ParanetOnline
McAnally's (The Community Pub) => Author Craft => Topic started by: Aminar on July 06, 2012, 02:47:04 AM
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And the wielder is too stupid to let go of the trigger? I need this for a scene I'm writing at the moment.
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A minigun has six spinning barrels of pretty tough steel, so while a lead shotgun slug striking from a side angle might deflect it off target, I don't think it would do any permanent damage or put it out of action unless it hit the electric drive mechanism or the cartridge feed.
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On the other hand a shotgun slug has a lot of momentum. All it would have to do is deform one of the barrels enough that it was blocked and the shooter would have real problems when that particular barrel rotated around.
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Dear Mythbusters.... 8)
I guess it would depend on what sort of shot is being used and where it strikes.
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Shot, even buckshot, wouldn't have much effect on a gun barrel. A 1-ounce soft lead 12ga. slug moving at 1500 feet-per-second might deflect one barrel, if it hit it just right, but that would only affect the accuracy of one round out of six per revolution. The most effective way to take a minigun out of action with a shotgun would be to shoot its operator. If the plot requires destroying the gun itself, you'd need something bigger, like a .50 Browning machine gun or sniper rifle that could smash the mechanism, or a rocket propelled grenade.
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The topic does say Slug. From there I guess I'll need to make the point the nation who owns the minigun is a little behind on the tech and overcompensates heavily on size...) to make this realistic.
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In case you haven't figured it out? Yeratel is our resident firearms expert. I thought Oz had a good point until I read further...
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I am still questioning whether a slug could deform a barrel enough that it was blocked. If so it might be interesting when the operator tried to fire a round through it. I understand that it is difficult for a soft lead bullet to penetrate a hardened steel tube but it wouldn't have to put a hole in it, just a big enough dent that the round couldn't get through. If you're shooting 50 rounds a second that would be 8 rounds trying to get through a blocked barrel in a second. I think that could cause problems. I figure if a soft lead 22 long rifle can go through a car door (Something that I've done many times out plinking in the desert as a kid) then a ten or twelve gauge slug should have no problem putting a dent in a steel tube.
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As far as the plot goes, it's more about the character realizing he can't aim anymore-at all while not having it be catastrophic but having the potential to be.
Now, given that the nation this takes place in (Made up world) is technologically backward but militiristic and has the philosophy bigger is better(to the point where social class hierarchy is based on physical capability and muscle bulk) Their technology sucks. Is it feasible to say that the momentum of a shotgun slug at roughly point blank range would be able to disable a badly engineered(noting that material usage counts in engineering) minigun by denting a barrel to the point where it jams?
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I have always heard that when writing about guns or horses (I personally think martial arts may now fit onto this list.) it doesn't matter what you write someone is going to find fault with it. Is the protagonist the one with the mini gun or the one with the shotgun? I think you could make a good argument that the gun could be disabled by hitting it with a slug. Especially in another world that possibly doesn't make them up to the specifications that we are familiar with. Of course some things material wise and mechanics wise are going to be necessar for the gun to ever work in any world.Does that mean that no one would write in and claim that it would never work? No. Even if you had the means to personally test it and put the recorded event on You Tube, someone would find a way to try to discredit it. You just have give a reasonable explanation of why it could work. Is the shotgun from a higher tech society? Of so they do have shotgun shells that are made for better penetration. I know there is a You Tube clip of one blowing holes through the engine block of an old Russian car. It's only shooting the engine so it didn't have to go through the car or the radiator first but it is still pretty impressive.
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I have always heard that when writing about guns or horses (I personally think martial arts may now fit onto this list.) it doesn't matter what you write someone is going to find fault with it. Is the protagonist the one with the mini gun or the one with the shotgun? I think you could make a good argument that the gun could be disabled by hitting it with a slug. Especially in another world that possibly doesn't make them up to the specifications that we are familiar with. Of course some things material wise and mechanics wise are going to be necessar for the gun to ever work in any world.Does that mean that no one would write in and claim that it would never work? No. Even if you had the means to personally test it and put the recorded event on You Tube, someone would find a way to try to discredit it. You just have give a reasonable explanation of why it could work. Is the shotgun from a higher tech society? Of so they do have shotgun shells that are made for better penetration. I know there is a You Tube clip of one blowing holes through the engine block of an old Russian car. It's only shooting the engine so it didn't have to go through the car or the radiator first but it is still pretty impressive.
