ParanetOnline
The Dresden Files => DF Spoilers => Topic started by: raidem on July 19, 2023, 09:33:44 PM
-
Could I get an update on what has gone on since I was last on. I'm on the Discord channel for The Defiance of the Fall by J.F. Brink and a patreon supporter there too. I got into a discussion about the Dresden Files there and sorta have wondered what has all been happening since I was last posting here.
THanks.
Raidem
-
Ok I just read the Fugitive. It was good. So we get to see Cowl at a Farmhouse. I was thinking of Eb but I'm sure that Mouse has been around when Eb visited Harry's apartment. So, I think we can eliminate Eb as a possible Cowl. It also seemed like Cowl isn't the massively overpowered guy that we/i thought he was.
I'm reading others postings and come back here to reflect.
So I don't think Cowl is Evil Harry as I'm sure Mouse would have detected that.
-
Oh. I'm thinking that maybe Mister got a Power Up with the Nemean Lion possessing him. I mean Michael got a power up from having held Uriel's mantle in some way it seems.
Did Jim get sick at a con/Floridacon? I think i saw someone suggest that in one of the threads?
-
He does call him "Master of the future." Everyone thinks time Lord ala the doctor style. I could see the key word in that actually being Master. Referring to his Master, as in "Dresden of the future." Would play into the MM time travel idea.
*Him picking up on alt Harry is expressed by calling him 'Master'.
-
Yeah, that Master of the Future really hints at a time traveling angle. I just think Mouse would have picked up on him being Harry/AltHarry etc. The Master of the Future bit doesn't come into play until after Mouse has already bit/broken bones of Cowl. I'd think he would pick up on a scent/etc unless AltHarry would be using a different body like Corpseweaver or whatever her name was that could switch bodies.
-
I like Griffyn612 theory on Raphael being involved with Demonreach's creation. Mac could definitely be Raphael or at least an person who had held his Mantle at some point. Merlin? Or some other instance of a former holder of an Archangels mantle.
-
You know I do think there is a Future Harry running around. There seems to be many instances of people believing that something bad was of Harry's doing, and he has to reassure people repeatedly that it wasn't him. I mean it could be some mimic. I mean I think Mac has asked Harry if it was him on multiple occasions. Maybe it is a AltHarry or a MimicHarry that is in play in the background.
Alternatively, perhaps some of Powers needing reassurance are wanting it because they are somewhat aware of the parallel timelines and see a Evil Harry. They hope that Harry isn't/hasn't/won't go down that path.
-
Raidem, what have you read? Post Battle Ground there are four short stories and the Novella The Law, the latter giving several important pieces of information.
-
I think I have read them all with having completed the Fugitive read yesterday.
I know I have read 1, The Law, 2. The Fugitive, 3. Little Things, 4. ???.
I read one with Molly working as the Winter Lady doing tasks for Mab. I've read the Law but likely have forgotten much about it. Like it seems I'm having a hard time figuring out where Nameless comes from.
-
Oh I think I stumbled across a theory that Sarissa is/was Kumori. Kinda interesting. I'd suspect if that is the case that she no longer is held by Cowl.
-
Ok I just read the Fugitive. It was good. So we get to see Cowl at a Farmhouse. I was thinking of Eb but I'm sure that Mouse has been around when Eb visited Harry's apartment. So, I think we can eliminate Eb as a possible Cowl. It also seemed like Cowl isn't the massively overpowered guy that we/i thought he was.
I'm reading others postings and come back here to reflect.
So I don't think Cowl is Evil Harry as I'm sure Mouse would have detected that.
There might be a future Harry running around, but we haven't seen him yet if he is. Like Rashid, pretty hard not to notice someone of their respective heights. So I agree, Cowl isn't Harry, nor do I believe he is anyone else but who he is, Cowl.
-
Oh I think I stumbled across a theory that Sarissa is/was Kumori. Kinda interesting. I'd suspect if that is the case that she no longer is held by Cowl.
One of mine, indeed pretty much all the theories are mine, even where they contradict each other. Especially when they contradict each other.
Cowl would have to have a connection to Kumori and both Nameless and Sarissa were members of the Winter Court. Mab was at one time a mortal practitioner (see Peace Talks) and is mother of Sarissa, with magical ability running down the female line. So Sarissa should have had the ability to be Kumori. Sarissa’ has an inclination towards healing (as per Cold Days) and Nameless was a previous known associate of Kemmler (The Law) and would therefore have knowledge of life and death that Kemmler had, attractive to someone who wants to defeat death. Kumori uses that knowledge to save Marcone’s man on Whacker, something pretty much beyond Listens To The Wind.
Nameless would have been manipulating Sarissa for years using Lloyd Slate as his personal bogeyman to force her to seek his protection (Lloyd was bad to all the changelings see Summer Knight) and then dangle the offer of forbidden knowledge. Being expelled from Arctis Tor on suspicion of involvement in the attack on it in Proven Guilty he lost his ability to manipulate Sarissa and no more is heard of Kumori.
