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Messages - huangjimmy108

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DF Spoilers / Re: Unexpected Power Ups Following Battle Ground

« on: August 08, 2020, 04:51:54 AM »

Quote from: EBRIEN on August 03, 2020, 09:47:26 PM

I love Toot getting a power up!

Here's a thought: With all the mortal world finding out about the supernatural world, wouldn't all those involved get a power up? Doesn't their power increase or decrease depending on belief?

Toot's the man!

Cheers!

Brien

As far as I know, belief does not grant power. It does however allow a supernatural being to act more freely in the mortal realm, which technically does indeed improve one's power level in a sense. Uriel can blow up galaxies, but he can't wield that level of power over the mortal realm for example.

Let's say that Mab have 1000 power level and Ethniu has 10,000 power level. If Ethniu takes Mab on in Arctis'tor, Mab could probably perform the power level of 5000 while Ethniu will be supressed to may be 3000 or so. Vice versa will happened if Mab dare to take Ethniu on in her seat of power.

Battles in the material plain however is different. No divinity has the freedom to unleash all of their power in this little sandbox. Every power above the mortal level is restricted in some way and belief is one of those restriction. Purpose, duty and choices of certain mortals may allow certain divinity to unleash more power or get limited in some way. If Mab could catch someone under a deal for example, she could do a lot more, and if a KoTC fail his or her purpose, TWG cannot support them.

This is important because technically Ethniu should not be able to act so rampantly in the mortal plain. Perhaps the Baylor's eye is part of the reason why she could unleash that much power so freely in the mortal plain, but if the old rules still hold, even Ethniu must be restricted in some way or she must have a weakness like a fae's alergy to cold iron. Well, unless Ethniu is infected. Nemesis has been shown to be able to break such restrictions. Nemesis is able to allow Maeve to lie for example, but if that is the case Harry the starborn may be able to do something.

Another possibility, a proto god is basically exempt from such restriction to begin with. Which probably explain why TWG banish most of them to the outer gates while the rest that remains in this universe is detain in demonreach. Proto gods simply does not fit with the current balance

DF Spoilers / Re: Is Butcher changing the rules?

« on: July 27, 2020, 03:02:36 AM »

Quote from: Yuillegan on July 20, 2020, 02:10:13 AM

So way back when we learn there are three types of beings:
1. The purely spiritual (demons)
2. The purely physical (Vampires)
3. The combined sort - Archangels, Loup-Garou etc.

What is interesting is that this hardly covers beings who exist in both worlds (like Faeries) or the fact that nearly every being has some sort of spiritual presence. In fact, I can't think of one being that hasn't so far.

The way Harry describes the third group is beings of significant weight, they can manifest real (not merely ectoplasmic) bodies.

So previously, Outsiders and Angels were in group three.

Yet in Peace Talks, he basically describes Outsiders as creating ectoplasmic bodies which is what makes them hard to come at. Yet that didn't seem an issue with Demons in previous books. More than that, when has any Outsider in the series turned to ectoplasm upon death?

Angels, on the other hand, seem almost purely spiritual. Only Uriel has actually seemed physical. The Denarian Fallen even only ever manifest through their hosts.

Naagloshii seem in category 3, as does beings like Ethniu. Ghosts etc seem group 1. Mab should be group 3, along with the rest of Faerie but it isn't clear why their bodies don't disappear on death. This is one of those bigger mysteries that Jim seems intent not answering (as someone asked for clarification on this and got none).

Mortals, Bigfoots, Vampires etc should be in group 2. White and Black leave corpses, but Reds I believe melt somewhat. Svartalves do leave corpses (hence Austri).

So which rules do these beings subscribe to and why suddenly do some beings seem inconsistent?

Since book 10, it is already been shown that faeries are rather special. Those grufs leave corpses. So we can say that FM harry just gave generalize explanations and there are grey areas which Harry himself does not understand at the time or he just gloss over during the explanation. But this should not surprise us, the faerie realm, as the closest nevernever realm to the mortal world, are probably groups of supernatural being most compatible with the mortal world while still being part of the NN itself.

The spartalf and the Grendelkin aka the giant race like river shoulders seem to me to be a native of the mortal world similar to vanilla humans and wizardkind. They probably not part of the NN at all. So I do not think they fall to the 3 groups Harry explain during book 2. He was talking about spiritual being from the NN after all, not the native supernatual creatures of the material realm.

