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The Dresden Files => DF Spoilers => DF Reference Collection => Topic started by: Elegast on May 08, 2012, 08:50:40 PM

Title: Maeve was at Splattercon!!! disguised as a vampire.
Post by: Elegast on May 08, 2012, 08:50:40 PM
We know there is some mysterious person in PG at the Splattercon. I know who it was! (Really  ;D)

Missing person quote:
Quote
There were a few more screams, the quick, light sound of frightened feet, and I whirled. I saw someone flee the room from the corner of my eye, but I didn’t get much of a look at them.

Some quotes:
about the murk:
Quote
“What the hell,” he said, and shook the light a few times. He had his hand on his gun, the restraining strap off, but he hadn’t drawn it yet. Good man. He knew as well as I did that the hotel was going to have far more panicked attendees than potential threats.

“We’ll try mine,” I said, and got the silver pentacle on its chain from around my neck. A gentle whisper and an effort of will and the amulet began to emit a pure, silver-blue light that reached into the darkness around us, burning it away as swiftly as it pressed in, until we could see for maybe fifteen feet around us. Beyond that was just a murky vagueness— not so much a cloud or a mist as a simple lack of light.
about the ward:
Quote
struggled to ignore the sounds of frightened people in the dark and focused on my magical senses. I reached out to the cold and the gloom, and found it a vaguely familiar kind of spellworking, though I couldn’t remember precisely where I’d encountered it before.
Quote
I nodded once at him, turned, and plunged into the darkness, Rawlins at my back. Screams erupted around us, sometimes accompanied by the sight of stumbling, terrified people. Rawlins nudged them toward the walls, barked at them in a tone of pure paternal authority to stay near them, to move carefully for the exits. The gloom began to press in closer to me, and it became an effort of will to hold up the light in my amulet against it. A few steps more and the air grew even colder. Walking forward became an effort, like wading through waist-deep water. I had to lean against it, and I heard a grunt of effort come out of my mouth. “What’s wrong?” Rawlins asked, his voice tight.

We passed under one of the hotel’s emergency light fixtures, its floodlights only dim orange rings in the murk until my amulet’s light burned the shadows away. “Dark magic,” I growled through clenched teeth. “A kind of ward. Trying to keep me from moving ahead.”
Quote
He[Rawlins] gave me an odd look, grabbed an older woman who was passing blindly, and sent her off to follow the wall to the door out. He shivered then, and when he exhaled his breath came out in a long, frosty plume. The temperature had dropped maybe forty degrees in the space of a minute.
about Pell's theater:
Quote

I caught my breath a little, and asked, “Anything at Pell’s theater?”

Murphy nodded and crossed the room to pick up two of the candles. “A lot of nothing. Place was locked up tight. Chains on the front doors, and the back door was locked. Sign on the door said they were closed until further notice.”

I grunted. “You’d think Pell would be wild to have the place open, if the convention was providing a significant amount of his income—even if he was in a hospital bed. Hell, especially if he was in a hospital bed.”

“Unless he doesn’t have anyone he trusts to run it for him.”

The magic strongly points toward Maeve. It's cold. It's darkness. Harry has seen the same binding in Summer Knight performed on Slate by Maeve. She was the one who closed the door at the theater: the fetches attacked Pell, freeing the Way back to Artis Tor.

Now that's indications, not proof. But I've more: Harry saw her. She was at Splattercon.
Quote
Two girls, both too young for me to think adult thoughts about, sidled by in black-and-purple clothing and makeup that left a lot of skin bare, their faces painted pale, trickles of fake blood at the corners of their mouths. One of them smiled at me, and she had fangs.

This is Maeve. Right in front of Harry. Taunting him. The girls are described exactly like Maeve. They wear the clothes she likes. They wear the colors of Winter. It's also a reference to Harry's costume in GP.

