Brought up in another thread I opined that I don't care much for the rules when it comes to magic. Why you might ask: Wizards have at best 4 spells per engagement with the possibility to flub them fairly easily. If they decide to go balls to the walls to take out some really big bad they have even less. This makes them about level 2-3 in the old dungeon and dragons system. Remember when a first level wizard could only memorize one spell and it was almost always charm person so you could have some one fight for you at for a round.(which would be breaking the laws of magic and so someone would come and cut your head off just cause you were trying to stay alive. ) Maybe you choose magic missile but either way after that you where poking things with your dagger.
True the DFRPG wizards can do some nifty things with the 3-4 spells they have, if they have enough power and if they roll well and if the target doesn't roll well. To many ifs. I Like magic, I like roleplaying games with magic in them, I like my wizards nice and powerful, its one of the reasons i hate MMOs the guy with the stick is always tougher then the guy who can bend nature to his will and wipe out a continent. Really who would spend years studying the arcane when a guy with the club always wins. In most role playing games this is well reflected and no game reflected it better then Ars Magicka, wizards were top and the magic system is a blast.
I just can't get passed the idea that your limited to 3-4 spells. It doesn't matter how creative you are with them or what they can do in theory, you basically cast one defensive spell and hope it will last a few passes of the engagement. and you have 1-2 shots at taking out the bad guy.
I just can't see how the white court brought down the entire red court of vampires. This system is not meant for large scale engagements. Every few minutes the wizards have to hope their not in combat so their mental stress can reset, how does that happen in pitched battle. In the books when lucio is killing zombies with little blasts of flame very pin point stuff, harry even comments on how much control that takes. But she did it over and over again without rest, try that in the game. The game rules do not reflect what the book says these wizards can do. If we want we can describe our spells that way but the effect in no way will match what we describe. the power of the spell has to be broken up over all the targets. So a legendary effect becomes 2 good effects and a fair effect against only three targets. Maybe they die maybe they don't either way i got 1-2 spells left after that one and the defensive one i had to cast or i would have been killed at the beginning of the first pass because anything that's not human is faster and stronger.
Its true we have some enchanted items that really even up things but we really can't cast spells we just carry a lot of junk along with us. Then add the silly rules of magic into it and you got a lot of effects you can't even use against run of the mill bad guys. I just threw those out, what fun is playing a mage if you cant polymorph someone or read their mind to find out if there the ones your looking for. Just plain ick thats what its is.
Wait a second... Aren't you taken out if all your stress boxes are marked?
I just can't get passed the idea that your limited to 3-4 spells. It doesn't matter how creative you are with them or what they can do in theory, you basically cast one defensive spell and hope it will last a few passes of the engagement. and you have 1-2 shots at taking out the bad guy.Can you give me an example where Harry uses much more than that, in a single fight?
There's a reason Harry carries his gun, and uses force rings. There's a reason Wardens carry swords. Harry pushes himself to the limit of his casting in virtually every book, and he does it with just a couple of spells per encounter. The rules match the game system pretty damn well, as I see it.Oh, forgot that topic altogether. Scatterbrain...
I'd love to see the Dresdenverse done using Amber Diceless. Not quite as complex as FATE but still free and loose to play...
Brought up in another thread I opined that I don't care much for the rules when it comes to magic. Why you might ask: Wizards have at best 4 spells per engagement with the possibility to flub them fairly easily. If they decide to go balls to the walls to take out some really big bad they have even less. This makes them about level 2-3 in the old dungeon and dragons system. <snip>Just picking at nits but wizards have 4 spells per scene which are a) extremely flexible and potentially fit any scene; and b) are the most powerful attacks available on a per refresh basis.
An example defense in action: say you end up with a legendary roll: you have a block of 8 for one pass and then you have to roll again and gain another mental stress. Or you can reduce the block to 6 and have the spell last for 3 passes. Provided it isn't brought down early if the bad guy roles well. And what nasty in the Dresden world couldn't beat a block of fantastic.As others noted, wizards are better off using enchanted items for blocks.
I just can't see how the white court brought down the entire red court of vampires. This system is not meant for large scale engagements. <snip>Not really sure I'd rely on the novels to be recreatable by the game but:
Now with all my feeling about the magic system you might ask why bother playing. I love urban fantasy, I can't decide which world is better The hollows or Dresdens I like playing in it. I only wish the magic system lived up to the books.I don't think any game ever really recreates the feel of a novel. DFRPG did a better than average job at trying but games and novels have completely different methods and processes.
I ran a game focused on wizards and not set particularly in the Dresdenverse. I used Toughness Powers for the mental stress track instead of the physical. I think I just called them inhuman, supernatural and mythic spellcaster or something.
