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Messages - Kiero

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DFRPG / Re: How should I develop my character's powers?

« on: December 24, 2011, 03:57:26 PM »

Quote from: toturi on December 24, 2011, 12:58:43 PM

Killer Blow, IMO, is the bottom feeder of Stunts. It is nearly, in almost all circumstances, the worse choice. By comparison, nearly any other Stunt is better. If we are to make use of Killer Blow as a gauge, then I feel that it would be wise to use it as the lower bound of the power level of a Stunt. Any worse than Killer Blow will make the stunt absolutely craptacular.

True enough.

Were I to rehabilitate Killer Blow, I'd make it add 4 or even 5 Stress to a hit on the expenditure of an FP.

DFRPG / Re: How should I develop my character's powers?

« on: December 24, 2011, 10:43:11 AM »

Quote from: Sanctaphrax on December 24, 2011, 05:06:58 AM

The resemblance between Killer Blow and Blade-Shattering Force is superficial. Breaking your weapon isn't worth a FP when you have another weapon at hand, which you almost certainly will if you intend to use this stunt.

Combined with a stunt that lets you ignore supplemental penalties for drawing weapons, it's a fairly universal +3 stress. Which might be a bit too much. Hence my worry. I'm probably just being paranoid, though.

Balanced or no, it sounds like a pretty much worthless expenditure of a point of Refresh. Pay Refresh for perhaps a one-off +3 Stress in a conflict. That's totally useless when I can get +2 to hit (better than a damage bonus and also additional Shifts which equal Stress) simply by spending an FP on a relevant Aspect. In other words, just as pointless as Killer Blow, but at least it doesn't also cost an FP to use.

I'd get better economy out of taking a Compel on my High Aspect for a weapon breaking and applying another FP to the roll in which it broke.

+1 Stress with melee weapons using the Weapons Skill is not powerful. There's a Stunt in LoA, Military Training, that does exactly that. For the same price, I could simply take Claws, have an un-disarm-able Weapon:2 available all the time and no longer need to use the Weapons Skill altogether.

It isn't much different from Off-hand Weapon Training, barring that it doesn't require a second weapon. Indeed, I could probably get more from Off-hand Weapon Training if I were using two huge weapons that required Inhuman Strength to swing one-handed in the first place, since it rounds up the damage of the second weapon.

A Stunt should be worth a Shift, maybe a Shift-and-a-half (because most of the base FATE games have very coarse grains to them). A general +1 Stress is half a Shift; +2 to maneuvers is one Shift. If we were really concerned about the combination, then +1 Stress and +1 to maneuvers would be 1-Shift's worth.

DFRPG / Re: How should I develop my character's powers?

« on: December 24, 2011, 12:23:43 AM »

Quote from: Sanctaphrax on December 23, 2011, 08:56:37 PM

I don't see the problem with breaking your weapon, actually. The FP ought to make it worth it.

As long as I have alternate weapon, it's fine. Otherwise I'm down to Fists (which is now the lesser of my two combat Skills). So that's a hit in both accuracy and damage.

Quote from: Sanctaphrax on December 23, 2011, 08:56:37 PM

Weapon Master is bland and a bit too powerful.

It's little different to other Stunts I've seen in SotC; +1 Stress isn't anywhere near as significant as +1 Skill, and +2 to Maneuvers is about equivalent to a +1 Stress. So not really too powerful.

Can't say I'm bothered about bland, "colour" comes from my Aspects, not my Stunts/Powers.

Quote from: Sanctaphrax on December 23, 2011, 08:56:37 PM

IoP looks mechanically decent but uninteresting. It doesn't even have a name.

Again I don't care about interesting, but useful. It doesn't have a name because I hadn't even gotten that far in my thinking about it, only as far as a collection of Powers that might make sense together.

Quote from: Sanctaphrax on December 23, 2011, 08:56:37 PM

Hm, I just had a stunt idea that I quite like. Not sure if you'd be interested, but I might as well post it here.

