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The Dresden Files => DF Spoilers => Topic started by: dspringer1 on August 10, 2017, 10:19:13 PM

Title: When is a Story not a Story?
Post by: dspringer1 on August 10, 2017, 10:19:13 PM

Sometimes a short story is just a fun story the author wished to tell.   And sometimes a short story is a sneaky way for the author to introduce factoids and back story that will become important in a later “main” story.  For this thread, I am going to assume JB is being sneaky.

JB has written several short stories since Skin Game and I am guessing he is using these stories to lay some groundwork.  This thread is devoted to guessing what those clues and factoids are.   If I remember correctly, we have the following short stories
•   Molly story where she travels to Alaska as Winter Lady
•   Luccio story set in the wild west
•   Butters story about a visit to the Zoo

While I have not yet read the last two, I have read the first.  It introduced several interesting factoids
1)   The Winter Lady Mantle protects winter secrets, forcing Molly to speak sexy banter instead of speaking plainly or revealing winter secrets
2)   The Winter Lady cannot have intercourse – not clear if this is pregnancy or if she must remain a virgin (technically). The Mantle will protect this.
3)   The WL is tasked, among other things, with ensuring the supply of Winter soldiers continues so that the outer gates are properly defended.   As such she is in communication with many wild fae groups that have agreements with Winter. 
4)   Carlos’ area of responsibility is very wide if he covers LA to Alaska.  That implies very few wardens in America. 
5)   Carlos was badly injured – and thus may not be present during Peace Talks. 
6)   Old gods keep trying to get back into our world (not a new factoid)

I can see #1 or #3 applying (potentially) to events in Peace Talks either in the sexualized banter Molly will surprise Harry with and/or the contacts Molly will have with attendees.   Conceivably #2 could be a path to attack the winter lady as well, if the White or Red Court vamps were attacking her.  #4 probably explains why there will be relatively few wardens at the peace talks. 

Other hints and foreshadowing that might come from the short stories?

Title: Re: When is a Story not a Story?
Post by: wardenferry419 on August 11, 2017, 01:05:53 AM

Jury Duty, also, takes place after Skin Game. Young Luccio acted very much like Harry does.

Title: Re: When is a Story not a Story?
Post by: KurtinStGeorge on August 11, 2017, 06:44:01 AM

Your wrong about Warden Ramirez. 

(click to show/hide)

From the first chapter of Peace Talks we know Ramirez  ...  I'm not saying any more than that.  I don't want to spoil anything for those who don't want to know more, but he's in the first chapter which means he's in the story.

Title: Re: When is a Story not a Story?
Post by: Quantus on August 11, 2017, 01:10:14 PM

Butter's story is about a mission to a hospital. The upcoming Harry/maggie story is the one about the Zoo (which might  be happening more or less at the same time).

A few big detail take-aways from Day One with Butters:

(click to show/hide)

-Michael more or less confirms that the Knights are guided/managed directly by TWG and not by Archangel intermediaries. 
-If enough people Believe in something (children being particularly good fo this) it can Both a)create a new being from scratch, or b)come close enough that an existing NN creature can slip into the new image and use it as a foothold. 
-TWG is not opposed to MMO's, despite how many Soul's they have devoured over the years... (:P)

Title: Re: When is a Story not a Story?
Post by: dspringer1 on August 11, 2017, 03:24:27 PM

TWG?  MMO?  Not familiar with these abbreviations. 

Title: Re: When is a Story not a Story?
Post by: Smaug with OCD on August 11, 2017, 04:07:18 PM

Quote from: dspringer1 on August 11, 2017, 03:24:27 PM

TWG?  MMO?  Not familiar with these abbreviations.

TWG: The White God (The Abrahamic God or Christianity, etc...)

MMO: Short-hand for MMORPG, meaning massively multiplayer online roleplaying game.