Kumori was involved in the events of Grave Peril (where Maeve had moved her Court to Chicago at this point), Blood Rites (she is shown abducting the puppies with Cowl in Fugitive and Zoo Day) and Dead Beat. That fits perfectly the arc of Nameless and Sarissa both being part of the Winter Court and in Chicago.
Re read The Law. It expressly points to Nameless as being connected to Kemmler, and being part of the Winter Court exiled for suspicion of involvement as the inside man in the attack on Arctis Tor. Both of these would be required for someone to be Cowl (in Dead Beat Cowl recognised Bod and that he contained The Word) He is the right power level for Cowl and resides in Chicago. As Marcone’s Lawyer he was aware of the vault in Skin Game and would have been in a position to notify Tessa to try to derail Nick, suggesting she was the Denarian involved in the attack on Arctis Tor.
Harry has some of this information The Red Cap, Sarissa and Mab all have more information. Marcone and Namshiel too will have information regarding Nameless/Tessa, nobody has it all but I suspect Harry will put it all together over the Next Book.
-
Sarissa cannot be Kumori. Go reread Cold Days for all the reasons.
Wizards get a sense of another wizard by touching them. Sarissa was Harry's physical therapist for 7+ months. There had to be contact there, especially in the early stages where Harry was regaining his mobility. Plus, it would have been easy to engineer an "oopsie" during one of Mab's tests that resulted in Harry's death.
Sarissa would have to be the world's greatest shinobi/wizard/actress to have fooled the Winter Court, Eldest Gruff, Vadderung/Kringle, Maeve and later Nemesis/Maeve and Mab for hundreds of years. If she was that good, Cowl would have been her flunky.
I highly doubt that Kumori wouldn't have taken some action when Harry and Fix went against Maeve. She was going to die if the Outsiders or Maeve won.
Jim's love of foreshadowing has everyone overthinking every new character. Sometimes things are as simple as they appear.
-
Well it's not like we don't already have woj transfiguration is on the list of stuff Harry's supposed to learn. So I don't think,"he is not immediately identifiable to the reader" really outs anyone as cowl. Cowls meant to be obscured. Anything directly identifying him or anyone doing so sorta outs the game intentionally set up where we do not know for sure who cowl is. Jim was already hesitant from writing a mouse short specifically because he knows too much to be allowed too much monologue on anything overarching.
And I confess. Considering the connection between size and importance, wizards and fae, breaking ones word, ect. I rather think MM Harry will be a couple inches shorter than Harry. Not a lot, but noticable.
-
Sarissa cannot be Kumori. Go reread Cold Days for all the reasons.
Wizards get a sense of another wizard by touching them. Sarissa was Harry's physical therapist for 7+ months. There had to be contact there, especially in the early stages where Harry was regaining his mobility. Plus, it would have been easy to engineer an "oopsie" during one of Mab's tests that resulted in Harry's death.
Sarissa would have to be the world's greatest shinobi/wizard/actress to have fooled the Winter Court, Eldest Gruff, Vadderung/Kringle, Maeve and later Nemesis/Maeve and Mab for hundreds of years. If she was that good, Cowl would have been her flunky.
I highly doubt that Kumori wouldn't have taken some action when Harry and Fix went against Maeve. She was going to die if the Outsiders or Maeve won.
Jim's love of foreshadowing has everyone overthinking every new character. Sometimes things are as simple as they appear.
She’s not a properly mortal practitioner like a Wizard, she’s a Changeling. You are inferring that one set of rules apply to her when it isn’t clear that is the case. We do not have enough information to ascertain whether the same rules apply as regards mortal practitioners, whether she was taught a way to hide this or whatever by Nameless/Cowl. We do however have the facts set our above as regards her and Kumori’s time-line and that of Nameless and Cowl.
She spent decades making sure she was overlooked so as not to get on Maeves radar, so of course she was hiding from everyone.
-
She’s not a properly mortal practitioner like a Wizard, she’s a Changeling. You are inferring that one set of rules apply to her when it isn’t clear that is the case. We do not have enough information to ascertain whether the same rules apply as regards mortal practitioners, whether she was taught a way to hide this or whatever by Nameless/Cowl. We do however have the facts set our above as regards her and Kumori’s time-line and that of Nameless and Cowl.
She spent decades making sure she was overlooked so as not to get on Maeves radar, so of course she was hiding from everyone.
I'm afraid I've forgotten all the facts about Nameless. Could you please give the book or WoJ quotes outside of those in The Law?
