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Messages - GrandPanjandrum

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31
First of all...well done on all the research and outlining.  It takes a while to digest it all...but well done.  You've pointed out a number of things I've overlooked.  Not the least of which is that someone used a talisman on the hexenbelts.  Until Cold Days, I always assumed that the Erlking hooked up the FBI guys.  Then, in Cold Days, the Erlking seemed to be solid and a pal of Kringle's (and ultimately a confidante of Harry's). 

So, someone stole something magical from him to infuse the belts. 

32
I had been thinking of all that as Mavra having a beef with the White Court in general over the Stokerlypse rather than Thomas in particular, and doesn't Mavra, during that attack, characterise Thomas, Lara and Inari all by their relationships to Lord Raith, suggesting he's the one she sees as her actual target ?

That was my impression, too.  And the fact that Lord Raith sent Thomas to Bianca's in Grave Peril (with the hopes of his demise) and keeping himself safe (due to his affliction ala Maggie Sr) seems to back that up...since Mavra was a guest of that party.

33
According to wikipedia, the pageboy style was popular in the 60s.

Check out the Hairstyles of the Romanticism Era (about 900 AD) which would be about the time Morgana would have come of age as a wizard. 

Quote
...the ordinary citizens had their hair in page-boy style, short or chin-length.
http://library.thinkquest.org/26829/3-styles_e.htm

34
im a very big Mavra cheerleader around here.. but i dont think shes strong enought to be Mab's mysterious long lost sister. Mavra's not even an elder, most likely. From what Eb implied, she's the Black Court's 007, not  a boss.

I think operating a wizard while you're dead is probably kind of a hinderance.  The most obvious example of this would be the Darkhallow.  The strength of the recipient gains more and more power by absorbing (or eating) the power of others.  It results in the human residents within a five mile radius having their life pulled right out of them into the recipient as well.  It seems to me that there is a definite relationship between life and magical power.

I'd counter that the fact that Mavra can perform any magic at all (including flawless veils, multiple thralls, mind communication, and dazzling illusions) suggest that Mavra was a real powerhouse before she was turned to the Black Court.

On a side note, her pageboy Hamlet hair reflects about 500 AD.  Which was supposed to be about the time of the Pendragons.

35
DF Reference Collection / Re: [Spoilers for all books] Theories index
« on: December 19, 2012, 12:57:56 AM »
New Theory:

Mavra is Morgana le Fay and secured Kemmerler's Word to return to life
Source:  http://www.jimbutcheronline.com/bb/index.php/topic,35969.msg1709532.html#msg1709532

Thanks,
GrandPanjandrum

36
DF Reference Collection / Re: Morgana Le Fay (includes CD spoilers)
« on: December 19, 2012, 12:41:04 AM »
Because:

Morgan Le Fey (the original) is dead

She, most definitely, is dead.  Of course, now that she holds The Word of Kemmerler, she can probably improve her color and smell a bit.  Mavra is Morgana le Fay  *gasp*. 

It seems to me that she wanted to "outlive" the original Merlin for some reason.  So she permitted herself to be taken by a Black Court Master.  Now, she intends to use the premier "Journal of Necromantic Medicine" to return to her live self.  In the interim, she has been spending her time tearing down all that Merlin might hold dear:

1.  She attempted to secure Excalibur by trading with her own Athame. Thwarted by Harry.
2.  She used the Red Court as a cat's paw to start a war with Merlin's White Council (hoping to destroy it). Again, thwarted by Harry.
3.  She attempted to use Outsiders/ sorcerers/ and thralls to destroy Demonreach, because it is one of Merlin's most exquisite accomplishments.  Once again, thwarted by Harry.

In Blood Rites, Mavra shows up and stupidly attacks Harry, Thomas and Mouse for no reason with no result.  The purpose was to let Harry know she's in town, and a challenge to hunt her down.  She doesn't come out and play herself, because the whole basis of her visiting Chicago was to lead him by the nose to her lair.  Assume he would bring allies, and compromise those allies with photos.  Murphy worked out perfectly for leverage to secure Kemmerler's Word.  She needs it to...well...come back to life.

Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned.  Of course, Merlin anticipated this and is sleeping deep down in Demonreach well waiting.  Not one to go in his sleep, indeed.  Can we read your journals now, Ebenezer? :o

Truly, I think you can find direct and indirect connections to Mavra/ Morgana le Fay in every single book in the series so far.

37
Bear in mind that when Harry was about to execute Arianna at the end of the duel, he made note that she was skewered in numerous places by the shards of ice that he directed towards her including the one in her stomach. Unless Arianna could ignore the spike that opened her blood reservoir, (which makes Ramps weaker than kittens), I find it unlikely that she could have managed to attempt any spell against Harry with a single word just before he craters her.