With the exception of the black court: Vampires, changelings and halflings are in the same group, which again not part of the 3 groups in my opinion. They are transformed humans or offspring of human and NN beings. Whampires can cross a circle for example, even though they have a demon inside. Rampires probably can't cross a circle if they go full vamp, but a rampire who has not killed before, like Susan for example, can cross a circle. BC vamps are practically zombies, so they fall into the 2nd group mentioned in FM.

The Denarians are another special case. The fact that 3 holy swords are specifically there to counter them show that the Denarians does not fall into the normal group. They are rule violators aka cheaters, and thus they have extra advantages. Skinwalkers like the Nagloshi and Goodman grey are most likely rule violators as well. They are being who due to some reason find a way to cheat the rules of the world. Even so they have to pay a price. Denarians are balanced by the KoTC. The Nagloshi cannot leave his natural habitat for long and Goodman grey has to pay rent. Also rule enforcers like Angels don't like them.

And then we have mantle holders like Mab, Molly, Vadderung and Harry for example. They also operate under different rules and has their own kind of restrictions.
Outsiders probably works under another set of rules. The fact that they can only be summon by a mortal wizard is already a restriction in itself. A restriction not suffered by your average demon from the NN. Book 8 show us that fobofages can be sent from the NN to the material plain and I believe that normal demons from the NN can be sent as well. Outsiders can't do this. They have to be summoned, by a wizard, which meant that non wizard but native magic users for example the spartalfs and the grendelkind cannot summon outsiders but they can summon demons.

So in conclusion, the rules does not change. It is just Harry is an unreliable narator. However JB did leave clues here and there throughout the series.

DF Spoilers / Re: Peace Talks - What did you like? What didn't you like? What were you expecting?

« on: July 24, 2020, 10:12:07 AM »

Quote from: Snark Knight on July 24, 2020, 04:12:50 AM

I'm not expecting an answer in part 1 of 2. I do find it odd that Harry didn't even start laying any groundwork to an investigation. He is a private detective, after all.

Because saving Thomas is more important to Harry compare to knowing who is behind it. Harry himself notice that what happened to Thomas is a distraction, which meant trying to investigate is exactly what the enemy wanted Harry to do.

Harry also has task from Mab and from the white council which occupy his time and attention in which failure could mean his death. Both rationally and emotionally, Harry's action to leave the mystery behind and focus on the rescue is a correct response in my opinion. Harry simply don't have the time and resources to investigate the matter, not even just a preliminary one. There are more important and urgent issue demanding his attention. As long as Thomas is still alive, Harry could investigate later.

DF Spoilers / Re: Murphy

« on: July 24, 2020, 03:15:54 AM »

Quote from: Mira on July 24, 2020, 02:48:55 AM

Then maybe she should sit this one out if what you say is true.. Because her first response to Harry when he suggested it, was paraphrasing that she was capable "of handling herself." Well, if she is, then lending her wisdom and protective instincts to the paranet would be perfect.

Indeed, She could choose to sit this one out. She could, not she should. As an officer, she should serve and protect. Even if the job is hard, even if the scope is somewhat above her pay grade, she is oblige to do it. Now she is not an officer. She is no longer oblige to do something, it is no longer her duty. But if she chooce to do so, it is something else entirely. "Free will" is a TWG's guaranteed right, after all.
The fact of the matter is, Murphy no longer choose to prioritize other people. The paranet and other people would have to come second or even third. Harry is now first for her, and she has the right and in full position to make that choice.

The most important thing for her now is Harry. Staying by Harry side is her will, and since there is no longer any duty, concern or restriction upon her anymore, well, she is free.

DF Spoilers / Re: Murphy

« on: July 24, 2020, 01:32:40 AM »

Quote from: Arjan on July 23, 2020, 04:04:35 PM

There is no reason to think she gets others killed besides herself. Not if we look at everything that happened until now. She handled things she could handle and Harry was not protecting her more than normal. Probably less than normal. She used her brain. Her bringing danger to other people than herself is not shown in the text once.

Besides, how do you know if something could get someone killed and another thing would not? This is war, not a simulation game. We also knowthe the result of taking more responsibility than your power could handle. That is arrogance of the highest degree. Even Harry, a wizard with far greater power than most, has been warned by Michael in SG not to take such a burden on himself. How could we expect Murphy to carry the same burden?

