Ritual complexity

[Tedronai]

Pg 288
'The spell is cast like evocation:
power first, control later, all done in
one exchange.'

Pg 255, 'Gathering Power'
'You can channel a number of shifts in power
equal to your Conviction with a minimum of
impact—just one point of mental stress.'


Edit:

Casting Thaumaturgy at evocation means will obviously include stress, as mental stress is the main means and tool of casting evocations. The timescale though is the question you can summon someone small with Seliee Magic say this takes 7 shifts of power with the duration of a turn there does not seem much you could do with a small fairy in one turn.

Summoning is not a durationed effect unless you specifically choose for it to be so (by, for instance, providing the 'body' for the summoned being to inhabit, in such a way that it that body will limit their time in the mortal world).  Otherwise, once they've been summoned they're there until they leave, or are banished (possibly by sunrise).

[UmbraLux]

YS255 is evocation, we're still talking thaumaturgy correct?  Drawing power for thaumaturgy is on YS271.  You only take stress if you draw more than your Conviction in one round.  That's probable if we're talking about a 9 shift ritual but likely not in effect if talking about a 3 shift ritual.

It's worth noting that attack spells are almost impossible to pull off as thaumaturgy without preparation.  You still need the symbolic link for thaumaturgy - even when casting "with evocation's methods and speed".  Do note that phrase, stress isn't a method.  It's an effect or result.  Besides, YS288 is fairly clear on what the phrase means.  You can add to it if you wish, but it is an addition. 

[Tedronai]

I see how you could come to that conclusion.  I think you're wrong.


The sidebar on pg 288 is not an exclusive list of changes.

The methods evocation uses, which you are now using to create a thaumaturgical effect, gather power in a particular manner.  That manner is explained on page 255.

It's not just a matter of doing things in a different order.  In fact, really the only major thing you keep from thaumaturgy is the thematic grouping of available effects.
(sidebar pg 288: 'With the power
source, you get access to the listed
set of thaumaturgic effects (often a
thematic grouping of some sort) as a
viable effect of an evocation spell.")

[UmbraLux]

Honestly, I don't think it matters much.  Each individual group can and will come to their own conclusion - as you and I have.  As long as either interpretation is applied consistently, I could accept it.

For clarity, my reasoning ran like this:

[1] It's Thaumaturgy so all thaumaturgy rules apply except;
[2] it's "with evocation's method and speed" as defined by the sidebar.
[3] Anything not defined in the sidebar reverts back to Thaumaturgy's rules.

I think item 3 is where we differ...you appear to be using the rest of Evocation's rules, correct? 

[Tedronai]

Well, the differences start in your second bullet, as the sidebar is, in several instances, apparently sufficiently vague as to allow for either interpretation.
I interpret 'cast like evocation - power first, control later' as meaning more than merely doing things in a different order.  Evocation has a particular manner of gathering that power, and of controlling it.