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The Dresden Files => DF Spoilers => Topic started by: LostInTime on March 12, 2021, 03:00:19 AM
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In the Pennsacon WOJ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VA6hcE5-YCA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VA6hcE5-YCA) Jim says that
...Though Molly's sort of... her story path is not... it's not towards being familiar and human...
I gotta say, this has killed a lot of my investment in the books. I'm not concerned about Harry. He gets battered and bruised, but it's the people around him that always wind up paying. If Molly falls to Winter completely, I'm out. I will be Farcry 5, GOT Season 8 pissed. Harry promised to get out of Winter and bring Molly with him. Just like he promised to save Susan.
Harry is turning into the Destroyer. But it's his friend's lives he destroys.
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In the Pennsacon WOJ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VA6hcE5-YCA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VA6hcE5-YCA) Jim says that
I gotta say, this has killed a lot of my investment in the books. I'm not concerned about Harry. He gets battered and bruised, but it's the people around him that always wind up paying. If Molly falls to Winter completely, I'm out. I will be Farcry 5, GOT Season 8 pissed. Harry promised to get out of Winter and bring Molly with him. Just like he promised to save Susan.
Harry is turning into the Destroyer. But it's his friend's lives he destroys.
I'm with you on that.. On season 8 of GOT as well.. In that sense Battle Ground has me worried because the big mistake the writers made in GOT is they mistakenly thought all the fans wanted to
see was bigger and bloodier battles, and skimped on the characters behind it all. There was a lot of bang in the last two books, but very little light.
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In the Pennsacon WOJ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VA6hcE5-YCA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VA6hcE5-YCA) Jim says that
I gotta say, this has killed a lot of my investment in the books. I'm not concerned about Harry. He gets battered and bruised, but it's the people around him that always wind up paying. If Molly falls to Winter completely, I'm out. I will be Farcry 5, GOT Season 8 pissed. Harry promised to get out of Winter and bring Molly with him. Just like he promised to save Susan.
Harry is turning into the Destroyer. But it's his friend's lives he destroys.
Yeah it's a bit of a bad sign right after The Good People gave me hope for her being able to be Molly and the WL at the same time.
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It does sound bad, but... kinda wondering if it's gonna be the BAT where Harry can drag her back?
After all, being a succesful Lady, while it can include SOME better things, is still alien and inhuman. And Molly's struggle in that regard is going to be like Harry's but worse.
(though it does make me worry why Jim hates families; the basics for Molly resisting evil are certainly a lot better than for Harry, even if her basics for resisting self-sacrifice are worse).
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It doesn't mean that Molly's future is going to be dark, it just won't be human. If she becomes the new Mab at some point, she will be Fae and think like a Fae. However if her situation is different from the current Mab, it might mean just normal Winter.
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Ok, so my take on that comment is that she is going to be doing more and more WL duties that we can't know about (I take that to mean Jim has no plans on anymore shorts). But it doesn't mean that she will end the series as a part of Winter or even fae. The whole comment was based on the question of if there will be anymore Molly shorts.
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It doesn't mean that Molly's future is going to be dark, it just won't be human. If she becomes the new Mab at some point, she will be Fae and think like a Fae. However if her situation is different from the current Mab, it might mean just normal Winter.
There are probably more ways of being winter queen than Mabs. Molly would do an important job, she would have purpose. And of course a litter of changelings. I do not think she would be unhappy.
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There are probably more ways of being winter queen than Mabs. Molly would do an important job, she would have purpose. And of course a litter of changelings. I do not think she would be unhappy.
She isn't having any kids unless she's free of Winter. She would never want what happened to her, Mab's kids, or any of the children she is taking as tribute to happen to her kids. So a litter of changelings ain't happening
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She isn't having any kids unless she's free of Winter. She would never want what happened to her, Mab's kids, or any of the children she is taking as tribute to happen to her kids. So a litter of changelings ain't happening
Just because Mab wasn't a very good parent doesn't mean that Molly won't be. Yes, Maeve had issues, which the infection only made worse.. However Sarrissa appears to be well adjusted and sane. So does that make Mab half bad as a parent?
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Just because Mab wasn't a very good parent doesn't mean that Molly won't be. Yes, Maeve had issues, which the infection only made worse.. However Sarrissa appears to be well adjusted and sane. So does that make Mab half bad as a parent?