Weapons:

Blade-Shattering Force: Your strikes are so powerful that they sometimes destroy the weapons you use to make them. When you successfully hit someone with a close-combat Weapons attack, you may choose to have your weapon break. If you do so, the attack inflicts three additional stress.

Not entirely certain of balance here. But I like the idea enough to post it anyway.

It's balanced, insofar as it's very similar to Killer Blow. But it's also a poor trade, IMO, I'd rather have an FP than a measly extra point of Stress.

DFRPG / Re: How should I develop my character's powers?

« on: December 23, 2011, 11:05:11 AM »

Quote from: toturi on December 23, 2011, 02:11:36 AM

Alternatively you can stick with Weapons but go ranged with a IOP that gives a reskinned Breath Weapon (an IOP weapon with a Mjollnir-type return to thrower enchantment).

I like that idea a lot. To be honest the only thing I'd really want out of an IoP is the Unbreakable quality (no Supernatural Strength-based Compels for breakage!), but that would be a neat direction to take some additional powers to soak up the discounts.

I'm thinking simply Breath Weapon [-2], Good Arm (YS156) [-1] and the Discount [+2] for a simple [-1] Item of Power. Probably an axe, that makes sense for something that can be thrown.

Or perhaps instead of Good Arm it should have a 1-point Power which gives +1 to hit when thrown and +1 range?

EDIT: Actually I'm not sure Breath Weapon works so well, at least so far as it not allowing you to add Inhuman/Supernatural Strength to it. Any thrown weapon normally allows you to add that; so what we're really looking for is a "returns to hand" Power rather than a "strike at range" Power.

For three points of Refresh, shouldn't there be 4-6 Shifts worth of stuff in a Power? So how does this sound for a total -3 Refresh package:
[-1] Returns to hand
[-1] +1 to Weapons rolls when thrown, +1 Zone to range
[-1] Supernatural Senses - detects a particular sort of foe

I reckon between them the first two are a total 2-points and the last is for flavour. Perhaps it should be stored in a dedicatd "sword space" in the Nevernever or something? Is that worthy of a whole point of Refresh?

Quote from: toturi on December 23, 2011, 02:11:36 AM

Your physical defenses are pretty good with respect to the Refresh level of your game, a straight up +5 with Weapons or a +4+1(with Inhuman Speed). Without knowing what house Powers there are in your game, I am assuming there aren't any magical Social attack vectors. From my view, your Mental stress track is vulnerable, which is why I suggested you get a stunt to boost your Discipline. Personally I'd go with defense over offense, but that is personal preference.

We'll see how the game goes as far as mental attacks go; I've just upped my track by one getting Conviction and my Good (+3) Discipline is the second best of any of the PCs in the game (the Wizard and WCV have Great (+4), but no one else has anything near that).

DFRPG / Re: How should I develop my character's powers?

« on: December 22, 2011, 04:20:19 PM »

Quote from: CottbusFiles on December 22, 2011, 01:26:13 PM

I personally find it strange that Dracul doesn't have Wings and maybe Hulking Size (shapeshifting), just something to think about.

He might do, but I've no intention of ever taking either of those if he does. Right now I'm thinking that beyond expanding the building blocks I already have, I won't be branching out further into the other areas covered.

DFRPG / Re: Movement and timing in combat

« on: December 22, 2011, 04:19:19 PM »

Quote from: Watson on December 22, 2011, 11:23:05 AM

Yes, that is my interpretation as well.

I assume that all movement as a supplemental action must be taken "in one go" (thus not split up as a "move-attack-move" thing).

With Inhuman Speed you get a "free" zone of movement without Supplemental Action penalty. You might argue that you could have another one, but taking Supplemental Action penalty to the attack. If you have Superhuman Speed, there might be no penalty at all if you move one Zone, attack, then move one Zone.

That's a particular reading of the rules, though.

DFRPG / Re: Movement and timing in combat

« on: December 22, 2011, 10:58:52 AM »

Yes, the attacker with Inhuman Speed (or better) can strike and move before their target has a chance to respond.

