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Other Jimness => Cinder Spires Spoilers => Topic started by: WonderandAwe on October 05, 2015, 10:08:02 PM

Title: The Spy
Post by: WonderandAwe on October 05, 2015, 10:08:02 PM
My Guess for the Spy

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Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: Second Aristh on October 05, 2015, 10:12:34 PM
I thought it was implied that Cavendish was the spy for Albion.  She was the direct contact for the Auroran forces.
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: WonderandAwe on October 05, 2015, 10:15:22 PM
I assumed she was more of a Rogue Element than the actual Spy.  I could be wrong. 
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: Agravaine on October 06, 2015, 03:19:09 AM
Bayard is a good guess.  Personally, I'm fitting Commodore Bayard for a Lord Nelson suit.
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: MX on October 06, 2015, 04:01:32 AM
I think I favor Rook for this.  He appears to be more of a deal under the table while appearing all spit and polish aboveboard.  Cant get what he wants normally, lowball someone.  That doesn't work, threaten.  That doesn't work, oh well.  Guess I'll have to wait for my Auroran friends to show.

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Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: FrankyMcShanky on October 08, 2015, 03:46:49 AM
Something else to consider that supports the Baynard theory; The attack on Baynard and Grimm near the beginning of the book.  Why would the Silkweavers attack them and potentially blow the Aurorians cover?  Why were they in Hobble Morning, hundreds of miles above Habble Landing?  Was Cavendash trying to take out Baynard (her spy) before he could be compromised?  It's not like she had a reason to be wary of Grimm yet.  She seems like the kind of gal to keep her puppets on a tight leash. 

The only thing that makes me not want to finger Baynard as the spy is that Fenrus seems to trust him.

My theory is that whatever attacked Baynard and Grim in the tunnels wasn't actually Silkweavers but something else and now Grim has some kind of important hoodoo running through his arm.
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: Paladino on October 08, 2015, 12:31:56 PM
Personally, I think Cavendish was the spy as the one who passed information to Olimpia, that dosen't mean there isn't a second spy, someone who passed information to Cavendish so she could send to Olimpia. Baynard is an option, especially if he resents the Spire for the treatment of Grimm. As for Rook, I think he is just a coward.

As for why the silkweavers attacked Grimm and Baynard, it's too random to be sure. Could be that Cavendish sent them to scout/clear the tunnels so the Marine attack on the cristals factories (vataries? don't remember the word used right now). And they just got out of her control with the distance and went feral.  Or it could be a plot so Baynard could take Grimm to the aetherist house and mark it for the marines who tried to kill him.

Too few information to do anything but especulate..
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: Second Aristh on October 08, 2015, 06:51:29 PM
Mirl told Rowl that there had been many reports of cats going missing, that they didn't know what was attacking them.  I'd say that points to silkweaver attacks becoming more and more common as their numbers grew, and Grimm was just unlucky enough for them to choose as a human target.
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: FrankyMcShanky on October 08, 2015, 09:49:20 PM
Quote from: Second Aristh on October 08, 2015, 06:51:29 PM
Mirl told Rowl that there had been many reports of cats going missing, that they didn't know what was attacking them.  I'd say that points to silkweaver attacks becoming more and more common as their numbers grew, and Grimm was just unlucky enough for them to choose as a human target.

They specifically note that those attacks where in the lower hobbles.
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: Second Aristh on October 08, 2015, 10:01:08 PM
Quote from: FrankyMcShanky on October 08, 2015, 09:49:20 PM
They specifically note that those attacks where in the lower hobbles.
Not exactly.  If the silkweaver infestation was centered in Habble Landing, it makes sense that it would take time for attacks of opportunity to spread to the top of the Spire, though.  That seems to be exactly what happened.

Quote from: Aeronaut's Windlass Ch.6
Mirl twitched her ears in an amused flick, but her tone became more serious.  "He says that Longthinker has confirmed the reports of the Silent Paw scouts."
Rowl moved his eyes to the smaller cat.  "The new things in the air shafts?"
Mirl blinker her eyes in affirmation.  "So say the Shadow Tails, and the Quick Claws, and half a dozen other tribes besides them.  Cats have gone missing in other habbles as well--but none have seen what took them."
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: Agravaine on October 09, 2015, 09:45:17 PM
The Silk-weaver attack on Grimm and Beyard happened right after Grimm slapped Rook around and rejected his offer to sell Predator's core crystal.  Upon reflection, I don't think that's coincidence. 

Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: MX on October 10, 2015, 03:32:11 AM
I don't really need a reason to dislike Rook any more, but, yeah.  He's the spy in my mind, just based on his everything else.
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: DFJunkie on October 11, 2015, 03:25:49 AM
Quote from: MX on October 10, 2015, 03:32:11 AM
I don't really need a reason to dislike Rook any more, but, yeah.  He's the spy in my mind, just based on his everything else.

Is Jim that nice?  We already despise Rook, seeing him outed as a spy and losing everything would be deeply enjoyable and satisfying.  That's why I like Beyard for it.  That would hurt Grimm, and Jim seems to take great pleasure in that.
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: Phaeton Seraph on October 11, 2015, 04:13:48 AM
Quote from: FrankyMcShanky on October 08, 2015, 09:49:20 PM
They specifically note that those attacks where in the lower hobbles.

Habbles.

Hobbles are for keeping writers from escaping confinement while you force them to finish writing their book without interruption.
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: Snark Knight on October 11, 2015, 11:23:32 PM
Quote from: DFJunkie on October 11, 2015, 03:25:49 AM
Is Jim that nice?  We already despise Rook, seeing him outed as a spy and losing everything would be deeply enjoyable and satisfying.  That's why I like Beyard for it.  That would hurt Grimm, and Jim seems to take great pleasure in that.