Wizards could then sling around lots of spells and only tired when reaching well above their normal capabilities or when they couldn't control what they drew in.
It was fun and the wizards were bad news. After doing this, I would probably give the heavy hitters like Ebenezar and the Merlin these powers.
I ran a game focused on wizards and not set particularly in the Dresdenverse. I used Toughness Powers for the mental stress track instead of the physical. I think I just called them inhuman, supernatural and mythic spellcaster or something.
Wizards could then sling around lots of spells and only tired when reaching well above their normal capabilities or when they couldn't control what they drew in.
It was fun and the wizards were bad news. After doing this, I would probably give the heavy hitters like Ebenezar and the Merlin these powers.
IF they were cars, they would have the same gas tank capacity, but Ebenezar would have a lot more gas mileage.
I just can't see how the white court brought down the entire red court of vampires. This system is not meant for large scale engagements.
Not really sure I'd rely on the novels to be recreatable by the game but:
i like it since i prefere wizards to any other type
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Not too sure I agree with you on the ninja mechanic.(click to show/hide)
You're a goober. But I won't hold it against you.Ignoring (obviously) the Mothers. I cannot see any way that Mab (never mind Lea) could outgun Mother Winter.
Lea is said to be second only to Mab as far as sheer power is concerned among the Winter Court.
I'd love to see the Dresdenverse done using Amber Diceless. Not quite as complex as FATE but still free and loose to play...I hate you right now. Mainly because Amber Diceless is... Unweildly. Awesome in concept, but unweildly.
I hate you right now. Mainly because Amber Diceless is... Unweildly. Awesome in concept, but unweildly.
The only place I really see this as a problem is villanous spellcasters. I can have a 30 refresh uber wizard, but he can't defend and attack at the same time well enough to handle 6 7 refresh PC's. (Although the fact my villains average a roll of -2 might play a part there.)
I don't see how that's possible. At 30 refresh, you should be able to throw enough power into a spell to seriously cripple at least a couple of those 7-refresh PCs at a time, and should be easily able to create a block that they can't get through without at least a couple maneuvers.Was a necromancer specializing in Mind Control. His drummer was dead from a previous session and I couldn't roll crap. I'd set spells so a negative 1 would succeed and roll negative 3. Then the PC's would roll 4's. I mentioned the bad dice right. He wasn't the crowning moment of awesome for the session anyways(That was the Fetch version of Maleficent the Dragon lurking in front of Cinderella's Castle while he prepped the Darkhallow testrun.)
At 30 refresh, you should be able to cast 10-shift evocations without breaking a sweat. Or have minions.
I hate you right now. Mainly because Amber Diceless is... Unweildly. Awesome in concept, but unweildly.
Was a necromancer specializing in Mind Control. His drummer was dead from a previous session and I couldn't roll crap. I'd set spells so a negative 1 would succeed and roll negative 3. Then the PC's would roll 4's. I mentioned the bad dice right. He wasn't the crowning moment of awesome for the session anyways(That was the Fetch version of Maleficent the Dragon lurking in front of Cinderella's Castle while he prepped the Darkhallow testrun.)
Well you still should be able to do something. Additionally you could have him roll plot (though some people dont like that)I know. There are things I could have done. But in the end it came down to Wizards are really squishy.(And I hadn't figured out the enchanted item block trick yet so shields just sucked.)
Better analogy is that they're both pump action shotguns, but while Ebenezer is a 10 gauge firing solid slugs, Harry's a 20 gauge firing birdshot.
I don't see how that's possible. At 30 refresh, you should be able to throw enough power into a spell to seriously cripple at least a couple of those 7-refresh PCs at a time, and should be easily able to create a block that they can't get through without at least a couple maneuvers.
At 30 refresh, you should be able to cast 10-shift evocations without breaking a sweat. Or have minions.
I'm kind of shocked that you're only at ten shifts at 30 refresh if the guy is someone all your characters are meant to fight. Belial666 has a character that's knocking off 16-shift evocations at about half that refresh level. I'll reiterate- Extended evocation blocks, enchanted items, and summoned mooks are your friends here.
Yeah, 10 shift Evocation isn't at all unreasonable for a -30 Refresh guy with a lot of Lawbreaker (probably -6 to -8 worth of Lawbreaker) who's focused on Thaumaturgy.No. He'd avoided that one so far. Largely by mind controlling others to do his killing. And being a cover band, leaving dead rodies behind is far less fun than kidnapping the hot ones via mind control(in his mind)
It's also more than sufficient to destroy most Waist Deep PCs. Especially if he's got Lawbreaker (First) which I'd argue he really should.