Wasn't referring to Mab's parenting. Was just referring to what happened to them. That they were pretty much doomed from the start. Even if neither were the WL, they were still a target against Mab. They also are apart of Winter.
So just like Fix, Ace, and Meyrl back in SK, any child of Molly's if she were to have any as the WQ, they could be called to fight and die. And her reactions in GS says that she doesn't want to see her loved ones die.
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I wouldn't call them doomed, the job of Winter Lady and Summer Lady have to be filled.. Humanity depends upon them, life depends upon them.
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I wouldn't call them doomed, the job of Winter Lady and Summer Lady have to be filled.. Humanity depends upon them, life depends upon them.
Right, but I was saying that whether or not they became Ladies, they were still a target to die. Be it because they were Mab's children and a target against Mab, be it they were called to fight in battle, or be it because they would be a part of Winter and a target for Summer.
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Well, the fae courts are done as guardians of the Outer Gates, per WOJ, by the end of the series. I don't know if that's a good or evil harbinger for our heroes. Jim might also be lying to us.
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Right, but I was saying that whether or not they became Ladies, they were still a target to die. Be it because they were Mab's children and a target against Mab, be it they were called to fight in battle, or be it because they would be a part of Winter and a target for Summer.
That is overly pessimistic. They can choose fae and have a longer than human life that might end horribly or they can choose human. After the apocalypse there might be centuries were nothing special happens.
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That is overly pessimistic. They can choose fae and have a longer than human life that might end horribly or they can choose human. After the apocalypse there might be centuries were nothing special happens.
But in the case for Molly, she wouldn't want to see her loved ones die by either being killed or by old age. She has already stated that it bothers her that she will outlive all her family and loved ones. The only loved one who she wouldn't have outlived when she was (and I believe will be again) a human wizard was Harry.
So either way, fae or human, it is not something Molly wants to go through. And my guess is not something she wants to put on anyone either, like children.
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But in the case for Molly, she wouldn't want to see her loved ones die by either being killed or by old age. She has already stated that it bothers her that she will outlive all her family and loved ones. The only loved one who she wouldn't have outlived when she was (and I believe will be again) a human wizard was Harry.
So either way, fae or human, it is not something Molly wants to go through. And my guess is not something she wants to put on anyone either, like children.
You should not avoid love or friendship because it will be over one day. It will bother her but it won’t stop her and it should not.
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You should not avoid love or friendship because it will be over one day. It will bother her but it won’t stop her and it should not.
I agree.
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You should not avoid love or friendship because it will be over one day. It will bother her but it won’t stop her and it should not.
Your right. But it is a choice not to have children, to put a burden on a child before they are ever born.
I never was saying that Molly would shut herself off from the everyone. I am saying that her character wouldn't want to have a child only to feed them to the wolves.
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Your right. But it is a choice not to have children, to put a burden on a child before they are ever born.
I never was saying that Molly would shut herself off from the everyone. I am saying that her character wouldn't want to have a child only to feed them to the wolves.
Sarissa had a better life than a big part of humanity and she now has a job that seems to suit her. If Maeve was not that crazy she could have made more of her life than she did, Molly herself proves that. Sure there are wolves but Molly’s children would be protected while young and have a lot of choices later, if Sarissa really hated her life she could have chosen human several times. She surely wanted to be born. Molly would be a better mother than Mab even as Mab.
Molly’s children would still be privileged and would still have far better opportunities in life than most humans in history.
Yes there are problems but that should not stop her.
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Molly is Dresden's soul mate. That will be how it ends. Not Murphy, not Lara, it's Molly. He will save her in the end.
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Molly is Dresden's soul mate. That will be how it ends. Not Murphy, not Lara, it's Molly. He will save her in the end.
It does not really look like she wants to be saved.
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Sarrisa literally spent half her life in Arctis Tor, in the freaking heart of Winter. For her protection.
Maeve was the WL, and immortal being who shouldn't have had to worry about being hurt. But had jobs, that we have learned of, that have turned Molly's stomach. Maybe that is part of why Maeve quit doing her job.
Either way, didn't feel much like a life worth living. One of them a necessary job, but not one that someone would wish on someone else
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Sarrisa literally spent half her life in Arctis Tor, in the freaking heart of Winter. For her protection.
