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The Dresden Files => DFRPG => Topic started by: finarvyn on May 26, 2006, 10:25:44 PM
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At what point in the series will the RPG be set? (Since some characters tend to change somewhat as the series evolves.)
I guess I am wondering if there is a particular point in the timeline where adventures are assumed to occur, or if the game will be set up with the idea that we could play at any point in the sequence. (If the game is set so that play could occur anywhere, this might mean that several versions of the same characters could be appropriate. "Here is Harry at the end of book three"; that kind of thing.)
I can see advantages each way.
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Several possible approaches come to mind. One is that a timeline of assorted events will be included with a "pick a point" caption. Another is that the initial game world will be set initially at a specific point in the chronology (probably between Dead Beat and Proven Guilty or just after Proven Guilty) and then updated after each book for those who wish to keep current. Most likely is that the gap of years between books will be taken advantage of to set things in.
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Well, if one takes the POV that you'll be gaming in Harry's world but with your own characters, then it doesn't matter where you fall in the timeline.
As for me, I'll be reprising my role as Marcus Washington, the precogniscient middle linebacker for the Chicago Bears. Been too many years - I don't recall how he met Harry tho.
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Well, if one takes the POV that you'll be gaming in Harry's world but with your own characters, then it doesn't matter where you fall in the timeline.
Well, it would matter some. Is Bianca alive, is the war ongoing, what's the state of Winter, etc. all might matter.
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Well, if one takes the POV that you'll be gaming in Harry's world but with your own characters, then it doesn't matter where you fall in the timeline.
Well, it would matter some. Is Bianca alive, is the war ongoing, what's the state of Winter, etc. all might matter.
Well, true, but it won't be a huge deal - not like if you were actually RP'ing Harry, Michael, or whomever.
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It would matter in terms of the world backdrop. It would matter if you wanted to RP a White Council wizard, a Fae, a Vamp, or someone connected to any of the above. So yeah, it would matter.
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Hrmph, tohmaytoh, tohmahtoh. :) Let's just say I doubt that Fred and friends will lock the RPG into a specific point in the timeline the way some RPGs tend to do. They'll likely make it easier to pick your own point and run with it...
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well, you could just CHANGE when it is set yourself.
Do you want the war with Red's to be going on?
Do you want Bianca alive?
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well, you could just CHANGE when it is set yourself.
Do you want the war with Red's to be going on?
Do you want Bianca alive?
My point exactly :)
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It would matter in terms of the world backdrop. It would matter if you wanted to RP a White Council wizard, a Fae, a Vamp, or someone connected to any of the above. So yeah, it would matter.
This is significant, and illustrates a potential snag that can occur in any RPG based on a book/movie/TV show type setting. (And it's perhaps magnified somewhat when that work is still ongoing by the author.)
I think I first discovered this effect back in the 1970's when my gaming group created a Star Wars campaign based on the only Star Wars movie released at that point -- our campaign took place right after the movie and made certain assumptions as to where the plot should go and how the characters would develop. We had no way to anticipate that George Lucas would make some unusual plot twists along the way, so our campaign ended up looking nothing like the later movies.
This doesn't have to be a problem, but it might be to some. Suppose the "default setting" for a campaign is after Harry book #5 (just to pick a number at random). Even if PCs aren't plaing the roles of Harry or Murph or Michael or other major characters, what happens in the books and what happens in the campaign probably will be nothing like one another, and if the GM is willing to allow for major characters to have changes (death, etc), then the potential is that future books events might be incompatible. Even in the event that something happens to a minor character, it may be that this character could evolve into a different role by the time Jim writes book #9 (or later) and again an alternate timeline is the only solution. Each individual GM will have to resolve these issues.
As a game designer, the problem I might have to face would be whether to have a "default setting" or not. Where this becomes important is for any character who might have a significant change. Do you include a "Susan before" and a "Susan after" NPC stat block, or do you select one with the assumption that the GM will use it or create his own. Many characters will be essentially the same throughout the series, but a few evolve enough where this should be a consideration.