Well, we don't know he's necessarily going to be as harsh on this new set of protagonists as he is on Dresden.
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: Phariah on October 12, 2015, 03:44:06 AM
i do not see another person as the spy. Rook is just an overachieving greedy moron. Beyard is an opportunist most likely but not a bad guy.
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: Dina on October 12, 2015, 04:22:31 AM
I was worried the whole book about
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because I was sure he
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and I really liked him. In fact, he is one of my favorites. But unless we will meet the spy in the next book, I don't see other candidates (well,
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but he seems too stupid)
At first, I thought
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but then the book continued and I don't believe it anymore.
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: Wolfeyes on October 12, 2015, 04:54:54 AM
I don't see Rook for the same reason I didn't peg Langtry for a Black Council spy. Too obvious and it won't have the same impact beyond more enforcement of his negative traits.
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: Dina on October 12, 2015, 05:20:44 AM
Oh, of course, it COULD be
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.
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: Wolfeyes on October 12, 2015, 05:25:20 AM
I could see it being Creedy long before it's Rook.

And I'm not saying that because I hate Creedy. I actually like him? But even Grimm considers the question of how trustworthy he is early on, which would make a subtle hindsight moment if he were the spy.
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: brighellac on October 12, 2015, 09:10:57 AM
Who has just one spy in an area they're about to invade? 

The evil spire seems more competent than the second Bush administration after all.

Please take the second line as the joke it's intended to be...
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: WonderandAwe on October 12, 2015, 03:49:30 PM
Quote from: Dina on October 12, 2015, 05:20:44 AM
Oh, of course, it COULD be
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.

I didn't even consider this!   Hmmm....   

My first choice still stands, but this option interests me.   
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: Snark Knight on October 13, 2015, 02:21:17 PM
Reginal Astor makes a certain amount of sense. He bolted pretty quickly when the air raid siren went off - even lost his own second from the duel. Makes me wonder if he had warning.

And of course, it would make a certain amount of scheming sense for the number two House in the Spire to think they could play the Aurorans against the Spirearch and the Lancasters, and expect to come out on top as head of a puppet government in league with the Aurorans after they win the war.
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: Quantus on October 13, 2015, 03:00:07 PM
Quote from: Snark Knight on October 13, 2015, 02:21:17 PM
Reginal Astor makes a certain amount of sense. He bolted pretty quickly when the air raid siren went off - even lost his own second from the duel. Makes me wonder if he had warning.

And of course, it would make a certain amount of scheming sense for the number two House in the Spire to think they could play the Aurorans against the Spirearch and the Lancasters, and expect to come out on top as head of a puppet government in league with the Aurorans after they win the war.
Im not saying he's not stupid, but it would have been pretty stupid to rise to the proverbial bait of that Duel with Bridget if he knew it was going to go down right in the middle of an Invasion, forcing him to stand out in the open in a place that could get him killed (like it did his 2nd).  He was preoccupied with duels and reputation and the legalities of cat citizenship, which should have been pushed out of his brain if he knew of the impending attack.  Plus, he's a guys who's entire self-worth is based on the social order of the Spire, I dont see why he'd be willing to help tear it all down. 
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: Zaphodess on December 17, 2015, 04:56:17 PM
Neen is one of the spies. That's the whole purpose of the silkweavers. It wasn't about humans, Cavendish used them to press the cats into service or at least to threaten them enough that they stay out of the way.

Neen was the only cat still walking around in Habble Landing.
His dad was not happy with him, but he wasn't in a position to oppose him, that's why he looked at Neen before he said "Send them to the ropes". Wearily. He was gambling that Raul and his humans might be able to survive and report back to the humans. But he knew that it was real risky.


Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: kazimmoinuddin on December 18, 2015, 12:43:18 AM
Any one else think the situation that caused Grimm to be discharged from the navy would be some how involved in the conspiracy, and likely reveal the true spy. I doubt it is co incidence that the two of his fellow officers just happened to be near by the enemy ship. If you can't get a hole in the enemy defenses, make sure that you co opt those you might encounter.
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: Dina on December 21, 2015, 07:05:48 AM
I think it's a distinct posibility but I wouldn't bet on it either  :)
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: Rygar on December 21, 2015, 08:11:11 PM
After learning of Cavendish and the breadth of dreadful skills, I quit believing there was a double agent involved.  Just Cavendish using her certain set of skills to aid the Aurorans.  None of the inquisitors or the Spirearch mention the possibility of the presumed spy remaining at large in the Spire during the denouement after all.
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: Dashkull on December 22, 2015, 09:52:19 AM
Dammit. I REALLY like this theory :(. Very very sad because Bayard is one of my favorite characters. Which is, of course, a perfect reason for him to be the traitor.

I agree with the earlier post about Abigail being mentioned more than was necessary being of interest, maybe she is the traitor.

The one thing I can think of to counter any of it is that both the Spirearch and Grimm mention that they think the traitor is in the Guard. Grimm even specifically says that as being one of the reasons Addison used the criminal guilds of Landing to be ready for a potential attack, and did not dispatch additional members of the Guard. Of course they could be wrong, and an aristocrat or high ranking member of the fleet would certainly be able to find ways of their own to gather such information. But for the moment they are proceeding from the assumption that the spy is in the Guard, specifically.

(oh hey, what about the Spirearch's batman?)
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: knnn on December 22, 2015, 02:13:21 PM
If we go by Alera, then Reggie is Brencis, and the spy is simply Reginald's father.
Title: Re: The Spy
Post by: kazimmoinuddin on December 23, 2015, 01:42:52 AM
Is the spy for the enemy spire or for cavendish true master? Depending on which one, it would define what kind of spy it could potentially be.