He died of an apparent aneurysm... Anyone remember Lash threatening to give Harry an aneurysm? Yea...
"Apparent" isn't fact, it is speculation based on how something appears. In other words there was no autopsy. It would have described the damaged vessel and his death certificate would read he died of massive hemorrhage due to a ruptured aneurysm. Or a statement of fact because of Malcolm's known medical history, age, etc, we have no clue though because no one has seen his death certificate. On the other hand it might be that an aneurysm is the ultimate cause of death for White Court Vamp victims.apparent was my words, not the books.. of course we don't know. We don't know if there was an autopsy either. But why would Wamps cause an aneurysm? More likely your ahhh unit would explode lol. And this is all speculation my dear, it's what we do here, no?
apparent was my words, not the books.. of course we don't know. We don't know if there was an autopsy either. But why would Wamps cause an aneurysm? More likely your ahhh unit would explode lol. And this is all speculation my dear, it's what we do here, no?
who is to say that isn't what causes the ultimate death of a WCV victim?the complete lack of correlation between WCV powers and aneurysms mostly(or build up of symptoms for such). Nobody bleeding out their nose in WK, no mention of it being possible when Thomas almost kills Justine, ect. "When we rip the life force from someone it causes brain hemorrhages" In real life, we have people die mysteriously all the time, natural causes, ect. No reason to invent something for what would look like a natural mystery as apposed to supernatural. Covering up bite marks and drained corpses is more on the that line of thought.
the complete lack of correlation between WCV powers and aneurysms mostly(or build up of symptoms for such). Nobody bleeding out their nose in WK, no mention of it being possible when Thomas almost kills Justine, ect. "When we rip the life force from someone it causes brain hemorrhages" In real life, we have people die mysteriously all the time, natural causes, ect. No reason to invent something for what would look like a natural mystery as apposed to supernatural. Covering up bite marks and drained corpses is more on the that line of thought.
However, in the case of a younger person with no history of a medical condition, “an autopsy becomes a much more critical part of the process. Young people don’t just die suddenly,” Fowler said.
Generally White Court Vampires give people orgasms rather than aneurysms- perhaps you have confused the two?
Number 3 is the most likely and that I think is the Merlin, recent WOJ indicates that the Merlin has been trying to manipulate Harry for years. Justin was a trusted senior Warden, exactly the person the Merlin would go to if he didn’t trust Lucio or Morgan in respect of Harry. It would be apt that the Merlin is guilty of a deliberate premeditated breach of the first law in killing Malcom Dresden having hounded Harry for a breach in self defence. The Merlin strikes me as a hypocrite of the first order.
I thought it was heavily implied that Lord Raith used an entropy curse just like he did in blood rites.
On Margaret. We know nothing of Malcolm, aside from at the moment of his death someone was ready to disappear Harry so thoroughly that the best of the Warden field agents- Morgan- couldn't find him 12 hours later.Justin is a likely culprit. He is the only one with a strong motivation to kill the father and not the son and to make sure he can easily take Harry later as an orphan and make Harry thank him for it.
I lean toward the Leanansidhe, myself, but the Merlin is possible, in an attempt to create a WC controlled starborn weapon- or, in other words, Harry wasn't being groomed as DuMorne's personal enforcer, but as a wizard-warrior against threats like Drakul, possibly because such preparation would fly in the face of the Laws and the volatile Blackstaff.
I thought it was heavily implied that Lord Raith used an entropy curse just like he did in blood rites.ahh yes, I like the way you worded that. It IS assumed, as Harry had been going up against Lord Raiths curse. But we know of another possible ally of hers who's pretty famous for his entropy curse.. Nicodemus.
ahh yes, I like the way you worded that. It IS assumed, as Harry had been going up against Lord Raiths curse. But we know of another possible ally of hers who's pretty famous for his entropy curse.. Nicodemus.
See while in some ways Nick isn't a bad candidate, (because he probably has the resources and knowledge to hide Harry even from someone like Eb), I feel like it doesn't fit because if Nick had gone after Malcolm, he'd probably have swooped in immediately and dropped a Coin on him.
An ignorant child Wizard would be a prime candidate for Nick to mold into one of his chief enforcers.
So yeah, it has to be someone that's capable of a subtle and near-untraceable Magical Assassination, and the resources and skills to conceal Harry absolutely from two major-league Wizards, both trying their Darndest to find him, but not enough to prevent Lea from tracking him.
Also Nic IIRC offered knowledge about who killed Malcolm if he took up the coin in DM, that seems like the kind of offer that'd backfire too easily if Nic was even vaguely involved in Malcolm's death so he was probably off burning orphanages somewhere else at the time.