Just my two cents.
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At what point in the series will the RPG be set? (Since some characters tend to change somewhat as the series evolves.)
I guess I am wondering if there is a particular point in the timeline where adventures are assumed to occur, or if the game will be set up with the idea that we could play at any point in the sequence. (If the game is set so that play could occur anywhere, this might mean that several versions of the same characters could be appropriate. "Here is Harry at the end of book three"; that kind of thing.)
I can see advantages each way.
People can diverge from whatever point in the series they want to. We'll do our best to provide the tools to do just that (really, it shouldn't be too hard, either way).
We're going to "cover" the books up through Proven Guilty at the very least, and may even incorporate little bits of what's going on in book nine (tentatively, I believe, titled 'White Night').
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Yeah, makes sense. I mainly know D&D, so my examples of role-playing tend to come from there: TSR has released a good number of pre-created worlds, with history and all. There are even video games and novels based off those worlds. Obviously, playing in any of those worlds, it would matter whether you were playing before, during or after the Big War Of Whatever, or the Rule Of King So-And-So, or since the Heroes of Lore beat the Whatever-Baddie, or etc. etc.
As a DM, you get to decide these things to best fit the story you want to tell. DMs have total power.
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Yeah, makes sense. I mainly know D&D, so my examples of role-playing tend to come from there: TSR has released a good number of pre-created worlds, with history and all.
What makes this interesting is that Jim is still writing, so we drop our storylines into the middle of the story without knowing how it will end up.
With a D&D camapign, such as those produced by TSR, they build history and such with the intent of letting the DM take over at a certain point. Sometimes there are modules tossed in, but overall the company tries to shut up and let you play.
Now you can play for a year and develop a storyline, Jim does something unexpected in the next book, and then everyone looks at each other and says "Hell's bells! How are going to work that into our game." And Jim just sits back and laughs at all of us. ;D
As a DM, you get to decide these things to best fit the story you want to tell. DMs have total power.
Which is why I like to be the DM. ;)
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I sincerely hope that it is pick a point, although even if it's not, the DM could run it that way. But i am pretty sure it will be quite different from conventional RPG's, ina good most likely(or so i hope), in the fact that most of the playble characters/things will be, well, monsters. You won't really have classes, except for maybe humans. I mean, there arn't too many ways a vampire of werewolf can go, and each race would have complications with some sort of class. I can't really see a were-wolf that sneaks around or a white court vamp that is like a beserker. In any case, i'm sure it will be good.
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Have you ever seen the Amber Diceless RPG? In the core rulebook each NPC has three versions, often low or middle or high-powered characters.
I've also seen this sort of thing handled in West End's Star Wars RPG from the '80's (for example, Luke Skywalker at the end of the destruction of the first Death Star would be significantly weaker than Luke Skywalker at the end of Return of the Jedi).
It's possible to do something like this and have multiple versions of any character who might change significantly through the series, and that way a DM could run the game in any "era" of the timeline. When the campaign progressed to a new stage, the NPCs would switch to their new pre-determined state.
It's more work (for the game authors) that way, but would certainly allow for each DM to select when their own campaign would exist. Also, later sourcebooks would update characters who change.
Just one thought. Not saying it should be done that way, only that it could.
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Really, I am in the camp of "No timeline", cause, at least in our group, we won't be playing the main characters, or probably even in Chicago. More than likley, we're going to just play in the universe, which is still a great setting. The White Council, Denarians, trolls and faeries and vampires and just...yeah. Kind of like WOD only without the angst.
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TMW -- I hear what you are saying on the "no timeline" thought, but I suspect that some of the timeline events may be significant in your campaign even if you don't use Jim's characters, etc.