Maeve was the WL, and immortal being who shouldn't have had to worry about being hurt. But had jobs, that we have learned of, that have turned Molly's stomach. Maybe that is part of why Maeve quit doing her job.
Either way, didn't feel much like a life worth living. One of them a necessary job, but not one that someone would wish on someone else
Sarissa had several careers outside arctis tor. She spent time there because she wanted to postpone her choice. She could have chosen human which tells you there were things she liked about fairy. It is nowhere said she spend all her time for her protection. She could not have had her mortal careers if that were the case. She spend part of her time there because of her deal with her mother. Part of her time was spent outside which indicates that the time spent in arctis tor was not just for her protection.
Maeve did not do her job because of mommy issues which were particular to her and her mother. There is no reason to believe that would be repeated with Molly and her children. Actually Molly is pretty good with children. Maeve was unhinged. Molly already proved that that is not a prerequisite for the job.
Again I don’t think Molly thinks her life not worth living. Everything indicates she does. I do not think Sarissa finds her life not worth living. I do not think Maeve is any indicator for what has to happen.
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Sarrisa literally spent half her life in Arctis Tor, in the freaking heart of Winter. For her protection.
Sarrisa also became a nurse among other things, her and her mother went to movies and did activities together. She appeared to be quite well adjusted when we met her in Cold Days. Sadly that didn't happen for Maeve, I'd like to know what happened to the Winter Lady before her. I don't think it was Mab, so for some reason Mab either had her eliminated or she died some other way. Thus Maeve was way too young to take up the burden and built up resentment over the years.
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Sarrisa also became a nurse among other things, her and her mother went to movies and did activities together. She appeared to be quite well adjusted when we met her in Cold Days. Sadly that didn't happen for Maeve, I'd like to know what happened to the Winter Lady before her. I don't think it was Mab, so for some reason Mab either had her eliminated or she died some other way. Thus Maeve was way too young to take up the burden and built up resentment over the years.
As a mother Mab was just not up to the task but children can react differently to that. Sarissa was just a better person.
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As a mother Mab was just not up to the task but children can react differently to that. Sarissa was just a better person.
Yeah, and sadly some children just don't turn out well, even if they have the best parents in the world. It's a mystery...
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A mom who doesn't hide the fact that you're intended as weapons and tools from the day you're born is just the sort of thing to leave kids with issues even without anything fae related.
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A mom who doesn't hide the fact that you're intended as weapons and tools from the day you're born is just the sort of thing to leave kids with issues even without anything fae related.
It doesn't seem that Sarissa had that impression.
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It doesn't seem that Sarissa had that impression.
Even if she had.
“To fulfill one’s purpose is not to be a slave, my daughter,” Mab said. “And you are not free, child, any more than a knife is free because it leaves its sheath and is thrust into a corpse.”
Countless people have lived that life serving faith, country, family or some other idea. Most of them serving things far less useful, true or real than Mab does. Born to defend reality? It can suffocate you or make you proud or maybe some other things depending on who you are. Sarissa understands her mother way better than Mab understands her daughter.
Sarissa understood that as demonstrated by her speech to her sister just before the end. It is no accident that Sarissa is far more emphatic and Maeve was far more egoistic. Maeve was the center of her universe.
That is the paradox. That is why Molly is a better winter lady than Maeve was. It is not all about yourself. Not in winter either.
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It doesn't seem that Sarissa had that impression.
To quote Wikipedia: The sarisa or sarissa (Greek: σάρισα) was a long spear or pike about 4–6 metres (13–20 ft) in length. It was introduced by Philip II of Macedon and was used in his Macedonian phalanxes as a replacement for the earlier dory, which was considerably shorter.
And about 40 minutes into this one Jim talks about how she intended Sarissa to be a weapon.
https://www.podbean.com/media/share/pb-wua9p-e40f53
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To quote Wikipedia:
And about 40 minutes into this one Jim talks about how she intended Sarissa to be a weapon.
https://www.podbean.com/media/share/pb-wua9p-e40f53
That is not the only meaning and a very unlikely meaning for most parents:
https://www.thebump.com/b/sarissa-baby-name
I actually know a Sarissa and I do not think she is named after a Greek Macedonian spear though she is relatively long and thin. The meaning of princess is also fitting and far more likely.
I do not think Mab would have named her daughter after a common soldiers infantry formation weapon anyway. There are better martial names.