I think Justin could perfectly well kill Malcolm using magic and making it look like a natural death, he was a warden after all. And if not he had Bob to explain him exactly how. He also had a motive, with Malcolm alive Harry would stay with him and would not enter the system. Justin might have killed Elaines parent(s) as well just to get hold of her.
Harry has been manipulated for his entire life and we don't even know who might be doing it yet, because Harry doesn't like to ask important questions if it's at all possible.
The really interesting question is, "What will it take for Harry to start asking relevant questions, and to seek answers on his own if no one; who won't ask for his soul or something nearly as ruinous in return, will give him complete answers?"
just because there was true love between Malcom and Margret does not mean he was still protected. there had been 6 year period since Margret died. all that needed to happen was for Malcom to meet some one and be intimate with the person and his true love protection was over. As young as Dresden was and Dresden dad being a good dad Dresden would have no idea that his dad had a new girl friend especially if Malcom was killed immediately after this happened.
Indeed, but if an aneurysm was listed as a cause of death, who is to say that isn't what causes the ultimate death of a WCV victim?The books. Don't remember where, but it is said that it's usually heart failure. An aneurysm is similar in that both can be set off by similar activities and emotional stresses, so I wouldn't be surprised if aneurysms were what happened most often when it wasn't heart failure.
We need to ask Butters, he must of autopsied a WCV victim a time or two in his career..He did examine several in WN. One of which didn't have obvious signs of suicide.
Justin is a likely culprit. He is the only one with a strong motivation to kill the father and not the son and to make sure he can easily take Harry later as an orphan and make Harry thank him for it.Lea has a motive as this leads to Harry being greatly in her debt.
The only group who we know has reached in to the juvenile system is the BC, who do it to Molly in Proven Guilty.Black Council or Black Court? I read it as Black Court at first and would strongly object to the use of know in that instance.
The books. Don't remember where, but it is said that it's usually heart failure. An aneurysm is similar in that both can be set off by similar activities and emotional stresses, so I wouldn't be surprised if aneurysms were what happened most often when it wasn't heart failure.Lea does not even have the means. She had to protect Harry and killing his father does not fit. She needed a deal with Harry to harm him and that does not fit either. Lea is just too far fetched. Certainly not yet crazy from dagger Lea. It is a level of direct interference in human affairs that needs a deal. With Malcolm.
He did examine several in WN. One of which didn't have obvious signs of suicide.
Lea has a motive as this leads to Harry being greatly in her debt.
It probably wasn't Justin, or, if it was, he wasn't acting on his own because where's the dramatic pay off in that? It's going to be a character Harry can confront.He is the only one with the means and a clear motive. He who walks behind is the character Harry is going to confront.
Black Council or Black Court? I read it as Black Court at first and would strongly object to the use of know in that instance.Context. It must be black council here.
3. Whoever was in cahoots with Justin, and dissappeared Harry into the system.
Number 3 is the most likely and that I think is the Merlin, recent WOJ indicates that the Merlin has been trying to manipulate Harry for years. Justin was a trusted senior Warden, exactly the person the Merlin would go to if he didn’t trust Lucio or Morgan in respect of Harry. It would be apt that the Merlin is guilty of a deliberate premeditated breach of the first law in killing Malcom Dresden having hounded Harry for a breach in self defence. The Merlin strikes me as a hypocrite of the first order.
She had to protect Harry and killing his father does not fit.I've seen plenty of people say that Lea would think it was in Harry's best interest to have his father killed. See what Lily says about Lea being Harry's godmother and what she taught him in CD.
She needed a deal with Harry to harm him and that does not fit either. Lea is just too far fetched.She's not a faerie queen.
He who walks behind is the character Harry is going to confront.I don't see the big pay off with the revelation that an unspeakable evil is evil. It makes sense from a Watsonian perspective, but not from a Doylist.
Context. It must be black council here.When I read it, I immediately recalled the theory that Sandra Marlin was Mavra.
why use a princess when a commoner can do the jobBecause it's a character Harry knows. Makes him feel betrayed.
I've seen plenty of people say that Lea would think it was in Harry's best interest to have his father killed. See what Lily says about Lea being Harry's godmother and what she taught him in CD.But similar rules seem to apply in grave peril when Lea showed she had the power to heal him it was scary. It was because of their deal.
She's not a faerie queen.
But similar rules seem to apply in grave peril when Lea showed she had the power to heal him it was scary. It was because of their deal.There was a lot of stuff like that in the early books, but by SmF we have hobs killing carrying off random people at a train station. I've always said there's a lot of early installment weirdness in the first three books. I think Sidhe not being able to harm people is an example of that.
There was a lot of stuff like that in the early books, but by SmF we have hobs killing carrying off random people at a train station. I've always said there's a lot of early installment weirdness in the first three books. I think Sidhe not being able to harm people is an example of that.Hobs are not Sidhe but I think it makes Lea a less likely candidate.
