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The Dresden Files => DF Spoilers => Topic started by: Mr. Mouse on October 31, 2021, 05:15:41 PM
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Here's the references to Toot's height I can find in all the novels:
| Stormfront | 6" |
| Summer Knight | About 6" |
| Small Favor | "About twice as tall" |
| Turn Coat | 12" |
| Changes | 15" |
| Cold Days | 18" |
| Battleground | 30" |
Toot's growth in stature both from what he and the Za Guard do themselves combined with his small share of reflected glory from what Harry does, he was five times his original size even before the "Legion of Za" provided air defense for the defenders of Chicago and Harry bound a Titan. How tall will he be next time we see him and will he be as tall as Harry by the end of the BAT?
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Sounds like he is now as tall as some four or five year olds.. But that doesn't seem to apply to "ZaGard" though, when you read about the air battle against the squid things in battle ground, the fighters all seemed to be tiny as opposed to flying toddlers or bigger.
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Here's the references to Toot's height I can find in all the novels:
| Stormfront | 6" |
| Summer Knight | About 6" |
| Small Favor | "About twice as tall" |
| Turn Coat | 12" |
| Changes | 15" |
| Cold Days | 18" |
| Battleground | 30" |
Toot's growth in stature both from what he and the Za Guard do themselves combined with his small share of reflected glory from what Harry does, he was five times his original size even before the "Legion of Za" provided air defense for the defenders of Chicago and Harry bound a Titan. How tall will he be next time we see him and will he be as tall as Harry by the end of the BAT?
| Stormfront | 15 cm |
| Summer Knight | About 15 cm |
| Small Favor | "About twice as tall" |
| Turn Coat | 30 cm |
| Changes | 38 cm |
| Cold Days | 46 cm |
| Battleground | 76 cm |
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| Stormfront | 15 cm |
| Summer Knight | About 15 cm |
| Small Favor | "About twice as tall" |
| Turn Coat | 30 cm |
| Changes | 38 cm |
| Cold Days | 46 cm |
| Battleground | 76 cm |
Or now he is six inches short of being three feet tall. However nothing is said about his minions..
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Do guys think he is growing due to his relationship with Harry, or does he grow as the Za Lord's Guard grows?
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He grows because of power and purpose. As Harry grows and Harry gives him more responsibility he grows.
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In one respect it was a blessing Karin Murphy never lived long enough to see one of the ‘Little Folk’ tower over her at 5 feet, 1/2 inch.
Lacuna is a shade behibd in height and the rest of the Za Guard just behind her. The auxiliaries all probably will grow a little as well but less so.
Toot will or should have grown considerably after Battle Ground, Harry’s relationship and control over the Little Folk will have grown considerably following the events at the Castle, and the role he had in taking out the Titan. The Supernatural world by and large didn’t consider him to be a nuclear power, which he has been since acquiring Demonreach, but they presume he has the Eye, so now they do.
Given his increasing size, Toots voice should be on the verge or breaking and deepening in forthcoming portrayals, Jim should consider this JUST to torment James Marsters.
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At this rate, I suspect Toot must veil while flying about or be seen as some child-sized flying whatever.
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At their current size Toot and the Za Guard might be mistaken for drones, so if Harry does end up owning Pizza S’ Press they can be pressed into service delivering pizza. All Harry needs to do then is figure out how to stop them eating it before delivering it. Which may be impossible.
The Little Folk are very good at not being seen when they don’t want to be, but people’s minds would fill in a more familiar shape even so, so that purple flash flying by quickly? Just a drone, not a purple little man with wings carrying a pizza box at all.
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At their current size Toot and the Za Guard might be mistaken for drones, so if Harry does end up owning Pizza S’ Press they can be pressed into service delivering pizza. All Harry needs to do then is figure out how to stop them eating it before delivering it. Which may be impossible.
The Little Folk are very good at not being seen when they don’t want to be, but people’s minds would fill in a more familiar shape even so, so that purple flash flying by quickly? Just a drone, not a purple little man with wings carrying a pizza box at all.
Oh I don't know, the last few years have taught me that people are very capable of believing and seeing what they want or are told in spite of facts to the contrary.. So Harry presents Toot on social media and in television commercials as Pizza S"Press's cute new delivery drone, many will buy it..
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And as a corporate mascot.