I give you the official descriptions of Maeve:
Quote
The young woman who entered the bar could have been Lily’s sister. She had the same exotic beauty, the same canted, feline eyes, the same pale, flawless skin. But this one’s hair was worn in long, ragged strands of varying lengths, like a Raggedy Ann doll, each one dyed a slightly different color from frozen seas—pale blues and greens, as though each had borrowed its color from a different glacier. Her eyes were a cold, brilliant shade of green, almost entirely darkened by pupils dilated as though with drugs or arousal. A slender silver hoop gleamed at one side of her nose, and a collar of black leather studded with silver snowflakes encircled the graceful line of her slender throat. She wore sandals and cut-off blue jean shorts—very cut-off, and very tight. A tight, white T-shirt strained across her chest, and read, in pale blue letters stretched into intriguing curves, “YOUR BOYFRIEND WANTS ME.”
Quote
She looked young. Young enough to make a man feel guilty for thinking the wrong thoughts, but old enough to make it difficult not to. Her hair had been bound into long dreadlocks, each of them dyed a different shade, ranging from a deep lavender to pale blues and greens to pure white, so that it almost seemed that her hair had been formed from glacial ice. She wore leather pants of dark, dark blue, laced and open up the outside seams from calf to hip. Her boots matched the pants. She wore a white T-shirt tight enough to show the tips of her breasts straining against the fabric, framing the words OFF WITH HIS HEAD. She had hacked the shirt off at the top of her rib cage, leaving pale flesh exposed, along with a glitter of silver flashing at her navel.

Now, wait, it gets worse, this is just after the murk appears:
Quote
Rawlins stared at me for a second and then said, “What the hell is going on?”

There were running footsteps and shouts and cries in the gloom. All of them sounded choked, muffled somehow. One of the two teenaged “vampires” stumbled into the circle of my azure wizard’s light, sobbing.

Yes. One of the two was missing. That was Maeve who went backstage. She was in Chicago, and that's how she showed up so quickly:

Quote
That is one way to describe it,” Lily said quietly. “I would not, myself, interpret it that way. I had no part in bringing the fetches here—but their presence and their capture of Lady Charity’s daughter presented us with an opportunity to temporarily neutralize the presence of Mab’s forces upon our borders.”

“We,” I murmured. “Maeve is working with you. That was why she showed up at McAnally’s so quickly.”

Solved. :D

Edit:

Thanks to Griffyn612, we even know the reason for each attack.

The first attack was targeting Pell. Aim: free the theater,where there is a Way to Artis Tor.
The second attack was to make Harry react, and make sure he would send the phages to Molly.
The third attack was targeting the vampire/girl to make sure there would be no witness.
Quote
The third victim had been one of the little vampire girls I’d seen the previous evening. I could only tell because her head had landed facing me. The rest of her was hopelessly intermixed with the other two bodies.
Quote
Time resumed its course. The energy that powered the spell fled out of me in another rush, and left me lying on my side, struggling to draw in enough breath. I could feel the spell sizzling down the lines of power for the summoner, and a heartbeat later there was a sense of impact as the spell went home. As it happened, the entities my web touched went abruptly still, the web ceasing its trembling—and then they all surged forward into sudden motion, vanishing from the web, and presumably streaking after the lure.

All but one.
That's why Harry's spell failed. Mab knew Harry was planning a redirection spell. The last phage was specifically send to kill the vampire/girl and could not be diverted.
The fourth attack was targeting Glau, killing the last witness, saving Harry if necessary, and taunting him.
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: Griffyn612 on May 08, 2012, 09:34:02 PM
Honestly, my biggest problem with all of this is the level of intelligence required to pull it off.  Maeve has never given us an impression of being all that bright.  Admittedly, that would be the perfect alibi if she were acting. 

And it would be funny if Harry's gut reaction to the vamps were some subconscious recognition of Maeve.  But I thought that the second of the young vamps was killed.  Meaning Maeve would have had to have been the one sobbing.

Quote
The third victim had been one of the little vampire girls I’d seen the previous evening. I could only tell because her head had landed facing me. The rest of her was hopelessly intermixed with the other two bodies.

Butcher, Jim (2007-02-06). Proven Guilty (The Dresden Files, Book 8) (pp. 194-195). Penguin Group. Kindle Edition.

That was from the 'Alien' phage attack.  No way of knowing if it was the same as he saw sobbing during the first attack.
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: Mr. Death on May 08, 2012, 10:34:04 PM
Honestly, my biggest problem with all of this is the level of intelligence required to pull it off.  Maeve has never given us an impression of being all that bright.
And I imagine that's just how she likes it--recall her entrance in SK's final battle. Waiting until you can ambush a weakened enemy is quite bright, if you ask me.
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: KnightOrbis on May 08, 2012, 10:49:48 PM
And I imagine that's just how she likes it--recall her entrance in SK's final battle. Waiting until you can ambush a weakened enemy is quite bright, if you ask me.