Power equal responsibility. The problem is, Murphy has very little power to begin with. and now that she is no longer an officer and injured to boot, she has even less. This meant that she has very little responsibility. Almost none in fact. It is not fair to place the safety of the entire paranet or any other person upon her. She might carry this burden in the past. She once a officer of the law and she was once a capable fighter, but that is no more.

She is no longer an officer. No longer a KoTC candidate. No need to keep the holy swords safe. She is free to do what she wants to do now. All of ther bonds is gone. No duty, no concern, only her love remains.

PS: This is a single minded Murphy with all limiters off...
Why do I get the chills when I wrote this?
Must be just my imagination.

DF Spoilers / Re: Peace talks spoilers: Thomas... Metamorphosis???

« on: July 24, 2020, 01:13:10 AM »

Quote from: Conspiracy Theorist on July 23, 2020, 10:48:58 PM

Question: Can Thomas fed upon Ethniu?

Never eat an energy field larger than your head.

Yeah, normally it shouldn't be possible. However, if Ethniu is suppressed by Harry and demonreach, could she be weakened enough for Thomas to fed upon?

The point is I want to know weather Ethiu's life force is theoretically compatible as food for a whampire demon. Humans can't eat iron ingots no matter what, while potatos, though poisonous, can be eaten under the right process.

I am wandering if Ethniu can be processed.

DF Spoilers / Re: Murphy

« on: July 23, 2020, 03:32:06 AM »

Quote from: Mira on July 22, 2020, 12:26:24 PM

Peace Talks page 315

This is why I started this thread in the first place, that bit sticks out to me. While the answer from Harry most likely would be, no. It would be just as stupid and egocentric if he did, even though as a wizard he has a lot more tools even injured than she does, a mere vanilla mortal. Harry goes on to
acknowledge that there is no way he can stop her, that is who she is, but sadly most likely it will also get her killed. Now maybe her death will make a difference, maybe there will be some miracle she will get cured and kick ass or she will ride off to the tune of the Ride of the Valkyrie from the Ring Cycle after she becomes a bloody grease spot.. Or maybe not so much.. So if the paranet gets wiped out because when the chips were down no one was there for them, it's okay because well, Murphy didn't want to sit it out.. Nor is there shame in standing a post, with her skills considering her current limitations, where she can do the most good..
In this case, yes, she is... The answer is against what is coming? No, she cannot handle herself, from her questions to Harry she has no clue. She cannot be reasoned with, Harry knows this, and now has the added weight of knowing he is going to lose her either way..

Harry's abilities is a non issue here. Even if Harry becomes a vanilla and he is injured, it is likely that Harry will still choose to go to battle himself regardless. Which is the same as Murphy's choice. The guy just don't know how to give up. You need to cripple him or put Harry into a coma if you want him to stop going.

We are facing a supernatural army led by a freaking Titan here. If a disaster that could wiped out the paranet really appears, Murphy being there will just be buying soysauce. Not much better than if she went with Harry anyway. Besides, facing the likes of Ethniu, Murphy is an ant and Harry is just a slightly bigger ant. The enemy is so strong, the power difference between Harry and Murphy becomes insignificant.

Things are so chaotic right now, nobody could be certain what is the right choice. If your luck is bad, any road could end up in death.

Under such circumstances, following your heart and doing what you really want is not a bad choice at all. At least one won't die in regret afterwards even if things end up in tragedy. Besides, who knows? Miracle could happened.

DF Spoilers / Re: Peace talks spoilers: Thomas... Metamorphosis???

« on: July 23, 2020, 03:17:14 AM »

Question: Can Thomas fed upon Ethniu?

DF Spoilers / Re: Murphy

« on: July 22, 2020, 08:43:17 AM »

Quote from: Arjan on July 22, 2020, 07:15:50 AM

Some choices are not right or wrong, they are based on different priorities and risk acceptance.

You also need Luck or pray for TWG's blessings. If your luck is rotten any choice would just end in tears. especially these days.

Things has gone so bad, at this rate, any intelligence, logic, power, skill or talent is not as practical as luck. As for TWG's blessing, perhaps TWG would have an easier time helping a mortal if that mortal based their choices on positive things like love, courage and hope instead of making choice based on paranoya, fear and despair.