Title: Re: When is a Story not a Story?
Post by: Snark Knight on August 15, 2017, 03:00:02 PM

Quote from: dspringer1 on August 10, 2017, 10:19:13 PM

JB has written several short stories since Skin Game and I am guessing he is using these stories to lay some groundwork.  This thread is devoted to guessing what those clues and factoids are.   If I remember correctly, we have the following short stories
•   Molly story where she travels to Alaska as Winter Lady
•   Luccio story set in the wild west
•   Butters story about a visit to the Zoo

Molly's story (Cold Case) was released after SG because the anthology it was in got delayed, but it was written earlier and set just about a week after CD.

So Carlos has had about 17 months more than just the SG-PT interval to recover from his injuries. He won't likely be back to fit for hand to hand combat yet, basic mobility is probably reasonable.

Title: Re: When is a Story not a Story?
Post by: Quantus on August 15, 2017, 05:58:09 PM

Quote from: dspringer1 on August 11, 2017, 03:24:27 PM

TWG?  MMO?  Not familiar with these abbreviations.

sorry  :-[

Title: Re: When is a Story not a Story?
Post by: Rasins on August 16, 2017, 05:23:41 PM

Quote from: dspringer1 on August 11, 2017, 03:24:27 PM

TWG?  MMO?  Not familiar with these abbreviations.

There are several, but antoher you may not know, for future reference ....

TWC - the white Christ

Title: Re: When is a Story not a Story?
Post by: jonas on August 17, 2017, 11:36:14 AM

Quote from: Quantus on August 11, 2017, 01:10:14 PM

Butter's story is about a mission to a hospital. The upcoming Harry/maggie story is the one about the Zoo (which might  be happening more or less at the same time).

A few big detail take-aways from Day One with Butters:

(click to show/hide)

-Michael more or less confirms that the Knights are guided/managed directly by TWG and not by Archangel intermediaries. 
-If enough people Believe in something (children being particularly good fo this) it can Both a)create a new being from scratch, or b)come close enough that an existing NN creature can slip into the new image and use it as a foothold. 
-TWG is not opposed to MMO's, despite how many Soul's they have devoured over the years... (:P)

Those are actually two really big reveals in the grand scheme of things. though now

(click to show/hide)

I'm confuse on just what Uriel does, thought that WAS his job so? ???

Title: Re: When is a Story not a Story?
Post by: Quantus on August 17, 2017, 12:20:58 PM

Quote from: jonas on August 17, 2017, 11:36:14 AM

Those are actually two really big reveals in the grand scheme of things. though now

(click to show/hide)

I'm confuse on just what Uriel does, thought that WAS his job so? ???

Different Branch?

(click to show/hide)

He doesnt manage the Knights directly, thought he (and the other Archangels) do sometimes get involved in the early recruiting activities (THE Michael delivered Esperacchius to Sanya, etc).  The rest of the time I think he's running his own Ghost-cop department, similar function if less specialized and/or Overt.  Probably far more limited in how they are allowed to Act.  I wonder if the Ghost-cop division is the cosmic balance for the Chauncy-level demons?  As opposed to the Knights that Balance the actual Fallen. 

Title: Re: When is a Story not a Story?
Post by: Rasins on August 17, 2017, 05:41:46 PM

You know, the Chauncy thing is a good point.

Title: Re: When is a Story not a Story?
Post by: isoycrazy on August 18, 2017, 04:02:22 AM

Quote from: dspringer1 on August 11, 2017, 03:24:27 PM

TWG?  MMO?  Not familiar with these abbreviations.

In order to not directly offend any person's religious views, on this board when talking about the Dresden character(s) of G-D, and Jesus, we use the in-universe name Mab calls them, the White God (TWG) and the White Christ (TWC), respectively.

About the topic, I would add in that Molly is now looking for a means to supplant the need for children soldiers to fight in the war for reality.

Title: Re: When is a Story not a Story?
Post by: jonas on August 18, 2017, 04:12:13 AM

Quote from: isoycrazy on August 18, 2017, 04:02:22 AM

In order to not directly offend any person's religious views, on this board when talking about the Dresden character(s) of G-D, and Jesus, we use the in-universe name Mab calls them, the White God (TWG) and the White Christ (TWC), respectively.