But again she knows all about what her mother is and what her purpose is. There are no signs she actually disagrees.
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That is not the only meaning and a very unlikely meaning for most parents:
https://www.thebump.com/b/sarissa-baby-name
I actually know a Sarissa and I do not think she is named after a Greek Macedonian spear though she is relatively long and thin. The meaning of princess is also fitting and far more likely.
I do not think Mab would have named her daughter after a common soldiers infantry formation weapon anyway. There are better martial names.
But again she knows all about what her mother is and what her purpose is. There are no signs she actually disagrees.
Though Mab did say she was preparing Sarissa to take Maeve's job, because she felt she could work with Sarissa and wasn't a slacker like Maeve was.
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She would have done a better job but everything points to summer being a better fit for her and winter better for Molly.
Mab can be wrong.
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Though Mab did say she was preparing Sarissa to take Maeve's job, because she felt she could work with Sarissa and wasn't a slacker like Maeve was.
Molly’s parents have loads of children, she might have that capacity as well. Having changelings might help her keeping contact with the rest of the world and when there are many the pressure each individually feels will be less.
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Harry promised to get out of Winter and bring Molly with him. Just like he promised to save Susan.
And did he save Susan?
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And did he save Susan?
And this here is why he will save Molly at the end. Susan's and Molly's storylines are running similar. Harry is not going to lose another loved one like he did with Susan.
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She would have done a better job but everything points to summer being a better fit for her and winter better for Molly.
Mab can be wrong.
Unless Leah played Mab..... Think about it.. Who could possibly replace Mab if Molly isn't ready? Leah.... She's #2 to Mab in power level. She's the next option behind Molly.
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Unless Leah played Mab..... Think about it.. Who could possibly replace Mab if Molly isn't ready? Leah.... She's #2 to Mab in power level. She's the next option behind Molly.
But if Mab wanted Lea as her Lady, she would be it not the one who was doing the grooming to make Molly a new possible Lady.
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And did he save Susan?
In a sense yes. He saved her baby and probably her soul.
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And did he save Susan?
Exactly the point I was making.
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Unless Leah played Mab..... Think about it.. Who could possibly replace Mab if Molly isn't ready? Leah.... She's #2 to Mab in power level. She's the next option behind Molly.
It hasn't been shown yet, but every lady who has taken a mantle has been at least part mortal. We don't know what Aurora's origin was. But Maeve and Sarissa's father, according to a WOJ was an Austrian composer in the 1800s. Molly, of course, was fully human.
I'm not sure that Lea is qualified to be a lady.
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Unless Leah played Mab..... Think about it.. Who could possibly replace Mab if Molly isn't ready? Leah.... She's #2 to Mab in power level. She's the next option behind Molly.
I don't think Lea is a virgin. I think you have to be a virgin to be a lady.
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I don't think Lea is a virgin. I think you have to be a virgin to be a lady.
I think that you have to be virginal as The Lady and the mantle enforces that (see Molly and Ramirez), but I doubt you have to be an actual virgin. Sarissa is our only other direct example.
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I think that you have to be virginal as The Lady and the mantle enforces that (see Molly and Ramirez), but I doubt you have to be an actual virgin. Sarissa is our only other direct example.
And Lilly. I suspect the mantle can make you a virgin.
Besides if it was that easy Sarissa would have taken care of that.
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I think the mantles require holders to be mortal, not fae. The knights are always mortal. Titania and Mab were sisters and Mab drops that she was mortal in BG. Aurora was Titania's daughter, either before or after she took the mantle, so she's a question mark. Sarissa and Maever were Mab's daughters, per WOJ, by an Austrian composer in the 1800s. So, half mortal. Molly was fully human.
There's a strong argument that the leaders of the fae courts, guardians of reality, have to be mortal. I.E. have a strong connection to reality.
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I think the mantles require holders to be mortal, not fae. The knights are always mortal. Titania and Mab were sisters and Mab drops that she was mortal in BG. Aurora was Titania's daughter, either before or after she took the mantle, so she's a question mark. Sarissa and Maever were Mab's daughters, per WOJ, by an Austrian composer in the 1800s. So, half mortal. Molly was fully human.
There's a strong argument that the leaders of the fae courts, guardians of reality, have to be mortal. I.E. have a strong connection to reality.
Wow great theory.