DF Spoilers / Re: Peace talks spoilers: Thomas... Metamorphosis???

« on: July 22, 2020, 06:50:05 AM »

Quote from: pcpoet on July 22, 2020, 06:41:03 AM

here is another thought about butters and the sword. sevral individuals have become possessed by the outsiders what if the sword could be used to remove those influences.

I am more hopeful about Harry's starborn talent to achieve such a thing rather than the holy sword. Though Harry need to enter the mind of an infected person or being to do so which probably breaks the 4th law if it is done to fellow humans.

DF Spoilers / Re: Murphy

« on: July 22, 2020, 06:11:18 AM »

Quote from: Mira on July 19, 2020, 11:14:08 AM

Okay, the big thing about Murphy has always been what a smart fighter she is. That her advice
to Harry has always been smart, she is called a warrior.. Well, maybe not so much..

In Skin Game she went by her rules and not those of the Sword, broke it and got herself pretty
broken. Then as now, perhaps love has fried her brain a bit? What I am talking about is on
the final couple of pages of Peace Talks on the boat. She is in so much pain she says she can
hardly move. Harry tells her that a good warrior knows when it is best to avoid a fight. He suggests
that there are a group of people, the paranetters who are going to be very scared and need wise
council and protecting, that they need her. She objects to that says she won't sit out this fight, and insists that she is going to join him in the fighting. Harry doesn't argue the point, because he knows he cannot change her.. However what she is doing isn't really brave, it certainly isn't smart, it is very selfish and could get her killed, more to the point get Harry killed because he now cannot fully concentrate on the enemy, he has to worry about her.. Oh I know the argument, Murphy has always taken care of herself and Harry too.. But now the odds are that she cannot and there are people who do need her, especially when things get really hairy. So this kills the idea that if she never improves physically she will be happy running the show from behind a desk. No, she won't. She is good at
fighting, and perhaps it is simply a matter of her that love has once again addled her brain, but she is no warrior, and she is very selfish.. This is may be heavy foreshadowing of her doom..

Selfish? Idiotic? Can get her killed? Hell yes. The question is what wouldn't?

Honestly speaking, Murphy is tied to Harry now. If Harry goes down for some reason I doubt Murphy could survive for long. Well. unless she dug a hole at demonreach island and hide there for all her life. Which is probably is worse than death for her.

Anyway, this is her choice and I can't even really say that it is wrong. You see, Harry's idea to just stash Murphy in demonreach for her safety is exactly the kind of choice motivated by the same mentality of Ebenezar Mckoy. The same mentality Harry openly despise in front of his own grandfather. Harry is using double standard here, and I can't blame him much.

It is the mentality that make Susan hide Maggi's birth from Harry. The same mentality which made Ebenezar abandoned Harry in an orphanage after his father's death. The same mentality which made Harry choose to commit suicide in changes and so on. It is what cause EB anger when he saw Maggi living with Harry openly.

Is EB wrong? Honestly, I don't know. I do know that Harry has no stone to throw against Murphy when she choose to go with Harry to battle despite of her injuries. Why? Because under the same circumstances, Harry would have made the same choice. Murphy ask Harry the same question and Harry has no answer. Those two are the same kind of person.

DF Spoilers / Re: Intention vs natural operation

« on: July 22, 2020, 03:47:50 AM »

Quote from: Yuillegan on July 20, 2020, 01:40:13 AM

Butcher slips in a hint about magic and will just as the Cornerhounds appear.

Ebeneezer says to Harry that fire is best for defeating them, but natural fire works just fine. Harry asks what difference is it where the fire comes from, and Eb says he hasn't got time to give him a lecture in intention versus the natural operation of the universe. He says that it mostly has to do with the fact that if a Wizard uses magic the Outsider can slip most of the punch. This makes sense when we consider how He Who Walks Behind was defeated, and the fact the Demonreach contains a banefire to defeat the Immortals.

My WAG is that while mortal will is strong, because you are contending against such powerful beings they often are hiding behind their avatar and therefore the attack doesn't actually attack the being itself. It may also be to do with being so alien it is hard for the human mind to comprehend and engage with them. I suspect that when natural elements are used i.e. the normal energy and matter of the created universe, you are actually utilising the power and intent of TWG. After all, if TWG is the Creator of the All then it stands to reason that everything that exists in the "natural" universe is created with it's intent. Which is obviously so much stronger than what mere mortals can do (constrained as they are).