I found that too. Issue(with the engine block) being the difference between Steel and Cast Iron. Iron is fragile, odd as that may seem. Steel is far far far less so. I've just thrown in a quick line along the lines of, "Thank the gods for shoddy(insert country name here's) engineering.
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A good many modern engine blocks are made of cast aluminum nowadays to save weight. Even ordinary non-armorpiercing ammo will turn them into swiss cheese.
Regarding damage done by a shotgun slug, we shoot lead slugs at steel targets all the time, and they just splatter; they really knock the targets down with some authority, though. :)
To penetrate or really damage something made of hard steel, like a gun barrel, you'd need something harder than pure lead. They make a type of saboted slug for shotguns for the purpose of penetrating things like barricades and engine blocks which has a hardened steel or tungsten alloy slug of about .50 calibre loaded in a plastic sleeve that falls away after the slug leaves the muzzle. It's lighter than a lead slug, so it travels at a higher velocity and will punch right through light armor. One of these hitting a gun barrel while it was firing would probably cause the barrel to burst, and wreck the firing mechanism as well.
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If the question is accuracy with one barrel, it should be noted that miniguns are intentionally designed with the barrels slightly off from each other so that the bullets spread a little bit. Otherwise they'd just be putting 6 bullets through the same hole rather than tearing 6 holes.
Yeratel, correct me if Im wrong,
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I suppose I could use some extra Deus Ex Machine to get a steel jacketed slug into the gun. The character already has a goddess mucking up things pretty well. (she did drop off the things he accidentally left asst her place, shotgun included. Hmmmm.
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I suppose I could use some extra Deus Ex Machine to get a steel jacketed slug into the gun. The character already has a goddess mucking up things pretty well. (she did drop off the things he accidentally left asst her place, shotgun included. Hmmmm.
The only reason they dont use solid steel ball bearings is that they damage the barrel over time (and thats more important with rifled barrels over smooth bore shotguns) being the same material.
I cant get you a link on this computer, but there are some truly amazing (or horrific, depending on your outlook) things that can come out of a Shotgun shell out there. Might be worth a look just for ideas if nothing else.
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We've had discussions about the kind of things they're loading in shotgun shells here before. Jim Butcher's gun-fu has gone up considerably since the first couple of Dresden novels, as illustrated by his giving Kincaid Dragon's Breath shells for dealing with the vampires.
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Unless you were really close, not much of anything. Depending on what the type of mini-gun and the angle it got hit, it might get deflected momentarily. At more then a few yards, a shotgun doesn't hurt much.
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I don't think there'd be any appreciable damage to the barrel itself. I know that the good old M-16/M-4 barrels are a pretty high end alloy containing things vanadium and molybdenum and suchlike. Now, if the slug hit the actual mechanism you could cause all sorts of malfunction. Well, probably nothing spectacular, just make it seize up and call it a day.
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I don't think there'd be any appreciable damage to the barrel itself. I know that the good old M-16/M-4 barrels are a pretty high end alloy containing things vanadium and molybdenum and suchlike. Now, if the slug hit the actual mechanism you could cause all sorts of malfunction. Well, probably nothing spectacular, just make it seize up and call it a day.
Yep. Paynesgrey is another Forum denizen whose gun-fu is strong, if you need practical info on things that go BANG! :)
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All part of the service. 8)
But thanks for the compliment! (I wouldn't call myself an expert, just something resembling competent.)
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All part of the service. 8)
But thanks for the compliment! (I wouldn't call myself an expert, just something resembling competent.)
I'm not an Expert yet, either, but I'm up to Sharpshooter with a rifle, and qualified as a Marksman with both revolver and semi-auto pistols. :)