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Messages - Pbartender

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16
DFRPG / Re: DFRPG In Other Time Periods?
« on: April 28, 2012, 04:43:51 PM »
No, we're not on the same page.

Oh, stop it...  Now you're just being obstinate.  I agree with practically everything you said in your previous post.

See, if you have obvious Claws and they cause trouble in a pat-down, then that's a compel. So retractable-ness isn't actually useful.

How can it possibly be a compel, without a related aspect?

17
DFRPG / Re: DFRPG In Other Time Periods?
« on: April 28, 2012, 12:54:23 PM »
You can't hide a sword during a full search.

Agreed.  That's what I was getting at with the "hiding a small object in plain sight"...  A pat-down or a reasonably competent search turns all of your pockets, clothing and carrying cases into "plain sight", at least by my reasoning, it does.  You might be able to sneak a switch-blade past that, but not a sword.

Retractable claws would give you a chance to get the equivalent of a sword past a pat-down, or a full search.  It's a very situational benefit, but a concrete one.

But if you're carrying a weapon while walking down the street and you come across someone who tries to guess whether you're armed, you can use your Deceit. That's not a contrived scenario:

Agreed.  And sometimes they don't even have to be trying to guess... maybe a not-quite-right-detail just happens to catch the eye of an observant passer by.

You can also BS your way past a search, but that's probably a different trapping.

Agreed.  You're talking your way out of it, rather than trying to physically hide something.

Though distracting someone properly could mess up a patdown.


Agreed...  Invoking an aspect or using a complementary skill would cover that quite nicely.

They even mention that as a possibility in YS IIRC. Can't find it though, it was something about DISTRACTING BEAUTY. Sometimes I wish I had a searchable PDF, then I remember I could get one free and realize I can't be bothered.

YS20...  They use one of two sample aspects called "Always Armed" or "Distracting Beauty" along with a fate point to make a declaration that the character is armed, after they've already been searched.  A completely different, but absolutely nifty way of getting around searches.

PS: Personally, I'd say that a roll of 17 or so on Deceit could conceal an aircraft carrier. You just need to make sure that everyone looks in the exact opposite direction. Which is practically impossible, but only practically.

Yeah, see that's the sort of slippery slope I'm trying to avoid by using a little bit of common sense.  Sure, there's ways to hide truly immense things, but It reminds me of times playing D20 games, when a player would say something like, "Ha!  With all the extra bonuses, I just rolled a 67 to hide that aircraft carrier!"  And when you'd try to get them to explain how they hid it, they'd reply, "I dunno...  I rolled a 67."

I have no problem letting player-characters do extraordinary things, so long as they can come up with a reasonable (reasonable for the game, setting and genre, at least) explanation of how they're doing it...  That gets them a chance to try, at least.

I think we're mostly on the same page here...  We were just talking past each other.

18
DFRPG / Re: DFRPG In Other Time Periods?
« on: April 27, 2012, 01:14:39 PM »
And there do exist people in the world who don't search duffel bags for weapons.

Right.  In fact, the vast majority of people in the world aren't going to stop you on the sidewalk and search your duffel bag for weapons.  This falls under the "you don't need to roll for it" guideline as presented under the heading "TAKING ACTION" on YS192.

I'm talking about the situations in which you actually do have to use the skill:  "...an interesting challenge with meaningful consequences."  Namely, trying to sneak weapons past those people who WILL search you for weapons.

Suggest you read the trapping again, it doesn't work that way. It can hide small objects in plain sight, and it can be used to oppose any attempt to see something you've hidden.

I've read it.  I've reread it.  You aren't telling me anything I didn't read the first time.  So, please explain to me how it doesn't work that way.  Because you simply stating it isn't really convincing me.

Explain to me how a character sneaks a sword into a nightclub, for example, when there's a bouncer at the door patting people down before they can go in.

19
DFRPG / Re: DFRPG In Other Time Periods?
« on: April 26, 2012, 12:50:53 PM »
(Oh, and you can definitely use Deceit to hide a weapon: 2 weapon. This is not even a question, it's certain.)

You must have a very different definition of "hiding small objects...  ...in plain sight" than I do. 

You can feasibly hide any object, but you can't really hide a sword or a baseball bat or an semi-automatic .45 in your jacket pocket without the bouncer finding it when he frisks you (or casually glances at you, for that matter). 