Attacking a weakened enemy wouldn't take much brains to figure out I think it's pretty instinctual.
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: Mr. Death on May 08, 2012, 10:55:14 PM
Attacking a weakened enemy wouldn't take much brains to figure out I think it's pretty instinctual.
Just attacking a weakened enemy is one thing. Lying in wait and deliberately waiting for the opportunity for the enemy to be weakened is another.
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: khatre on May 08, 2012, 11:03:05 PM
Mab could have ordered Maeve to keep an eye on things close up to make sure her plans with Molly went as expected. They were kind of important after all.  :P
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: the neurovore of Zur-En-Aargh on May 08, 2012, 11:03:10 PM
Honestly, my biggest problem with all of this is the level of intelligence required to pull it off.  Maeve has never given us an impression of being all that bright.

Elaine warns Harry against taking Maeve's apparent personality seriously, in SK, though she's in the process of deceiving him and trying to keep his suspicions pointed away from Aurora at the time.
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: Mr. Death on May 08, 2012, 11:05:35 PM
All in all, I don't think you can rule a solid chunk of a Faerie court and be dumb at the same time.
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: khatre on May 08, 2012, 11:08:23 PM
Quote
The third victim had been one of the little vampire girls I’d seen the previous evening. I could only tell because her head had landed facing me. The rest of her was hopelessly intermixed with the other two bodies

If you accept that she could have been Maeve (when alive) its also possible that the head is an illusion/glamour/whatever fae use created by Meave to hide her presence. (who would actually notice if it vanished after sun rise?)
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: khatre on May 08, 2012, 11:11:50 PM
All in all, I don't think you can rule a solid chunk of a Faerie court and be dumb at the same time.

I agree. Vicious conniving bitch? oh that i can see easily.  :P
she trained under Mab after all ...
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: laura118b on May 08, 2012, 11:50:10 PM
I think the person he saw was Sandra, not Maeve.  Maeve goes for the Goth look, I suspect in part to blend in with the humans around her, so two Goth girls looking the same isn't a shock.  And I've put the cold and "familiar" darkness down to the very possibly Outsider enhanced Scarecrow.  He "ate" Harry's magic very much like Papa Raith.

The key to me is Harry says "dark" magic, and while Winter isn't sunshine and puppies I don't think of their magic as what Harry calls "dark", it's too alien for that.  I think it points to a mortal using corrupting magic for some other big plan, and Mab taking Molly to put a stop to that plan by thrusting Harry right in the way.

Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: khatre on May 09, 2012, 12:33:30 AM
Sandra had no reason to hide as far as i know (other than the fact that she was working for Mavra that is ).
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: Elegast on May 09, 2012, 06:20:33 AM
That was from the 'Alien' phage attack.  No way of knowing if it was the same as he saw sobbing during the first attack.

Or she was killed to to suppress all witness, like Glau was.
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: Elegast on May 09, 2012, 06:22:56 AM
Honestly, my biggest problem with all of this is the level of intelligence required to pull it off.  Maeve has never given us an impression of being all that bright.

Lily says it's an act. And she can't lie.
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: Gman on May 09, 2012, 08:10:44 AM
This is a possibility. There was a lot of screwy stuff going on in Proven Guilty. Not enough evidence. Nice theory Elegast.
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: Elegast on May 09, 2012, 10:01:05 AM

Thanks to Griffyn612, we even know the reason for each attack.

The first attack was targeting Pell. Aim: free the theater,where there is a Way to Artis Tor.
The second attack was to make Harry react, and make sure he would send the phages to Molly.
The third attack was targeting the vampire/girl to make sure there would be no witness.
Quote
The third victim had been one of the little vampire girls I’d seen the previous evening. I could only tell because her head had landed facing me. The rest of her was hopelessly intermixed with the other two bodies.
Quote
Time resumed its course. The energy that powered the spell fled out of me in another rush, and left me lying on my side, struggling to draw in enough breath. I could feel the spell sizzling down the lines of power for the summoner, and a heartbeat later there was a sense of impact as the spell went home. As it happened, the entities my web touched went abruptly still, the web ceasing its trembling—and then they all surged forward into sudden motion, vanishing from the web, and presumably streaking after the lure.