Imagine all that belief piled into Toot.Forget the King and the Clown.
I suppose you could run a pizza tax, ask for faerie delivery and forfeit a slice and have Toot under a geas not to take more than a slice. Probably worth it for children to see the Pizza Faerie, and reinforce belief in the supernatural. Of course it would be the biggest slice, with the most topping.
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And as a corporate mascot.
Imagine all that belief piled into Toot.Forget the King and the Clown.
I suppose you could run a pizza tax, ask for faerie delivery and forfeit a slice and have Toot under a geas not to take more than a slice. Probably worth it for children to see the Pizza Faerie, and reinforce belief in the supernatural. Of course it would be the biggest slice, with the most topping.
Yeah, I had thought to add that as well but my sleep deprived brain couldn't line up the words..
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The other thing to remember is that whilst you don’t eat food from the Never Never (because it is empty calories and turns to ectoplasm) a creature from the NeverNever could slowly become real if it eats nothing but mortal food.
All of Toots growth in the real world has been entirely fuelled by pizza, he is therefore at this point comprised of 100% pizza mortal world molecules.
This may explain Little Folk hunger for mortal food, even Lacuna goes for celery.
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even Lacuna goes for celery.
if you can call that food...
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I call it a flavouring, you will be surprised at the amount of processed food it has been added to in trace amounts. Very unhealthy.
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This thread begs a different question. So, Toot is getting noticeably larger and so is Lacuna. The guard must also be getting larger though not to same degree as Toot Toot. The White Council members present were noticeably disturbed when Harry summoned an army of little people, how disturbed will they be when many of those tiny fae are normal sized or close to normal sized fae?
Harry is scary enough when Mab empowers him; with the Banner, to command the fae like the Malks and other nasty types in Battle Ground, but he'd be terrifying if he can call his own normal sized fae army any time he wants them. It's only a matter of time before Toot and Lacuna will need full sized swords and perhaps the rest of the guard will get by with daggers.
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Agreed. Even without the Winter Banner. Dresden has his own personal army.
Think of an army of the Tracker Jacker or the Wasp or Ant Man from Marvel.
An army that most people can't see, except the occasional flicker of light, he could quite literally order them to be his own personal assassins.
I don't think such an application occurs to Harry let alone for him to use it, but if I were a White Council Stooge or a Fae like Redcap, Vadderung or the Erlking it might occur to me then.
Thats why they were all afraid when Harry called them to service. Thousands of mini soldiers, when only a couple dozen killed a Summer Lady.
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Tactically at the moment the Za Guard can provide reconnaissance and aerial supprt, but would also be useful for sabotage. Imagine if Harry had shown the Za Guard a handgrenade and said “extra Large pizza with everything on it, for the Fae who can collect the most of these from the Turtlenecks and their allies”
BOOM.
They sabotaged the car of the photographer Vince, imagine them fouling guns, pulling pins, stabbing eyeballs and at least in one case inserting a toothbrush where a toothbrush was never intended to go.
Getting larger they would be able to handle more direct warfare against a larger foe. Imagine a swarm of Little Folk taking on the Hounds with a load of small Molotov cocktails
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This thread begs a different question. So, Toot is getting noticeably larger and so is Lacuna. The guard must also be getting larger though not to same degree as Toot Toot. The White Council members present were noticeably disturbed when Harry summoned an army of little people, how disturbed will they be when many of those tiny fae are normal sized or close to normal sized fae?
Harry is scary enough when Mab empowers him; with the Banner, to command the fae like the Malks and other nasty types in Battle Ground, but he'd be terrifying if he can call his own normal sized fae army any time he wants them. It's only a matter of time before Toot and Lacuna will need full sized swords and perhaps the rest of the guard will get by with daggers.
But then, one has to ask, will they be as effective? Being tiny motes of light has it's advantages, like stealth and agility.
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Their speed and agility seems undiminished, but as they get larger they can veil, and as Harry found out in Ghost Story your opponents rarely look up.
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Their speed and agility seems undiminished, but as they get larger they can veil, and as Harry found out in Ghost Story your opponents rarely look up.
They are also bigger targets, also Mab might start to feel threatened, feeling paranoid because she sees Harry and Molly as a team, and now with a credible loyal army..
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Nah, oath of fealty they are sworn to Harry and Harry I sworn to Mab.
