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Messages - Cozarkian

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226
DF Reference Collection / Re: Questions
« on: March 14, 2012, 08:44:02 PM »
My personal theory is that as Harry never took up the coin, he has not had the opportunity to truly cast it aside, so he's the closest thing to a bearer Lasciel has right now, thus, she can whisper at him now that he's taken her out of the circle.

So the only way to resist temptation is to first give in to temptation and then change your mind? No, I think free will requires that one can reject the coin without first accepting it. Such an act would require a definitive renouncement of all the coin offers. In the past, that has only been accomplished by giving up all magic power (to resist the temptation of power one must relinquish all power). Harry, however, managed to do it by tempting the temptress.

227
DF Reference Collection / Re: Questions
« on: March 14, 2012, 08:18:09 PM »
This is a much better way of saying one of my earlier points :)

That was basically my goal. People think differently, so I was trying to restate the idea you expressed in different terms by emphasizing the parallels that can be drawn from Harry's and the Shadow's actions (also JB has expressly drawn a parallet with Lash's sacrifice, so it makes sense that he would have deliberately done the same with the Shadow's actions).

228
DF Reference Collection / Re: Questions
« on: March 14, 2012, 07:26:06 PM »
Ok back to the consequenses of the prison.  This distinction might be subtle, but I don't think Lasciel's Shadow was weakened by the prison so much as she became very constrained in what options she had for influencing Harry, but that those options expanded as she managed to corrupt him.  Origionally I think it likely that her only tool of corruption available was to make Hellfire available to his subconcious.  However, it was not until the events of BR that he was in a situation stressfull enough that his subconcious actually used it.  This usage is what finally opened him up to her communing with his subconcious.

If I may lend my support, I'd like to point out that Harry's circle was a conscious act of rejection but as Michael (or was Uriel) pointed out, subconsciously Harry wasn't ready to completly give up the temptation, which is why he kept the coin buried instead of turning it over.

From this, we correctly conclude the shadow could not openly defy Harry's act of free will (sealing the coin), but as Harry subconsciously wanted the coin to be available, the Shadow could make Hellfire available to his subconscious. Then, when Harry subconsciouslly used Hellfire, his subconscious became open to temptation. When Harry consciously used Hellfire, his conscious became open to temptation.

229
DF Reference Collection / Re: What has Harry endured?
« on: February 14, 2012, 07:13:56 PM »
Storm Front
Persecution by Morgan

Dead Beat
Forced to succumb to blackmail to save Murphy's job - which she eventually loses anyway.
Meets a nice girl, Shiela, who turns out to be not so nice.
Lengthy exposure to Polka
Conscritped into the Wardens (more responsibility) without getting a sword

Proven Guilty
Has to resist taking advantage of Molly

White Knight
Accused and/or not trusted by the minor practitioners.

Small Favor
Forced to help Marcone
"Failure to save Ivy" should read: Used as bait to capture and torture Ivy - twice (first to get her to Chicago then to get her to drop her veil).

Turn Coat
Suffers the "pleasure" of white vampire saliva.

Changes
Persecution by Rudolph
Loses precious time in the Erlking domain, severely hampering his plans
Forced to murder the previous WK to take the mantle and is subsequentlly put on display throughout the NN.
Turned into a dog (judging by Mouse's reaction, that wasn't a pleasant experience; also, it broke a Law of Magic)
Finally gets a date with Murphy, only to have it shot out of his hands.
   
Other
Forced to hide his relationship with Thomas
Warm Beer (although personally, Mac is right)
Humiliation of being terrible with Latin

230
DF Reference Collection / Re: A Fallen scorned (GS spoilers)
« on: December 09, 2011, 09:32:29 PM »
If Lasciel is really miffed at this upstart mortal who thinks he can not only defy her, but can actually turn her shadow away from her, then she is going to want to make him suffer for a good long time.

Not only does the upstart think he can defy her, he did. Harry might be the first person to ever cast off the shadow of a Fallen and he is almost certainly the first to ever cast off Lasciel's shadow and to reject the coin. Lasciel wants to nullify that victory as soon as possible.

Lasciel is probably uncertain how many more opportunities she will have to influence Harry and terrified that Harry might outmaneuver her again. I don't think Lasciel would risk the consequences of hatching long-run plans, she would look for the earliest and best opportunity to claim victory. Manipulating his suicide was probably the safest plan she could hatch to restore her pride; she can't risk failure a second time.

231
DF Reference Collection / Re: Harry Dresden, Most Wanted [GS Spoils]
« on: November 11, 2011, 06:45:48 PM »
As for the House of M, Mab probably wouldn't have much authority in the mortal world, nor would she see the need;

Yeah, I see her response being, "You have a problem with the local authorities? Well, deal with it. I can't have my Winter Knight incapacitated." If Harry gets locked up, she'll probably just pluck him out of prison into the Nevernever, and then he'll have to deal with being a fugitive. He'd end up living mostly in the Nevernever and/or Demonreach.

Honestly, I think Tilly will be in charge of the investigation so Harry will be okay. He can even tell the truth. "I was shot, fell into the lake and woke up on an island alive, but in a great deal of pain. That's probably all you want to put in the official report, but if you must know, it turns out I was getting CPR from a faerie queen for 6 months until my soul could return to my body."

232
DF Reference Collection / Re: Harry Dresden, Most Wanted [GS Spoils]
« on: November 11, 2011, 12:48:02 AM »
That's probably a similar list as the things in Marcone's file, and yet the cops haven't been able to touch him. The problem is, the cops can't tie him to a crime on any particular issue, and you can't charge someone with "he's involved in a bunch of things and has to have done something illegal at some point."

The recent actions will likely be explained as an attempt on his life (DNA on the boat will show it was Harry's), so Harry will just need a story as to where he was hiding and how he recovered over the past 6 months.

Oh, and I'm pretty sure there is an FBI agent that recently started to believe in magic and vampires. He might help keep Harry protected from too much digging.

233
Luccio seems to be talking about only a part of Maggie Sr.'s life, the part when Luccio knew her. The stories seem completely compatible.

Maggie Sr. started out as an idealist, who was resistant to the White Council and pushy for change (This is the only part of Maggie's life that Luccio is talking about -- pre-renegade/Warlock). When Maggie realized she couldn't change the White Council directly, she probably started looking for allies elsewhere, establishing or joining some kind of Grey Council. Her efforts took her farther down the wrong-path, and the Grey Council turned Black. At some point, Maggie met Malcolm, realized she was becoming or had become a monster, and started trying to make amends. These latter events are the parts of Maggie's life discussed by others.

I don't think Luccio had any reason in the context of that particular conversation to mention "Oh by the way, after your Mom discovered she couldn't change the WC, she went psycho and we had to put a death sentence on her." In fact, I think it would have been rather insulting to Harry, because it would have been suggesting he was headed down the same path.

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