DFRPG / Re: How should I develop my character's powers?

« on: December 22, 2011, 09:37:34 AM »

Quote from: toturi on December 22, 2011, 02:21:21 AM

He only has Inhuman level powers. His parent is pretty uber, I'd admit but the PC isn't quite that level yet.
But I'd also advise getting some stunts to shore up the lower level skills like Discipline and Lore. A situational +2 to Discipline or Lore can be quite useful.

Indeed, given this is a game where in our first story we've faced ghouls, uber-ghouls, a Changeling with Supernatural Speed and a Black Court Vampire, not that big a deal.

If I were looking for a Skill-boosting Stunt (not a bad idea), I'd be more concerned with those at +1 and +2, rather than +3 (I think Discipline is high enough). I have been considering Finely Tuned Third Eye for "monster detection". Though when we've got two other PCs with very high Lore, it does seem a little redundant.

Quote from: EdgeOfDreams on December 22, 2011, 02:29:17 AM

Well, I must admit I come from a game where Supernatural X is banned for PC's. Having all four Inhumans, with significant rebates from catch and other stuff is considered very strong for a PC where I come from.

As toturi says:

Quote from: toturi on December 22, 2011, 02:50:28 AM

Inhuman is entry Chest-deep/Submerged level for a PC in my game. At higher Refresh (10+), Supernaturals are fair game.

It's entry level; three of the five PCs have Inhuman stats, and we're currently at 9 Refresh.

Quote from: Becq on December 22, 2011, 02:34:51 AM

As an alternative to going the IoP route to give you an Strength-proof weapon, you could go the Claws route. This would probably involve a bit of retraining: you'd want to swap Weapons and Fists (and possibly even allow Weapons to degrade over time due to disuse) and either 'forget' your stunt or replace it with something else. A nice bennie to this is that the claws could be concealed by your Human Form.

If you really like the weapon schtick (which I get the impression you do), then this option is not for you, of course.

That was originally my plan (though it would be supernaturally hardened fists, rather than sprouting claws), but the Emissary already has fists of stone, and for the moment being the unarmed fighter is sort of her schtick (though she's not specced for combat).

It feels to me like going down that route is taking him closer to becoming like his father, who I presume doesn't bother himself with carrying weapons around. If weapon-breakage with Supernatural Strength turns out to be really problematic, I might just go Claws and switch to Fists (which is also pretty high anyway) as primary.

Quote from: Sanctaphrax on December 22, 2011, 03:50:53 AM

I recommend taking a stunt. You can swap stunts at every milestone, so they make good choices for the indecisive.

Plus, a stunt would add flavour to your combat style. Faris is currently pretty bland, mechanically speaking. (His fluff is cool, but his stats are mostly just standard bruiser stuff.)

That's a point, I don't actually need an additional point of Refresh in play, I was doing just fine on Compel-fuel (hitting 4 FPs at one point and keeping it at that level). You can swap them for a point of Refresh or a power, can't you?

I could always get it now and switch it for Supernatural Strength when we have our next Major Milestone (possibly at the end of the next story) and an additional point of Refresh.

I'm wondering about something like this:

Weapon Master: +1 Stress with hand-held weapons and +2 to Weapons-based maneuvers.

Or get Wrestler for that boost to my unarmed utility.

Quote from: Sanctaphrax on December 22, 2011, 03:50:53 AM

PS: I don't understand why an IoP would give Claws. Why not just give the gauntlets a weapon rating?

Reskinning Claws was the simplest option at the time. Net effect is identical, it's Weapon:2 for Fists attacks.

DFRPG / Re: How should I develop my character's powers?

« on: December 22, 2011, 01:00:23 AM »

Quote from: wyvern on December 21, 2011, 11:52:06 PM

Haha; I'd meant that list to be a "pick one" sort of thing - but it sounds like you're picking all of them. In that case, having a variety of weapons might also be insurance against strength-related compels; if one weapon breaks... move on to the next.