For example, your characters are in Baltimore and are doing their own thing. Suddenly they find out that a war has broken out between the White Council and the Red Court. Not through anything that they did, but because it fits the timeline. Maybe this way the players will feel like events are taking place around them, and that they get swept into the "big picture" without their consent (sort of what happens to Harry at several times along the way).
Without some of these events taking place, you may find that your campaign has that "generic" wizards'n'vampires feel and not so much a "Dresden" feel. Otherwise, you won't need a Dresden Files RPG -- just pick up a random RPG and make up magic rules and play.
Just a thought.
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As long as the background is properly written and developed it would be very easy to set a game just about anywhere in the timeline and world. A good example of this would be FASA MechWarrior game. It built the game on the assumption that you would play at a particular point (depending on the version of the game played) but the background and technological advances were such that you could play at pretty much any point in time, on any world. This is what I am hoping for. NPC stats could be handled for broad categories (Susan: pre/post infection, Harry before and after Lasciel) but the timeline itself is fluid. Any system that gives more power to a GM for control of his own setting is better.
FWIW, my group would probably base our campaign in our home town so that I can use known landmarks and groups for adventures.
The Elder Wyrm
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A good example of this would be FASA MechWarrior game.
Woot! A fellow MechWarrior! :) It was nice to be able to completely ignore some of the lame things they did later on.
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Someone who did this well IMO is Eden Studios and the Buffy RPG. The core book contains Season 1 characters and then uses a page to list character improvements throughout the following seasons of the show.
In our case it would be...
HARRY DRESDEN fully statted out as he appeared at the start of Storm Front.
The next page would have a synopsis of the book plots with interjecting points showing where stats were upped. (i.e. Harry's Potion Making increased from 2 to 3 as a result of his many hours spent in the lab with Bob, concocting various brews.)
Its a good system and doesn't take up much room in the book. Granted, since the books aren't finished, they would have to continue the character advancement in later supplements but I'm okay with that. The Buffy RPG added the update into later releases of the core book.
Likewise, a timeline displaying the basic sequence of events of the books would be a page well spent.
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Appreciate the suggestions. Thanks!
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At what point in the series will the RPG be set? (Since some characters tend to change somewhat as the series evolves.)
One other note is that, well, this is the age of the Internet. It's perfectly possible to say, "As characters change, write-ups may be found at our web site." Although, if I recall correctly from what has been revealed of the system, that's not going to be a major issue anyway, depending what plot points on which you're basing the characters. New talents and/or creatures are the stuff of supplements, anyway.
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Just as a throw-out, some games I've played that're based on ongoing series use a trick of being based on a book or two prior to the currently available book, in which the DM will work in immediate events of the books, while the characters are stuck trying to deal with the events without knowing why they're happening. That way, you feel like a part of the series, and bend the gameplay in a way to guarantee the characters are in the proper position for the next book.
For instance, say you're running a Dresden game now. You've got a wizard or two, maybe a Red Court vampire, and an ectomancer based in Montreal. The DM could work into the ongoing story side-events from Dead Beat (consequences of events in book, etc.), but offer no reason for these events to the characters beyond what they can figure out from their own abilities and make sure that the storylines that are developing can flow freely into events based around Proven Guilty.
The last one I was in actually crashed, because it was based on Jordan's Wheel of Time, and it's hard to keep the timeline frozen for the five years between books! Not a problem with Jim coming out with a book a year (And keep them coming, Jim! I'm already having semi-naugthy dreams about White Night).
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I don't think it matters when the game is set in the series. I think the RPG will provide a basic set of rules on how stuff works and a bit of storybackground on the basic fractions. In most games like this, the novels will be considered source books. The only thing I think that the RPG writers will have to update are characters sheets for changed/new characters, which could be done in online supplements.
I am assuming that there will be two characters sheets for harry. A suggested PC character sheet (probably based on book one) and a NPC characters sheet (up to date to current book at the time of writing).
You also have to remember the Golden Rule: The storyteller can change anything they want as long as the players will let them get a way with it. :)