All but one.
That's why Harry's spell failed. Mab knew Harry was planning a redirection spell. The last phage was specifically send to kill the vampire/girl and could not be diverted.
The fourth attack was targeting Glau, killing the last witness, saving Harry if necessary, and taunting him.
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: Arjan on May 09, 2012, 10:40:32 AM
Elaine warns Harry against taking Maeve's apparent personality seriously, in SK, though she's in the process of deceiving him and trying to keep his suspicions pointed away from Aurora at the time.
But Maeve's behaviour in Proven Guilty actually supports this. Maeve was acting in Summer Knight and Harry fell for it.

And Fix should know:
Quote
Fix sipped at his lemonade and said, “For the love of God, Maeve. Would you
give the Evil Kinkstress act a rest? It gets tired pretty fast.”

She is performing an act. She is hiding her true intelligence. The only question is how much she is hiding.
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: Elegast on May 09, 2012, 11:20:29 AM
  But I thought that the second of the young vamps was killed.  Meaning Maeve would have had to have been the one sobbing.

No. She was sobbing during attack n°2. SHe was killed during n°3.
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: Ms Duck on May 09, 2012, 02:15:12 PM
me confused. Maeve is a sidhe, a master of glamour. she could have looked like a potted plant if she had wanted too; furthermore, why kill the witness? please explain.
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: Griffyn612 on May 09, 2012, 03:55:32 PM
me confused. Maeve is a sidhe, a master of glamour. she could have looked like a potted plant if she had wanted too; furthermore, why kill the witness? please explain.

I'm not truly supporting this theory yet, but if I was, here's how I would propose it.

Maeve did it

When Harry first arrives at SplatterCon!!!, he sees two young sexy women dressed up as vamps.  His first reaction was to blast them.  It was initially assumed to be an overreaction, but may have been his subconscious picking up on Maeve's spell. 
 - One of the two vamps is Maeve in a glamour. 
 - The other is a mortal who doesn't even know who Maeve is, or that she's even there.
 - Even Molly watches them and frowns; Harry assumes because of his reaction.

Two Minus One
After seeing the two together at the beginning, Harry never sees the two together again. 
 - One is in the hallway during the Reaper attack, running in fear.
 - One is killed during the Alien attack.
Where was the other one in each instance?  If they were friends, they wouldn't abandon each other twice.
 - During the Reaper attack, Maevamp might have been the one still in the room, casting the murk.  When Harry hit the Reaper, she ran out, and then the murk released.
 - During the Alien attack, someone had knocked out the emergency lights.  He didn't spot anyone suspicious, but there were people running around.  And with no murk to keep going, she might have been further away.

The vamp's death wouldn't have to be planned, or eliminating witnesses.  It could just be that she was in the wrong place twice, because Maeve was around her both times the phages came through.

Why?
Why would Maeve do all of this?  I don't know, it still doesn't make enough sense to me to reason out.  We can say Mab told her to do it, but we don't know what Mab's intentions were.
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: Elegast on May 09, 2012, 04:03:58 PM
furthermore, why kill the witness? please explain.

Don't know. Harry said that Glau was killed on purpose, so I assumed she was too:
Quote
“Glau was barely conscious when it grabbed him,” I said. “It was probably me or Madrigal who was feeling the most tension, but it took out Glau, specifically.”

“You think someone sent it for Glau?”

“I think it’s a reasonable conclusion.”

Thomas frowned. “Why would anyone do that?”

“To shut him up,” I said. “I think Madrigal was supposed to go down for these attacks, at least in front of the supernatural communities. Maybe Glau was in on it. Maybe Glau arranged for Madrigal to be here.”

“Or maybe the Scarecrow went after Glau because he was wounded and separate from the rest of us. It might have been a coincidence.”

“Possible,” I allowed. “But my gut says it wasn’t. Glau was their cutout man. They killed him to cover their trail.”


And that quote:
Quote
The two girls went on by, none the wiser, and even Molly only frowned at them and then back at me for a second, her face tilted into an expression of silent inquiry.

I can see Jim grinning writing it.

Edit: I suppose there was a version of the plan where Madrigal took the fall, and no one would ever blame Mab for it. Madrigal could open a Way in a place of linked fear, connected to a place of fear in the Nevernever. Harry sends back the phages, and unfortunately they go to Artis Tor with Molly. Poor Mab is completely innocent. Harry goes to Artis Tor anyway.