Well, when you've got high Weapons, there's no reason (barring the usual concealability/carrying capacity issues) not to bring an arsenal.

DFRPG / Re: How should I develop my character's powers?

« on: December 21, 2011, 11:33:15 PM »

Quote from: EdgeOfDreams on December 21, 2011, 10:28:49 PM

Honestly, your character is already pretty uber. Rather than seeking more power, I would suggest investing in stunts. Particularly, Riposte comes to mind as one of the better stunts for the Weapons skill. Alternative, some stunts invested in social skills or skill substitutions could help shore up your lack of non-combat ability.

I might get some later, but I really need the guaranteed extra damage of Supernatural Strength first. I'm the party's primary muscle and it fits nicely.

Lack of non-combat ability hasn't been an issue so far; Intimidation and Stealth have been my main non-combat plays, besides Athletics. Something boosting my Intimidation, or giving a skill switch on Discipline might be good ones.

Quote from: wyvern on December 21, 2011, 10:43:47 PM

Hm. I'd actually make a simple flavor choice to distinguish yourself. Some examples:

1) play up the thrown / ranged aspect of the weapons skill. Flavor "wall of death" as a fan of knives sort of skill. Pick up the dual-wielding stunt, and maybe a zero-point "Item of Power" dagger that returns when thrown & functions as weapon: 2 when used in melee. (This is worth zero, because it's not any better mechanically than you could get by pairing up a shortsword with mundane daggers.)

2) Have your current weapon break when you use it with supernatural strength - and then go find something sturdier, like a two-handed warhammer. Describe your combat in terms of sweeping blows that can be dodged but not parried; maybe take a stunt that gives you +1 on weapon attacks when your opponent is defending with weapons or fists.

3) Go weaponmaster - instead of having a preferred weapon, you have a whole collection - and know enough to pick out which weapon would be best used in the current situation. Take a stunt that does for the weapons skill what martial artist does for fists, and then use it - pick out the "right" weapon at the start of any given fight, and use a declaration to give yourself the advantage for having brought a sword to a knife fight, or a polearm to a swordfight, or a knife when it's close quarters fighting and your foes are still trying to swing those clunky halberds around...

4) You've got an aspect that references chains already; make that literal with flails, whips, etc. Go heavy on the maneuvers; trip your foes, entangle them (a stunt that lets you grapple using weapons complemented by might, rather than just might skill), and generally work to control the fight - let your allies get the finishing blows, and know that you're the one that made such decisive strikes possible.

On 1) I may play up the thrown weapon angle in later games anyway, the Knight certainly doesn't use them. Both thrown knives but also javelins, if I'm able to come prepared to a fight.

Ironically on 2) I've discussed Compel-oriented weapon breakage when I hit Supernatural Strength. I'm mildly tempted, depending on how problematic it becomes, to get an IoP almost simply for the Unbreakable quality.

On 3) I've already been doing that to a degree, but I do think it's a worthy thing to emphasise. So far Faris has used a saddle axe in single combat with an uber-ghoul, a cavalry sabre in running battles with Renfields and ghouls, and a sledge hammer as missile weapon too.

On 4) that's not a bad idea to add to 3). Perhaps a kunai on a chain or the like?

DFRPG / How should I develop my character's powers?

« on: December 21, 2011, 10:06:58 PM »

We've just finished the first story of City on the River, and our party is shaping up to be quite a capable bunch of people. However, we have three melee-ists; my character (the Scion), a Knight of the Cross and an Emissary of Power (see the PCs). The latter two are melee weapon-focused and unarmed-focused (via an IoP granting Inhuman Strength and Claws).

My character is currently thus:

(click to show/hide)

I know what I want with my next point of Refresh, Supernatural Strength. After that, though, I'm really not sure. For reference, we're playing Scions like Changelings; there's an ultimate "parent" Power set towards which you can develop but may eventually face a Choice between the sides of your heritage.