Good point...but think about this...it didn't work.  If it was the Corpsetaker's spell, Arianna would own Harry's body, and Harry would be non-existent.

38
Greetings

Arianna's one word is more likely to be soething like 'don't' in Maya as Harry raises his right hand to finish her off (which is what he does). 

If we had any evidence for Arianna knowing anything about transfer spells, for the RC spirit transferring too etc I'd go for it as an interesting theory.  But at present there's nothing I'm aware of to give it weight.

Regards

Edward

Yeah...maybe.  But, in Changes just before her big flattening ending as Harry is walking up to her, she is repeatedly saying "No...no...no...no..."  She switches to the unrecognized single word as she realizes Harry's intent and just before the "hammer."  That suggests a focus word for a prepared spell in my opinion (just in case).  And since we have a potential member of the "Black Circle" (Corpestaker) using that spell as her pièce de résistance in a tight spot as well as Arianna's granddaughter working hand in hand with Mavra (who could also be associated with Corpsetaker and is, most definitely trained in necromancy), and we, also, have a Red Court vampire centuries old who happens to be a sorceress, the potential is there to have learned the spell from any number of sources.

39
DF Reference Collection / Re: [Spoilers for all books] Theories index
« on: December 15, 2012, 05:38:18 PM »
No one's buying it, but I'm stubborn... >:( 

Arianna is the parasite in Harry's head (She and Lash are going to do the Angel/Demon sitting on Harry's shoulder thing)
http://www.jimbutcheronline.com/bb/index.php/topic,35880.msg1703849.html#msg1703849


Added.Elegast

40
One teensy nit-pick here. I believe Thomas does have some magic of his own. I don't know if it's related to his being a WC Vampire but if I recall correctly,..... was it Back Up?...where he does use his pentacle necklace to track Harry...anyone want to back me up or dispute this?

Thomas holds a small amount of magic.  In White Knight he is able to find an exit from the Never Never and open it (strip club I think).   But, it doesn't really matter since Ebenezer points out that Mavra could have thrown a Death Curse at Harry...and she's definitely not human...or alive.

41
Greetings

I can't see any evidence for Arianna doing any sort of transfer.
Edward

Quote
She stared up at me with uncomprehending eyes, black blood staining her mouth. "Cattle.  You are c-cattle."
"Moo," I said. And I lifted my right hand.
Her eyes widened further.  She gasped a word I didn't know.

42
Hell.

What if the original source of the Red Court (whatever the Red King had) jumped into Harry when the Red King died?

Didn't Harry lose the two minutes pretty much right as the spell was going out?

Read #2 of the first post on this thread...concerning the black out.

43
Great theory.

I don't agree with it but it is still a great theory.  Well presented.

BTW, one of the comments here got me to thinking of the 'bursting forth' as metaphor for childbirth.

I have been having trouble figuring out why Lash would want to hurt Harry but if it is some sort of metaphysical process that she can not control and she is going to be split off from Harry (cutting the umbilical cord, so to speak) then I can see how the imagery and symbolism could fit.

I think Lash is growing a soul ever since she practiced Free Will in White Knight.  But, I think she, also, has company in there.

Your comment got me thinking about the dreams that went out into the world to pregnant women when the curse was released.  That's kind of interesting from a "conception" point of view relative to Arianna.

44
My issue here is that this theory completely discounts the actual headaches in the past.  In Turn Coat, his headaches have gotten so bad that Butters is trying to get him into an MRI machine.  In Cold Days, he says they've been growing "steadily worse" "over the past few years".  Harry certainly doesn't see this as a case of two different types of headaches, but as a continuation of the ones plaguing him. 
Ebenezar says Mavra can do one, since she has a wizard level talent.

In Turn Coat he only had one entity in there, but ever since White Knight that entity displayed free will.  As Uriel stated..."You are a soul, you have a body."  So, I'd say that the headaches since White Knight were Lash growing a soul in Harry's body.  The escalation in Cold Days (where Harry points out that he's gone all but unconcious) is a combination of Lash's new soul, and Arianna's very real residence.  You can take the "two separate ice picks" as two separate entities, or vampire fangs. 

I can't imagine Jim Butcher missing an opportunity to have what equivocates to an Angel and a Demon inside Harry's head...especially with all the important decisions that have fallen to him.  It is the stereotypical angel on one shoulder, demon on the other duking it out.  Too fun.

45
orbweaver, liverspots was fully human when he cast his death curse, albeit a weak pansy ass one... he was practitioner enough without the coin, so i don't think that counts as non human. a half blood like martin or even thomas might have one too if they knew magic. bianca was full vamp. pretty sure even denarian with a coin is still technically human anyway.

If you think about it...it really doesn't have to be a death curse.  When Corpsetaker changes place with Luccio...it's just really good timing.  I guess it depends on how powerful Arianna was...and how learned.  Based on her age...she had a long time to learn.

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