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Messages - WillH

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16
DFRPG / Re: The concept of conceding
« on: May 05, 2011, 02:21:05 PM »
That's not how I see it. If someone concedes he concedes. There isn't anything someone can do against it. The only thing that can be done at this point is to haggle about the conditions of the concede. If someone could just veto the concession, then the hole concept would be meaningless.

You offer a concession. There is no requirement to accept that offer.

17
DFRPG / Re: Taken Out Result
« on: May 03, 2011, 05:01:35 PM »
You know, I would not be surprised if the player in question does not even realize there is a distinction between incite and feeding. If that's the case don't play gotcha with them. Just let them feed. Heck, I would assume someone with both abilities was doing both unless they specifically said otherwise or it was not possible.

18
DFRPG / Re: Taken Out Result
« on: May 03, 2011, 04:10:10 PM »
Actually, it depends.

If it was ranged incite emotion, then the target may be dead, insane, dominated or similar but the vampire cannot have fed.
if it was melee incite emotion but the vampire did not double the attack into a feeding, then the results are as above and the PC either forgot or chose not to feed.
If it was melee incite emotion and the vampire doubled up the attack into a feeding, then the target is dead and the vampire gets free recovery.

Even in those first two cases you could describe the taken out result as the victim being overwhelmed with emotion and made helpless allowing you to move in and feed. The only way it would really be an issue is if there was still an ongoing fight and feeding would require you to change zones, or if touching the victim was somehow impossible at the moment.

19
DFRPG / Re: Noob seeking... pretty much everything...
« on: April 21, 2011, 01:40:19 PM »
In searching for a place that sells DFRPG, I did come across a gaming shop/meeting place.  They don't carry this game, but still might be worth looking into.

Even if they don't carry it they should be able to order it for you. Tell them it's distributed by Alliance. Even if they have never heard of the game they should be able to figure it out from there.

20
DFRPG / Re: Don't Shoot Me, but I don't love group city creation
« on: April 20, 2011, 06:30:15 PM »
Is your problem you don't like players having input on things like threats and themes, or are you feeling constrained like you have to stay within what you created?

21
DFRPG / Re: A bit frustrated
« on: April 20, 2011, 04:58:54 PM »
If only we had some kind of points that could be used to compel shit like this and figure out what the fictional ramifications of mind spells are in our games?

James, That wouldn't solve anything. It would be like trying to compel an aspect when there is disagreement about what the aspect means. They need to decide what the laws mean in their game, then the fate should flow.

To go back up to some of the advice early on in the thread, could I have Invoked for effect?

Like so many thing when it comes to magic, there is no one right answer. What you did is perfectly valid. So are a lot of the other suggestions.

22
DFRPG / Re: A bit frustrated
« on: April 20, 2011, 02:51:21 PM »

My take on the Fourth Law issue:

You didn't force people to change their mind, implant thoughts or emotions, you just stopped action.  No more harmful than a "Bigby's Grasping Hand" force style spell.  No Laws broken even if it were purely mortal magic.

You didn't even stop them from being upset that you stopped the action or interfered with their ability to want to commit harm, you just them from being able to.

YS240
Quote
Here, enthralling is any effort made to change the natural inclinations, choices, and behaviors of another person.

The natural inclination of the people involved was to continue fighting. Magic wasn't used to physically restrain them like a Bigby type spell. Magic was used on the minds of the victims to prevent them from acting according to their natural inclinations, a 4th law violation*. As a side note, the 4th law is all about what the road to hell is paved with.

*Sponsored magic issues aside.

23
DFRPG / Re: A bit frustrated
« on: April 20, 2011, 02:14:16 PM »
Jack, Taran, I'm getting a sense you guys don't want to play around with the potential lawbreaker issues here. If that's the case just don't do it. The warden character didn't see it. Just keep him clueless on this topic. Or you can retcon things and say the spell was one of the cool non lawbreaking options posted earlier.  I think that would be passing a golden opportunity, but I'm not in your game.

On lawbreaking and the sight/soulgaze, I don't know about the sight, but soulgaze would show something. The novels even give the impression a soulgaze is a routine part of investigating a warlock.

Sponsored magic and the laws, you need to decide as a group, both respect to the universe and council.

24
DFRPG / Re: A bit frustrated
« on: April 20, 2011, 01:44:54 PM »
But with respects to the White Council, as the Warden on the scene, he gets to decide.

He gets to decide in the same way a cop gets to decide to pull someone over for speeding or look the other way. But, the law is the law, and cops who look the other way can run into problems with their superiors. They same goes for wardens.

Generally speaking the warden higher ups would probably just go with the call made by the warden on the scene. But that would make this situation much less interesting.

25
DFRPG / Re: A bit frustrated
« on: April 20, 2011, 05:01:04 AM »
ETA=Edit to add. If someone else responds while a post is being added to it lets people know why things are out of order.

As far as the 4th law goes, ask to questions. Was magic used on another person's mind? Did that magic prevent them from acting as they wished to? If the answer to both is yes, it's a law violation.


As far as  sponsored magic and the Laws go, one of the PC's is a warden...and a devout Catholic 

That just makes the situation even more awesome. My call as GM here would be as far as the universe is concerned it is not a violation (no stunt required), but as far as the White Council concerned it is. This will highlight the warden's internal conflict even more than just a full law violation to the universe and council. Enjoy the fate. Things are about to get interesting.


26
DFRPG / Re: A bit frustrated
« on: April 20, 2011, 04:30:36 AM »
A debate was sparked post-game:  Does this spell break the 4th Law???  It seems to suit the theme of soulfire..being all peaceful and such


I would say that most certainly both breaks the 4th Law and is in the spirit of soulfire. And awesome

ETA OK there is the whole if you use nonmortal magic from a sponsor does it break the laws debate, so not certainly.


27
DFRPG / Re: A bit frustrated
« on: April 19, 2011, 07:51:32 PM »
If super nasty 10 refresh monsters go down with a single shot every time, that seems a bit silly to me.

If a single attack does enough stress to blow through the targets stress track, then it is realistic for the attack to take out the target. Consequences are not another type of hit points you have to chew through. They are an option the person controlling the target has to reduce the amount of stress taken. They can be used or not depending on what the situation calls for.

Quote
Whether it takes them or not depends completely on its will to live and belief in whatever mission it was on.

The character's will, belief or any other in character motivation is completely irrelevant. The decision of whether or not to take consequences and what those consequences will be is one made by the person controlling the character. This decision is made based on what that person wants in the narrative and what they think the situation calls for. Consequences are about what people want, not the hypothetical desires of the fictional entities they control.

28
DFRPG / Re: A bit frustrated
« on: April 19, 2011, 06:50:26 PM »
A slippery slope to an unbelievable narrative and characters who are never challenged in combat.

How would it lead to an unbelievable narrative?

29
DFRPG / Re: A bit frustrated
« on: April 19, 2011, 06:11:47 PM »
Yeah...I went searching for those.  The appendix is a little lacking.


Look under the Ambush trapping of Steal on YS142.

30
DFRPG / Re: The strength of your rotes
« on: April 19, 2011, 05:26:53 PM »
@WillH;
Your method has the reverse problems artificers have...

Good analysis, That kind of response is exactly why I made this thread. Thanks

Personally, I give a lot of weight to points b and f. On point d, I think I've already established stress doesn't bother me. Point c is a definite weakness, but good enough for most of my purposes. Point e would be an outlier scenario for my play style, so not an issue for me.

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