My "parent" Power set was agreed thus:

(click to show/hide)

Which is quite a meaty lot, leaving loads of room to grow into that without being in too much risk of triggering the Choice. I was originally thinking I'd get Supernatural Strength and Speed, and Claws (and switch to Fists as my primary), but the latter one feels a bit too much like I'm stepping on the Emissary's toes. Similarly, though, if I stick to using Weapons, I'm going to inevitably impinge on what the Knight does.

I don't want the magic, and the Claws do feel a lot like indulging the demonic side that he's trying to avoid, which is why I'm leaning towards the melee weapons. It feels more like attempting to remain within the human realm, even if that's boosted by demon powers, as compared to using bare hands (and feet).

Anyone got any thoughts, barring just waiting to see how the three characters progress?

DFRPG / Re: AP Podcast - City on the River

« on: December 15, 2011, 12:33:59 AM »

Listened to both parts of Episode 4 and the first of Episode 5 now. On the latter, we were definitely digressing a lot more than usual, though I'm as guilty as anyone else of that, starting out with a report from home.

Episode 5 is quite combat-heavy, being the culmination of the story and all that. Lots of mechanics being used, if anyone is interested in that sort of thing, though obviously you can't see the zone maps.

DFRPG / Re: Dresden Files: Dallas (Obsidian Portal)

« on: December 15, 2011, 12:27:21 AM »

I really love the layout, I've suggested we use something similar on our own site. The Cast page is particularly neat, it really draws you in and makes you want to learn more about each character.

DFRPG / Re: Dresden Files: Dallas (Obsidian Portal)

« on: December 14, 2011, 10:46:28 AM »

Quote from: Katarn on December 13, 2011, 10:55:10 PM

(But was it all a dream? +1 to whoever gets this)

Ah yes, good old Dallas. Surprised there are many people old enough to remember it, though I probably shouldn't be!

DFRPG / Re: What could two Knights of the Cross and a Scion get up to in Egypt?

« on: December 10, 2011, 10:54:54 AM »

Quote from: Katarn on December 09, 2011, 04:30:27 PM

Personally, I like games set with a very up-to-date context, but just handle things with political charge delicately.

*So Arab Spring is a possibility- perhaps don't focus on the politics themselves, but how supernatural predators are taking advantage of the chaos
*Egyptian pantheon- Anubis, Osiris, Isis, etc. It's an interesting mythology, and great if you're looking at historical Egypt
*Mummies/Pharaohs
*"The Eygptian"- we know the Knight preceding Sanya game from here (and was possibly even a worshiper of their pantheon, see above), so a story surrounding Esperacchius could be in the cards

Or you can combine ideas: Example:
Exploiting the Arab spring incident to boost his weakened powers, the Egyptian deity Seth steals Esperacchius to slow the White God's hold on the world. As the party searches for it, they learn about Sanya's predecessor (who had dealt with Seth before as is thus hints to finding the sword). Culminates in a huge mummy battle.

(oh, and what's a knight without a denarian or two? )

Mummies are definitely a strong contender for villains of the piece. I like the idea of using something that isn't core Dresdenverse as the main opposition. Along with using mythological Egypt, after all why take the trouble to go there without using the local colour?

What if Set is using the wielder of Esperacchius to take out one of his enemies, and the theft is a way to maneuver him into the right position to deal the deadly blow?

Quote from: SunlessNick on December 09, 2011, 04:50:49 PM

If you're uncomfortable using the Arab Spring itself, it's still a backdrop that may throw a lot of established factors out of place. Governments going down are bad for any hidden faction that used them, so local hierarchies of conspiratorially-minded villains may be upset, making the organisations vulnerable. A lot of people are out on the streets where they can become murder victims for supernatural predators - or witnesses who can provide a vital clue for something that would otherwise have remained hidden (like a fight between two members of an aforementioned upset hierarchy).

[I like how this forum warns you about cross posts]

Added at the last minute: I like Katarn's example, and some covert help from Horus the Elder might not go amiss (or Nephthys, Seth's sister/wife who has a mythological precedent for betraying him to the forces of good and order - she helped Isis assemble and resurrect Osiris). An alternative to Seth might be Apep (aka Apophis), in which case the most fitting help would come from Ra or Bast.