In Xianxia terms, this is the difference between using magic normally and understanding the laws. I wander if wizards could grow in skill to the point that they can utilize the laws of the universe as their weapons. Can Harry for example, concentrate natural sunlight through magic and using the high intensity and heat of the sun, thereby nullifying those creatures who are immune to magic? Or even better, can Harry simulate a mini nuclear explosion with magic? Of course Harry does knot know anything about nuclear physics, but can a wizard who understand physics do such a thing?

To a certain extent, EB himself has done this. Rather than conjuring a massive forzare spell and smash Ortega with it, EB dragged down a satelite from orbit. No anti-magic defenses could nullify that. Rather than burning the enemy with a fuego spell, better to disturb a nearby volcano and direct the wrath of nature at them.

DF Spoilers / Re: Peace Talks - What did you like? What didn't you like? What were you expecting?

« on: July 22, 2020, 03:22:46 AM »

PT is not bad, it is just not enough. We are used to eat a full meal. Each book of JB always covered all the aspect and tied all loose ends accept for those JB deliberately left hanging on purpose. Now we are only served half a plate of food with all those loose end unexplain.

Of course we feel there are too much recap of previous books. In the first place, JB has left this series hanging for 6 years instead for just 1 year like previous books, so he need a bit of a summary. Secondly this is in fact only half a book. Battleground is bound not to have so many recap, because all the recap is already done in PT. If the 2 books is combine into one, the percentage of the recap will drop a lot.

Of course we don't have answers about Thomas. Again, this is only half a book. I can also understand why the spartalf don't questioned Thomas. Firstly, it does not matter much. Like it or not, Thomas has drew blood and retribution is unavoidable. Secondly, it is a stressful time. All of the powers that be is in Chicago and Thomas's matter will not escape their eyes. Under such a premise the spartalf cannot afford to show any weakness. Fellow accord members they may be, but they are all predators just the same. Showing all the other powers the ruthless and vicious side of the spartalf is more important than anything at the moment, otherwise the spartalf as a nation will lose their prestige. This is the same reason why in book 11, the white council have to kill Donald Morgan even if they know that Morgan is mostly innocent. The sacrifice is nescesary so that other powers don't look at the council as prey. Of course the spartalf know that there is more behind the scene, but the urgency of the matter does not allow them to do anything else. Why do you think the spartalf agree to transfer Thomas to the BFF building? Don't they know that it will make it easier for Lara and Harry to rescue him? They obviously know, but they did it anyway. It is politics. The spartalf cannot show weakness, but they also don't want a war with the white court vampires either. Once Lara ask Harry to introduce her to the spartalf, the spartalf now has a ladder to step down without showing weakness. If Lara manage to make Thomas disappear without a trace, they have to focus on finding Thomas first before any war can happened. The spartalf can open one eye and close another. Big problems becomes small problems and small problems becomes no problem. Vadderung and Farofax attitude said it all. They obviously seen Harry and Lara carry Thomas out breaking who knows how many rules of hospitality and unceli accords, as old powers Vadderung and faro ought to be angry, but did they say anything?

DF Spoilers / Re: Battle Ground Resources [Peace Talks Spoilers]

« on: July 17, 2020, 11:28:23 PM »

Quote from: Arjan on July 17, 2020, 11:26:08 AM

That would avoid the unfinished feeling I have now but then the publisher would probably put pressure to keep it shorter and we would have missed some material. Now he probably added some things.

Imagine you read book 5 and stopping just after the duel between Harry and Ortega is done. That is what it feel like to me. This book is suppose to be a single volume with dual storyline running in tandom. Similar to book 5 and book 6, only we got cut off after the end of single storyline leaving the second hanging.

DF Spoilers / Peace talks spoilers: Thomas... Metamorphosis???

« on: July 17, 2020, 06:49:31 AM »

Why do I feel that what happened to Thomas in book 16 is Thomas's metamorphosis?

Book 12 and book13 is Harry's metamorphosis. Your friendly neighbourhood wizard private investigator is gone, replace with arcane winter knight Harry.

I feel Thomas is going through the same process. The chance that Thomas taking up the sword of love has risen from about 30% to about 80% if my guts can be trusted.

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