no action to try to rearm. So if they had two pistols, drew one and you disarmed them of it then the "Disarmed" would stick unless they used part of their next action to draw their other pistol, which you could try to prevent them from doing by rolling to maintain/defend the Maneuver (the example works better when considering it as a skill-based disarm, but it pretty much holds for a spell-based you just switch your defense/maintenance bit for the effect strength used to place the aspect).

[WillH]

Well if you're actively preventing rearming, or if rearming is not practical for some reason, I'd just say disarmed is sticky in that case. I wouldn't require rolls to maintain the maneuver, unless it was to oppose the maneuver to remove the disarmed aspect.

[Belial666]

There are ways to disarm someone sticky - or even permanently.

With weapons/guns;
Hit their hands. Endurance check to pick up the weapon again despite the pain. (i.e. remove the aspect)
Destroy their weapon. They need to draw another weapon. This works especially well against a wizard's focus.
Kick their weapon out a window (supplemental action after disarm). They need to draw another weapon.

With Might;
Rip their weapon out of their hands. They need to draw another weapon AND you now have their weapon to use.
Break their weapon. They need to draw another weapon.
Throw their weapon out a window (supplemental action after disarm). They need to draw another weapon.

With Magic;
[fire] Heat Metal; They can't use ANY metal object as it is superheated unless they make endurance rolls or take physical stress. Some weapons (such as guns) might be destroyed anyway.
[air] Freeze Metal; as above. Guns and explosives don't go boom but don't fire either.
[earth] Shatter; destroys objects.
[water] Meltdown; as above.
[spirit] Fade; weapons and objects become insubstantial for a short time. Good for when you want to disarm but also protect some object somebody is carrying.

[WillH]

They need to draw another weapon.

Drawing a weapon is a supplemental action. If that's an option for the disarmed person they shouldn't have to perform a maneuver to remove the aspect. Maybe it makes more sense to say it's sticky but can just be removed with a supplemental action instead of a maneuver when recovery or replacement of the weapon would normally just be a supplemental action.

[Belial666]

Except that most people don't bring a second weapon with them and sometimes it is not feasible to have a second weapon. I.e. someone is not going to have a second Sword of the Cross if he's disarmed and a wizard is not going to have a second focus. Similarly, most warriors can't carry a second battleaxe or AK-47; there's simply not enough room.

[exploding_brain]

Didn't have a chance to read the whole thread yet, but I thought I'd throw this idea in real quick:

The best way to model this might be as a block, rather than an attack or a maneuver.