About the topic, I would add in that Molly is now looking for a means to supplant the need for children soldiers to fight in the war for reality.

Not just that but as a fae she made the assertion she would fine a better way. Granted she can continually fail or not manage it..

Title: Re: When is a Story not a Story?
Post by: Quantus on August 18, 2017, 12:41:17 PM

Quote from: jonas on August 18, 2017, 04:12:13 AM

Not just that but as a fae she made the assertion she would fine a better way. Granted she can continually fail or not manage it..

true, but until that happens I think it's now a permanent Drive of the Lady (whomever is wearing the Mantle).  Fae Mantles are very Obligation Based, it's entirely possibly that failing or neglecting that promise will have a very tangible effect on the Court's Power.

Title: Re: When is a Story not a Story?
Post by: Rasins on August 18, 2017, 05:21:46 PM

Quote from: Quantus on August 18, 2017, 12:41:17 PM

true, but until that happens I think it's now a permanent Drive of the Lady (whomever is wearing the Mantle).  Fae Mantles are very Obligation Based, it's entirely possibly that failing or neglecting that promise will have a very tangible effect on the Court's Power.

Perhaps Molly will be the catalyst for a changing of the guard at the outer gates.

Title: Re: When is a Story not a Story?
Post by: Maria_Dragon on August 22, 2017, 11:57:01 AM

Quote from: Rasins on August 16, 2017, 05:23:41 PM

There are several, but antoher you may not know, for future reference ....

TWC - the white Christ

I wish another term became the norm for this. I know it isn't anyone's intention on here, but it always sounds racial to me. And that makes me uncomfortable as a Christian, because we are all God's children. I know you didn't intend anything negative.

Title: Re: When is a Story not a Story?
Post by: Quantus on August 22, 2017, 02:24:24 PM

Quote from: Maria_Dragon on August 22, 2017, 11:57:01 AM

I wish another term became the norm for this. I know it isn't anyone's intention on here, but it always sounds racial to me. And that makes me uncomfortable as a Christian, because we are all God's children. I know you didn't intend anything negative.

I mean, it's a term directly from the novels, which also have an ambiguously moral White Council and an evil White Court of Vampires, none of which have any particular superiority. We are using it specifically to avoid any direct connected with any real-world religions.  TWG is not "God" in any real-world sense, it is just a character in a fantasy novel existing alongside dragons and pagan deities and spiritually manifested children's toys.  It happens to be the sponsor of the world's equivalent of Paladins, but it doesnt have to have any more implication on real-world Christianity than Stan Lee's One-Above-All (http://marvel.wikia.com/wiki/One-Above-All_(Multiverse)) or AO (http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Ao) of Forgotten Realms. 

Title: Re: When is a Story not a Story?
Post by: Maria_Dragon on August 22, 2017, 03:30:21 PM

I am not accusing Jim or anyone on this forum of being racist. There are many characters of different races in the books who are heroes; the books do not advance hatred. I am a fan. I do, however, cringe a little whenever I read the phrase "the White God" or "the White Christ" and I would like to explain why. There is a problem in white supremacist circles where they insist that they are God's chosen people and that Jesus was unequivocally white. I don't think you believe that nor do I think anyone here is suggesting that.  However, I think that, for some of us, that history can feel more raw and closer. I am fairly young (in my thirties). I am an active volunteer in my local branch of the NAACP in North Carolina where I live. An old woman earlier this week began crying at a meeting because the events in Charlottesville reminded her of her 5 friends who were murdered by the Klan. For me, despite knowing that it isn't the intention, I cringe a little at the phrase "The White God" and "The White Christ." I suspect that I am not the only person who has ever felt this way. I don't know what to suggest for a replacement term. "DF-verse God" is clunky, though honestly that is how I think about it in my head.