A minority historical theory holds that Judaism is descended from Atenism, which would make Aten the White God (ATS the Exodus was Aten's followers getting kicked out of Egypt rather than Yahweh's escaping it). I don't really buy it myself, but if Aten is not the White God, it could make a good enough imitation to draw astray anyone who's not directly empowered by the real thing.

I think using the beginnings of the Arab Spring as a backdrop rather than impetus might be a more sensetive way of handling it, yes.

Getting embroiled in the schemes and feuds of the local gods is certainly another angle (it could still involve mummies!).

Quote from: archmagelite on December 09, 2011, 04:59:34 PM

hmm Knights dont go anywhere there isnt Trouble. Perhaps an old Ally of faruk's is going to be around, and he has to start showing his loyalty to the Good, by taking on one of Drakul's supporters.

I'd rather avoid any direct connections to Faris' past; he's the supporting tag-along here in what is basically Oliver's first proper mission as a Knight of the Cross.

Quote from: knnn on December 09, 2011, 06:19:10 PM

The Arab spring is basically just a power vacuum brought on by the removal of Mubarak. In terms of the supernatural, it's probably way further down the scale than the end of Changes. That said, it wouldn't surprise me if a number of different factions are trying to take advantage of the situation. Also, if the Red-Court had any serious presence in Egypt and your campaign takes place after Changes - you got to be wondering who is trying to take over previous RC interests in Egypt

- Since Egypt has (until lately) been one of the major bulwarks in the War Against Terror, I can see the Denarians trying to weaken the remaining government power in an effort to support terror groups.

- Egypt is most populous of the countries in the Middle-east. As such, the White Court might have a presence there. Drugs/guns/ whatever are always in demand.

- The Suez canal is a major shipping channel (possibly the most important). Anyone who transporting goods (including US military) without having to go around Africa is going to be very sensitive about the area. Similarly, if there is anyone smuggling things (drugs /guns/ slaves), they might very well be interested in controlling the necessary officials.

- There are many dams along the Nile - providing irrigation for millions of people. However, this has disturbed the ancient flooding of the Nile -- associated with many religious beliefs. Perhaps some old gods would like to see the Nile restored. Blowing up one or two major dams would solve it. It would also potentially drown thousands.

- Someone build the pyramids to contain.... things. There is even a permanent wizard "Pyramid sitting". ~~Someone~~ something is trying to get out...

- There was a Djinni stuck in a bottle (originally captured by King Solomon), that has been released by an unsuspecting tourist. He Djinni is bound to serve mortals, but it has it's own agenda is corrupting its "master" for its own needs.

Our game takes place before Changes, so the Red Court is still a potent force. The mundane stuff around the War on Terror and shipping might provide some outward side-effects of whatever is really going on. Along with supernaturals taking advantage of mundane actors, as you say.

Hmmm, something involving the traditional inundation of the Nile and some supernatural repercussions of it might be a nice nuance. Or even as you allude, a plot to destroy the dams.

Something old in a pyramid, hmmmm.

Quote from: wyvern on December 09, 2011, 06:29:20 PM

I'd actually suggest something seemingly minor. Have you read "The Warrior"? That's the sort of thing I'm thinking about - a relatively low-end villain, threats aimed at maybe just a few people, but with important effects along the side.

I've not read it, what are the specifics?

Quote from: Paynesgrey on December 09, 2011, 09:21:14 PM

Egypt was in a way the New Orleans of Africa. I mean that in a culture and trade sort of way, not the vomit on your shoes sort of way. You had the trade from the entire mediteranian as well as some 4000 miles into the continent. Not only has a lot of History happened there, but even more passed through there on it's way to happening elsewhere. You could tie into events/creatures from pretty much any ancient civilization in the area, using it as a jumping off point to look for King Solomon's Mines, for example.

Indeed, it is a rich vein of potential material.

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