In the Curses short story, it's implied or stated that the Queens don't like their Sidhe killing mortals because the Queens can't, so the Sidhe are hesitant to just go a murdering. The Twyleth Teg have no such limitations.
As young as Dresden was and Dresden dad being a good dad Dresden would have no idea that his dad had a new girl friend especially if Malcom was killed immediately after this happened.
Why are taking Cause of death as fact? Lara raith could have made the coroner write that aneurysm cause of death. Which would be the simplest explanation instead of debating you're all non medical opinionsBecause why would Lara do so?
Lord Faith could of used her as "Cats paws" etcSurebut that is not the question. Why would she make it look like an an aneurysm? Justin ha a clear motive for doing so but Lara seems to be content with the usual symptoms of a white court dead.
Not Lara, though. Too high connections. Someone lower in the hierarchy - why use a princess when a commoner can do the job... and is more easily vanished later if need be?
Because it's a character Harry knows. Makes him feel betrayed.
Who says Lara even made it look like an aneurysm far as We Know one of the black cat detectives or coroner or somebody could have just made it look like that because like Murphy they got to justify as cause of deathNot necessary. Even the murder spree in eight night would have been seen as natural by everyone if Karen was not involved and it is still in the books as natural.
Harry was six when Malcolm died. He didn't meet Lara until the porno movie shoot. They didn't know he'd ever meet her then.He still feel betrayed because she was keeping the secret from him and then married him (maybe) with the knowledge that she murdered his father. Even if he doesn't feel betrayed, it's still likely to be a character Harry knows. That's a bigger payoff. What's the point of Harry finding out that "White Court Vampire No. 37" killed his father? That's the answer to the question "why use a princess when a commoner can do the job?" Because Harry doesn't know the commoner.
"That's the thing," Butters said. "I couldn't find one."Since this is suspicious I would gather that the assumption is the defect was an attempt for the death to look like natural causes. No indication that the White Court can do that except with a curse, unless of course Lord Raith could do it. Somewhere it is stated that he could look at people and make them dead. An aneurysm which has ruptured would be the same in all relevant characteristics as the ruptured heart of someone targeted by the curse. A small curse might look just like that. This is assuming, of course that Jim has actually picked a villain at this point.
I lifted both eyebrows at him.
He spread his hands. "Harry, I know my trade. I like figuring this stuff out. And I haven't got the foggiest why the woman is dead. Every test I ran came up negative; every theory I put together fell apart. Medically speaking, she's in good shape. It's like her whole system just… got the switch turned off. Everything at once. Never seen anything like it."
A death certificate or investigation can say whatever the hypothetical mind controlling White Court conspirators want it to say.Sure but why bother?
Sure but why bother?To avoid suspicion from a child who could become a powerful wizard who grew up thinking that and never questioned it at all until a demon told him it wasn't natural causes. Even then, he doesn't seriously question it.
To avoid suspicion from a child who could become a powerful wizard who grew up thinking that and never questioned it at all until a demon told him it wasn't natural causes. Even then, he doesn't seriously question it.White court vampires in the book never bother with that, they trust it looks natural enough and the mortals find some natural cause.
This is death by White Court.Since this is suspicious I would gather that the assumption is the defect was an attempt for the death to look like natural causes. No indication that the White Court can do that except with a curse, unless of course Lord Raith could do it. Somewhere it is stated that he could look at people and make them dead. An aneurysm which has ruptured would be the same in all relevant characteristics as the ruptured heart of someone targeted by the curse. A small curse might look just like that. This is assuming, of course that Jim has actually picked a villain at this point.
Oh I think the White Court could be the one group of vamps that could pull off a murder and it would look like natural causes. After all, what physical evidence would death by overwhelming sexual pleasure look like? Maybe a youngish healthy man apparently dying in his sleep with a smile on his face?So why make it look like an aneurysm? A warlock hiding a murder with magic would do so.
I find the timing weird for Justin to have been (whether he did it personally or had help) behind it. Harry is in the orphanage for four years between his father's death and Justin's adoption. It feels off to me that Justin would kill Malcolm and then chill out for four years until Harry develops his talent. That isn't to say that Justin wasn't watching, though. If it was a year—maybe two—I might be able to see it. But four years is a long time to wait after committing murder.Waiting a few years after Malcolm’s dead serves several purposes. Like not having to deal with young children and making it easier to play the savior.
The one person we know had contact with Harry while he was in the orphanage was Lea. And I could see Lea offing Malcolm, possibly (or maybe even probably) as part of her bargain with Margaret (the agreement WOJ claims would drive Harry to immediately attempt to kill her should he ever learn the full details). And Malcolm might have smiled when he died if he knew it was for a good reason—particularly if it was Margaret's reason.
Pretty sure Lara or Papa Raith offed Murphy's dad, though.