Michael Carpenter at the end of Battle Ground just swore.
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Nah, oath of fealty they are sworn to Harry and Harry I sworn to Mab.
Michael Carpenter at the end of Battle Ground just swore.
But the little Folk are a little different, Mab remarks on it at the end of Summer Knight, even she was taken a little aback that Harry has their alliance.
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That was before Mab had Harry's allegiance.
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The Little Folk were originally Wildfae with no allegiance to anyone but
pizza Harry, but when Harry became the Winter Knight their allegiance to pizza Harry carried over to Winter. Except for frozen pizza.
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The Little Folk were originally Wildfae with no allegiance to anyone but pizza Harry, but when Harry became the Winter Knight their allegiance to pizza Harry carried over to Winter. Except for frozen pizza.
Yeah, but so far no pizza from Mab.. ;)
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Harry is the source of pizza, not Mab, Mab has to provide Harry with the wherewithal to provide sufficient pizza, though not sure Toot has a concept of sufficient pizza.
Mab understands this, and needs to make the provision.
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Harry is the source of pizza, not Mab, Mab has to provide Harry with the wherewithal to provide sufficient pizza, though not sure Toot has a concept of sufficient pizza.
Mab understands this, and needs to make the provision.
Yeah, well, as long as Mab understands that Toot and Za'Guard won't go for pepperoni made from ectoplasm... ::)
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Lacuna would though.....
Mab needs to buy Pizza S’Press and give it to Harry for services rendered in relation to Battle Ground.
However, the Za’Guard are already tricked out in the Pizza S’Press corporate livery in Battle Ground. Neither Mab nor Molly can tell a lie, so I would think this would include passing off someone’s else’s livery as her own, so by Battle Ground she already owned Pizza S’Press. I suspect Molly may have been behind this investment, she has the Winter Credit Card and knows about Toot’s pizza addiction love and respect for Harry. She is Mab’s official recruiter and provisions for troops would be within her remit and she did provide the armour and weapons for the Guard. Ergo Molly bought pizza S’Press so Winter has a lawful right to use their livery.
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Leansidhe kept up Harry's debt to the Za Lor'ds Guard while he was in a coma during Ghost Story. I imagine Moly has a similar compulsion.
As for Mab Harry had to twist his viewpoint and reasoning 2 times before she understood it enough in her own terms.
"Ah. You found a weakness in their psychology and manipulated it. You provided them with a resource and incurred their debt."
Besides they owe their allegiance to Harry who owes his allegiance to Mab. As far as Mab is concerned that just makes Harry a more powerful tool for her, which in turn gives her more power.
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So enabling the pizza she strengthens Harry as a tool, one that she might wield as she pleases.
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I disagree, I think it was about mantles.
The WK was involved as summoned by Mab, and the Warden of Demonreach volunteered to bind the Titan. When the squid-things attacked, the Za-Lord of the Little Folk joined the battle; in acknowledgement of support his Guard was armed as befitting their service.
I think this is why Mab smiled at Harry when he said he'd handle it. I really do think the Za-Lord is a minor mantle of the Wyldfae, independent of Harry's other identities.
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Not everything is a Mantle, it is a title, and may be given legitimacy by Mab’s recognition of it.
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Not everything is a Mantle, it is a title, and may be given legitimacy by Mab’s recognition of it.
Here, I disagree. Za Lord is a mantle Harry is creating, I think- I would think it very Butcher that Mab's reference to immortality is regarding the Za Lord
Edit: In fact, Toot's complete non-concern at Harry dying would make sense- like the Erlking, he'd get better.
It would also explain why he was out of the Council, but not under a death sentence- he's achieved what Kemmler needed workarounds for.
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Mantles don’t evolve from nothing, they are created. The Six Queens two Knights and Kringle are the only Mantles we are told are Mantles, nine in total. The are overladen the original being, hence the name. If Harry is accruing power as the Za Lord it is due to him, and him alone. It dies with him. The Little Folk allegiance to Winter would not.
My guess is Kringle was created as an interlocutor with the White God, for the Fae given that Kringle and Uriel lunch once a year. Kringle is the White God’s man within Winter, the current defenders of the gate, and there with Winters blessing, like a member of an allied military.
Toot does not have any concern for Harry, because Harry is not Pizza.
Jim has said to stop seeing Mantles in everything.