Sure, Harry and Michael routinely "hide" their staff and sword, respectively, by stuffing them into a big duffel bag, but they'd never get that past Marcone's bodyguards...  not even by accepting a compel.  It doesn't have to be a compel...  It's as simple as the bouncer saying, "Sorry, you can't come in here with weapons," or "Hey, I'll need to look inside that duffel bag."

In fact, it SHOULDN'T be a compel, because simply carrying a weapon doesn't give the character an aspect to compel, unless some other character takes the trouble to generate that aspect using an appropriate action.

20
DFRPG / Re: DFRPG In Other Time Periods?
« on: April 25, 2012, 01:08:24 PM »
I've just started a campaign set in the 12th century. We've started out in Frankfurt, Germany and I was wondering if anyone had any particular ideas for that?

You might find this website useful...

Note that you can click on the different quadrants of the map to zoom in and get more detail.  If you sign up as a member of the site (it's free), you can download high-resolution copies of the maps.

21
DFRPG / Re: DFRPG In Other Time Periods?
« on: April 25, 2012, 01:04:00 PM »
Retractable-ness has no mechanical value.

Sure it does.  The mechanical value is that it allows you to use the Deceit skill to hide a Weapon:2 weapon, when you ordinarily can't...  The mechanical value is that the character will still be armed (or more heavily armed) in situations where the other characters might not be.

22
DFRPG / Re: DFRPG In Other Time Periods?
« on: April 24, 2012, 04:52:23 PM »
The only other option is to introduce another, smaller, (perhaps narrative) drawback of the same calibur.

This got me thinking...  What if (either implicitly or explicitly) it took a supplemental action to extend or retract the claws, just like drawing or sheathing a weapon?

So, you would be, in effect, spending 1 refresh for a sword that can't be disarmed, is easily concealed, and that uses your Fists skill instead of Weapons.

23
DFRPG / Re: DFRPG In Other Time Periods?
« on: April 19, 2012, 01:14:33 PM »
Haha, oh; cool.  I haven't tried it.  Stop in to the Billy's Game Den forum after you play a couple times and tell us what you/they think of it?

As a house rule, though, we're allowing DFRPG powers (with DM permission) to emulate certain character types.  I've got a "Moreau" human-bear mutant character with Inhuman Strength and Claws, and a slightly psychic character with Inhuman Recovery and Incite Emotion (Fear).

24
DFRPG / Re: DFRPG In Other Time Periods?
« on: April 18, 2012, 07:35:46 PM »
So, it turns out my players want a Sci-fi game, instead of a pirate game...  We're playing Starblazer Adventures, instead.

25
DFRPG / Re: DFRPG In Other Time Periods?
« on: April 17, 2012, 01:37:15 PM »
As for the whole "compels are not bad" thing, I think this goes back to the discussion we've had elsewhere about how other players, many of them, don't just consider the raw mechanics and how many fate points you can get.

Do I want a fate point? Yes. But do I also want to be able to save the damsel/stop the evil wizard/not blow my cool and have to give up a powerful artifact in recompense? Also yes.

Not every compel is something the character or the player wants. That's why the game bribes you with a fate point for it, and why there's an option to buy out of it.

If you want to talk raw mechanics though, go back to the example previously: Wolverine and Sabertooth want to get through somewhere unnoticed. Wolverine's claws are retractable, so he faces no compel. Sabertooth's, however, don't retract, so he gets compelled. As mentioned, he doesn't want to be noticed, so he buys off the compel. Which means if they started from the same total, he's a fate point behind Wolverine for the same result.

Compels aren't a bad thing, but they're not always what the player wants either. They can cost Fate Points just as much as they're a source of Fate Points.

Your signature amuses me.   ;D   ;)

26
DFRPG / Re: DFRPG In Other Time Periods?
« on: April 17, 2012, 01:22:51 PM »
An interesting thing to notice...

Claws, at -1 Refresh, gives you a built-in Weapon:2 with "Fists" that is obvious.

Inhuman Strength, at -2 Refresh, gives you a built-in Weapon:2 with "Fists" that is not obvious, a +3 to Might when breaking or lifting objects, a +1 to Might when grappling, automatic 2 Stress damage as a supplemental action when grappling, and a bonus when using Might to modify rolls.

Granted the two of them can stack, but holy cow...  Inhuman Strength gives you a lot of bonus goodies for that extra -1 Refresh.

In regards to modifying powers, I actually agree with your conclusions.  Just not with your reasons.  The book explicitly supports it and the authors have supported it...all else is gravy.