White court vampires in the book never bother with that, they trust it looks natural enough and the mortals find some natural cause.2 out of 3 did try to fly under the White Council's, specifically Harry's, radar in WN. The third was regarded as an idiot for not doing so.
2 out of 3 did try to fly under the White Council's, specifically Harry's, radar in WN. The third was regarded as an idiot for not doing so.Only because Murphy got suspicious, Harry had no clue before that. And that was partly because of the huge number of victims. Chances are great that with another police officer nothing would have happened and without Harry the white council would not have been aware and would not have acted anyway.
Furthermore, the death certificate is going to say something for cause of death. In the DF, it's not going to say unknown. That's like showing up to a Wal-Mart with a bunch of people experiencing memory loss and disorientation and not declaring it a gas leak.
So why make it look like an aneurysm? A warlock hiding a murder with magic would do so.
It isn't like anyone part of the White Court doesn't know magic. Right? What killed Harry's mother, and who did it? I wonder what is written on her death certificate?Some do but Lara does not and I do not get the impression that it is wide spread.
Some do but Lara does not and I do not get the impression that it is wide spread.
Thomas can do some magic but it is limited.
But does that preclude her ordering someone in the family with power, to do it? Malcolm wouldn't have technically died by her hand, but she'd be just as guilty.Het father at this point. But why would she leave Harry malive and kill the father and not the other way round.
Het father at this point. But why would she leave Harry malive and kill the father and not the other way round.
Well I believe that Lara didn't even know she did it... at least not yet. So anything other than the murder itself doesn't matter. Pure Revenge killing on behalf of Lord RaithLara was never stupid. Afraid of her father yes but stupid no. She knew Margaret and if she suddenly got an order to kill someone she would gather information.
Some do but Lara does not and I do not get the impression that it is wide spread.
Thomas can do some magic but it is limited.
I find the timing weird for Justin to have been (whether he did it personally or had help) behind it. Harry is in the orphanage for four years between his father's death and Justin's adoption. It feels off to me that Justin would kill Malcolm and then chill out for four years until Harry develops his talent.
I find the timing weird for Justin to have been (whether he did it personally or had help) behind it. Harry is in the orphanage for four years between his father's death and Justin's adoption. It feels off to me that Justin would kill Malcolm and then chill out for four years until Harry develops his talent. That isn't to say that Justin wasn't watching, though. If it was a year—maybe two—I might be able to see it. But four years is a long time to wait after committing murder..It is also the smart thing to do if you are a long term planner and Justin apparently is.
Thomas also had a pretty good level wizard for a mother..... and I would assume most Council women would not hook up with a Whamp. The Whamps know OF magic, but use it? Maybe the Hunger dampens magical ability too - yes, Thomas may have some.. but who are his relatives? His mom was good, his brother is VERY good, and old Grandpa..... top of the heap.Hookup with a wizard is unlikely. Hookup with a warlock however would be very convenient, they are looking for protection from the white council after all.
More importantly papa Raith had no motive to kill Malcolm but a lot of reasons to kill Harry. Justin had reasons to kill Malcolm but no reasons to kill Harry. What happened?I was never arguing that a Raith killed Malcolm. I was arguing that a death certificate saying he died of an aneurism makes sense no matter who killed him. I've don't think whoever killed Malcolm is dead and defeated, so I don't think it's just Lord Raith or just Justin (unless Justin is still around).
Het father at this point. But why would she leave Harry malive and kill the father and not the other way round.Because she's much less of a monster than her father. Her father orders Malcolm killed for the reason I stated above. He has been assuming Harry died at birth or is oblivious to the particulars of Margaret's death. He seems the type to miss little things like this, but that might be because he's incapable of feeding when we meet him and is slowly going insane. His inattention to details would also explain why it took six years for him to order Malcolm's death.
Because she's much less of a monster than her father. Her father orders Malcolm killed for the reason I stated above. He has been assuming Harry died at birth or is oblivious to the particulars of Margaret's death. He seems the type to miss little things like this, but that might be because he's incapable of feeding when we meet him and is slowly going insane. His inattention to details would also explain why it took six years for him to order Malcolm's death.
Actually we don't know how much of a monster Lara is capable of being. Just because your pet tiger seems tame, don't ever forget that it is a wild animal and it's instinct is to eat you... ::)Sure, but Lord Raith was evil for evil's sake. Lara doesn't seem to enjoy petty cruelties like he did. While I think that makes Lara less of a monster, I also think it makes her a more capable monster.
Sure, but Lord Raith was evil for evil's sake. Lara doesn't seem to enjoy petty cruelties like he did. While I think that makes Lara less of a monster, I also think it makes her a more capable monster.
I don't know about that, consider her vanilla guards, when they were badly injured protecting her, she fed them to her fellows instead of heroic measures to try and save them..