The problem is that Madrigal is such a loser, nobody believes he's the bad guy.
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: Elegast on May 09, 2012, 04:19:40 PM
me confused. Maeve is a sidhe, a master of glamour. she could have looked like a potted plant if she had wanted too;

Yes. But that's quite dangerous:
Quote
I lunged for a potted plant near me and threw up.
That may have been Maeve. ;D
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: Elegast on May 09, 2012, 04:38:58 PM
Why?
Why would Maeve do all of this?

Mab send her to make sure her plans would succeed. She put the ward to make sure someone was going to die, so motivating Harry, and make him think that some practitioner was calling the phages. Harry would never assume that a faerie was sending them from the NN, and another putting wards. Too improbable.

We can say Mab told her to do it, but we don't know what Mab's intentions were.

Wrong. We have a WOJ on that:
Quote
Ask yourself why Mab had Molly brought in.

She had a plan which included bringing Molly through a redirection spell performed by Harry. That level of details needs to be micromanaged.
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: Ms Duck on May 09, 2012, 04:54:03 PM
Yes. But that's quite dangerous:That may have been Maeve. ;D

No, that plant was poor albert the triffid. he allways gets those roles, poor guy is typecast.

Im just missing a few things:

maeve can look like anyone.

does mab need to be in a building to cast spells? Does maeve?

why not just veil?
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: Elegast on May 09, 2012, 05:04:23 PM
Quote
maeve can look like anyone.

Yes. And she chose to look like a vampire. Why? She wanted to have fun at the con. Do you think she was going to spend the whole day as a plant, waiting for Mab to send the phages?

Quote
does mab need to be in a building to cast spells? Does maeve?

Mab magic is perfect, it does not leak cold. And Harry said "vaguely familiar". Harry had never seen Mab's magic (mind magic, but later).
Maeve plays by the same rule as a wizard.

Quote
why not just veil?

Boring, can be spotted, impossible to interact with Harry if necessary. Plus she likes wearing costumes.
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: Mr. Death on May 09, 2012, 08:33:25 PM
No. Maeve, being a Fae, does not work on the same rules as a wizard. She works on the same rules as other Fae, like Mab.
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: astelon on May 11, 2012, 08:05:37 PM
According to this theory what is up with the Scarcrow phage?  Something unusual (even with magic involved) is going on with it.

One minor point: there was no murk in PG.  The lights were temporarily taken out by some kind of hex that also effected the radios, phones and flashlights.  When Harry faced the murk in Small Favor it effected his own light while the darkness in Proven Guilty didn't.

Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: Elegast on May 11, 2012, 08:40:33 PM
According to this theory what is up with the Scarcrow phage?  Something unusual (even with magic involved) is going on with it.

No idea.
One minor point: there was no murk in PG.  The lights were temporarily taken out by some kind of hex that also effected the radios, phones and flashlights.  When Harry faced the murk in Small Favor it effected his own light while the darkness in Proven Guilty didn't.

You're only half-right:
Quote
“We’ll try mine,” I said, and got the silver pentacle on its chain from around my neck. A gentle whisper and an effort of will and the amulet began to emit a pure, silver-blue light that reached into the darkness around us, burning it away as swiftly as it pressed in, until we could see for maybe fifteen feet around us. Beyond that was just a murky vagueness— not so much a cloud or a mist as a simple lack of light.
Quote
“Fire?” Rawlins blurted, turning back to me. “Is this smoke?”

This was more than an hex. There was a darkness spell. I suspect it was the same spell in PG and SmF, but in one case cast by Meave and the other by Mab. Maeve's one was weak and leaked cold, Mab's could be pierced only by the power of Amoracchius.
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: Mr. Ghostbuster on May 11, 2012, 09:20:33 PM
I'm not convinced. To be honest, I think your grasping at straws.
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: Agravaine on May 11, 2012, 10:52:42 PM
I'm convinced.
Title: Re: Maeve did it.
Post by: Elegast on May 12, 2012, 06:59:44 AM
I'm not convinced. To be honest, I think your grasping at straws.

It may seem so for the vampire part.

But we know that someone was seen fleeing.
We know there was a ward and murk, a vaguely familiar magic.

So it means with a high probability that either Marling, Elaine or Maeve were behind the scenes.

Considering the type of magic, the vampire cluebat, and the fact the Maeve was in Chicago, Meave is by far the favorite.