If fact, they devote more than two pages to guidelines on modifying stunts and powers or building new ones...  YS147-149

Plus the book explicitly states that the Stunts and Powers listed in the book are just examples that can be used as is or as templates for your stunts and powers.  To wit:

"The stunts provided here are examples. We’re giving just a few for each skill but, as indicated above, this is absolutely not intended to be a comprehensive list. When you don’t find something here that suits you, use the guidelines above (page 147) to grow your own."  -YS149

So, for example, one might consider a "Retractable Claws" Power at -1 Refresh, that only gives your "Fists" Weapon:1, but is concealable until used.

27
DFRPG / Re: DFRPG In Other Time Periods?
« on: April 15, 2012, 09:36:55 PM »
Creatures that have claws actually have claws.  They don't just hit harder (unless they have supernatural strength, which is provided as a separate power).  Claws as a power was written to be claws.

Not exactly...  Reread the power. 

"You have claws, fangs, or other natural weapons that let you add damage when attacking with your “bare” hands."  -YS162

"You have claws (or something similar) which act as Weapon:2 for your Fists attacks." -YS162

"Could you take Claws multiple times so you have, say, claws AND fangs?" -YS162 [Harry's comment at the bottom of the page.]

It doesn't have to be claws, really, just anything that makes your natural attacks -- "Fists" -- more powerful.  It could be claws, fangs, spines, horns, antlers, hooves, a stinger on a tail, an ankle spur, razor-like bone ridges, or unusually hard knuckles.

It just has to be something that's A) natural, rather than supernatural, and B) obvious to the casual observer.

28
DFRPG / Re: DFRPG In Other Time Periods?
« on: March 23, 2012, 04:40:11 PM »
Yeah, mechanics-wise, you could use the FATE rules for anything.

Yep, and it's pretty easy to borrow from other FATE systems to make any changes you need.  For example...

Since sailing ships would be so integral and important to a Pirates! game, I'm thinking of borrowing the rules for building spaceships as "characters" from Starblazer Adventures, and adapting them for sailing ships as an add-on house rule.  I'm also planning on adding in the rules for minions and companions from SotC.

29
DFRPG / Re: DFRPG In Other Time Periods?
« on: March 23, 2012, 03:36:37 PM »
Of course you don't have to. My point was that the further away you go from the way the game is described in the books, the more stuff you have to figure out by yourself. At some point the game can cease to be Dresden Files and become another FATE variant. So if I think about DFRPG in other time periods, I focus first on settings that produce something that is as close to DFRPG as possible except for the time period. What is it after all that makes a game Dresden Files? The mechanics? The genre? The setting?

The Title.

Really, you can play any gerne-setting (Dresden Files, in this case) using practically any game system.  Some are going to be a lot more work than others to convert appropriately, and, as you suggest, some will simply suit the setting-genre better than others.

But, my plan is to play Dresden Files in a different time...  the same genre-setting slightly tweaked for the period.  So, I think it'd be best to use DFRPG similarly slightly tweaked.  Converting DFRPG to a different time period will be less work, I think, than converting a different game to DFRPG.

Anyway, what's got to change?

  • Skills & Stunts Some skills, stunts and trappings won't fit the time period (mostly, anything related to cars and computers, in DFRPG).  A few others may need to be added (notably sailing and ship-related stuff, if I'm going with the Pirate-based game).
  • Hexing Complex electronics don't exist, and so another target for hexing will need to be identified...  Gunpowder and chemical processes?  Early clockworks and other machinery?  Compasses?  Or perhaps it's the classic signs of of the power of witchcraft, like nearby fires burning odd colors, animals spooking in the presence of wizards, milk curdling, etc...
  • Other Incidental Changes There's going to be some other relatively minor changes that are simply based on the change in scenery...  In a pirate game, for example, the list of gear will need to be changed to include muskets, cannons and cutlasses, but it doesn't really affect any mechanics, it is a rather obvious change, and can be handled as you play the game.

Am I missing anything?  It seems that, mechanics-wise at least, there aren't a lot of changes to be made.  Most changes will lie in the historical background and plot.

30
DFRPG / Re: Blocks
« on: March 22, 2012, 07:57:53 PM »
Another question on blocks...  How specific does the block have to be?

Say, for example, in combat you have character who actively using blocks to defend against attacks.  Can he block against more than one attack?... That target different more than one target?...  Or that come from more than one attacker?...

EDIT: Duh...  Never mind.  Just found it on YS211.

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