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The Dresden Files => DFRPG => Topic started by: Belial666 on June 16, 2010, 09:05:38 AM

Title: Questions on toughness powers
Post by: Belial666 on June 16, 2010, 09:05:38 AM
OK, here are a few things that struck me as odd:

Immunity is 8 refresh and it is better than Mythic Toughness and Mythic Recovery together, which are 12 refresh. Why?

Living Dead, which prevents death, is not labelled as a toughness power. Does this mean that things that affect toughness powers (such as Soulfire and "All creatures are equal before God") do not apply to it?

Living Dead mentions that supernatural help is required to recover from physical consequences but it also mentions you can't recover on you own. Does having recovery powers (which are supernatural) help with recovery or not?

There are almost no toughness abilities that apply to mental attacks whatsoever. A still-green wizard usually is almost as resilient mentally as a Denarian because there are no abilities that reflect a supernaturally strong mind, mental protection or similar. Why?
Title: Re: Questions on toughness powers
Post by: Deadmanwalking on June 16, 2010, 09:19:49 AM
Quote from: Belial666 on June 16, 2010, 09:05:38 AM
OK, here are a few things that struck me as odd:

Immunity is 8 refresh and it is better than Mythic Toughness and Mythic Recovery together, which are 12 refresh. Why?

Because either alone is almost as good as Physical Immunity, but not quite? And they also grant ancilliary benefits, like going without sleep or other rest indefinirtely (something Physical Immunity most certainly does not).

Quote from: Belial666 on June 16, 2010, 09:05:38 AM
Living Dead, which prevents death, is not labelled as a toughness power. Does this mean that things that affect toughness powers (such as Soulfire and "All creatures are equal before God") do not apply to it?

No idea as a general rule, though "All Creatures Are Equal Before God" would seem to trump it quite thoroughly thematically speaking.

Quote from: Belial666 on June 16, 2010, 09:05:38 AM
Living Dead mentions that supernatural help is required to recover from physical consequences but it also mentions you can't recover on you own. Does having recovery powers (which are supernatural) help with recovery or not?

I'd rule yes, they do. But there's no definitive answer as it was really not intended for PC use.

Quote from: Belial666 on June 16, 2010, 09:05:38 AM
There are almost no toughness abilities that apply to mental attacks whatsoever. A still-green wizard usually is almost as resilient mentally as a Denarian because there are no abilities that reflect a supernaturally strong mind, mental protection or similar. Why?

Which is as it should be. Look how quickly Quintus Cassius crumbled in Death Masks. Age and power do not inherently grant mental fortitude in and of themselves. Nor should they. Inhuman creatures in the Dresden Files may know more or be more powerful than humans, but they are not inherently stronger willed.
Title: Re: Questions on toughness powers
Post by: Belial666 on June 16, 2010, 09:57:49 AM
Quote
Inhuman creatures in the Dresden Files may know more or be more powerful than humans, but they are not inherently stronger willed.

I think that applies only to people that were once human and/or are still close to human and think, more or less, like humans do.
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And that's before going to things like angels or outsiders.
Title: Re: Questions on toughness powers
Post by: Deadmanwalking on June 16, 2010, 10:03:39 AM
"Will Alone" is an...interesting phrase. There's also got to be some power there akin to Evocation (or something allowing a direct mental attack) due to the physical effects if nothing else.



Also, and more importantly, aren't things like that's willpower and resistance to suggestion better represented by Epic or higher Conviction and Discipline scores rather than some power?
Title: Re: Questions on toughness powers
Post by: Papa Gruff on June 16, 2010, 10:12:50 AM
Quote from: Belial666 on June 16, 2010, 09:57:49 AM
I think that applies only to people that were once human and/or are still close to human and think, more or less, like humans do.
(click to show/hide)
And that's before going to things like angels or outsiders.

Yes. But isn't that reflected through skill? That has nothing to do with mental toughness. It's just that they are able to deal tons of mental stress if they want to. Possibly through a very high conviction skill or an other power. Toughness has nothing to do with it in my opinion.

As he has no touchable physical form I'd treat Bob's mental stress track as his physical and vise versa. He has no physical stress track so to speak.
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EDIT: Ah damn ... DMW was faster ... again ^_^
Title: Re: Questions on toughness powers
Post by: KOFFEYKID on June 16, 2010, 09:07:36 PM
As others have pointed out creatures having a stronger will is represented in the mechanics of skills. A mortal is not going to get past the superb skill cap without a very good reason, other creatures aren't restricted by human limitations (can go higher than Superb), but still require the effort to reach higher levels.