-
There aren’t any, unless you count Even Hand where Marcone is reading letters from his unnamed lawyer about the Accords. This is from the collection Dark and Stormy Knights and Even Hand did not feature a dark knight, until at least the reveal in Battle Ground. The Law established that Nameless was employed by Marcone at this point in the time-line.
there is a possible mention in Summer Knight page 203
‘‘There,’ she said, once I’d been seated. ‘Not so untamable as he claimed.’ I felt my jaw get a little tighter as Billy took a seat beside me. A trio of brightly colored lights zipped in, bearing a silver tray holding a crystalline ewer of water and two glasses. ‘As who said?’ Maeve waved a hand airily. ‘No matter.’”
Maeve refuses to name her informant. Slate walks in just after this and has no idea who Harry is. At this point Nameless would have been a prominent part of Maeves Court, his presence creating the discord that existed there with Lloyd Slate and the Changelings and exacerbating Maeves own misconduct. No -one in Maeves Court would have bothered to keep an eye on Harry….unless they were also Cowl.
Of course this could be red herring as Harry actually asks a timeley and pertinent question.
Nameless was obviously keeping a low profile during Summer Knight, he didn’t want to appear on Harry’s radar. Harry had no prior interaction with Nameless in his entire PI career, which seems strange as he is a very successful criminal defence lawyer, unless Nameless wanted it that way. Nameless knew who Harry was.
I also suspect he was the anonymous motorist who rear ended Harry coming away from the WC execution in Proven Guilty, the WC coming to town when he is organising the attack on Arctis Tor using the way through Pell’s Theatre mean’t he needed to keep an eye on them and liase with his mole Peabody. His temper got the better of him (Harry denied him full godhood the year before in Dead Beat) as it did in Fugitive after his scheme with the Titan was ended also by Harry.in Fugitive Cowl is seen as uncharistically petty and vengeful he isn’t running some great scheme as seen on his previous appearances. Harry is very good at annoying people, even Uriel who is several grades up from a Saint.
Basically Jim can point to Nameless always being there, in the background, in every case file behind the scenes training Sorcerors, giving out HexenWulf Belts, and Athames, setting the Courts in Dispute and prolonging the Red Court war, manipulating the Denarians, raising up the Fomor. and as I suspect we are going to get the Cowl reveal in Next Book as Harry slowly over the year putting the pieces together which is why we got The Law when we did.
-
Basically Jim can point to Nameless always being there, in the background, in every case file
indeed? The regardless of if he is or isn't cowl, did or didn't have a hand in those things.. I gotta say it just doesn't have any oomph of reveal to me without a deeper connection of whom nameless really is? I mean, if the supervillain reveals himself and says,"it was ME all along Harry. I did it." And Harry's best reply is,"who the F$&+ are you?" Then he's delegated to... I'm not sure the word, I wanna say mcguffin, but cross that with the fall guy in any Scooby Doo episode.(he'd be the meta version of Vitto!) And that just doesn't seem enough without anything else on nameless, it'd be a cheap sell without his backstory, which probably exists.. he's likely one of the main players Jim talked about,"we still haven't met all of them yet." I find it particularly likely he's tied to any bureaucratic threads, possibly taking on the role id presumed "commissioner fairweather" played in stifling Murphy. The name, reveals it was always meant to be a fae subplot to me.
Point being, if you could give me some good ideas along the lines of WHY is nameless. His motives and what not I'd find this idea far more interesting a read. By and large I think motives give good broad strokes to base theory on.
-
... No-one in Maeves Court would have bothered to keep an eye on Harry….unless they were also Cowl ...
Margaret LeFey's son?
The Leanansidhe's faerie-godson (for a couple of decades at this point)?
Mab's Emissary in a conflict with Summer?
Someone high-enough in Mab's estimation -- having been the object of Mab's attention -- to be offered the job of Summer Knight?
Likely Starborn wizard?
No... obviously, Maeve and her court have no possible interest in Harry Dresden. ::)
-
Oh nice point, a mortal who isn’t interacting with the Fae until Mab forces him to be her emissary in Summer Knight is a point of constant Fae gossip years before that event.
Lea only came back into his life in Grave Peril the year before and she is definitely not a ‘he’. I doubt she makes her bargains public and Harry has kept silent about her until Grave Peril. She was not going to make her being duped by Harry more public unless forced to by say Mab under Winter Law, (which appears to have occurred) or someone who gave her the Athame via Nemesis. We are talking the deathcap incident, that Harry would rather die than be tamed, and beat Lea. This point only suggests Cowl is Nameless as only he would be in a position to follow up on the gift when it started taking effect. It must have given Cowl a warm little glow that Mab wasn’t getting her choice of Winter Knight, because Harry is untameable. Mab didn’t tell Maeve this (definitely not a “he” either) that leaves a male third party with access to Maeve and Lea in Winter and with control over Lea. Now who could that be?
Even the Erl King didn’t realise Harry was the son of Margaret Le Fay, that reveal didn’t come until Battle Ground I believe. Kringle knew (Vadderung is keeping tabs on all Starborn I bet) and Mab knew via Lea. It is likely this only became better known among the Fae after he was appointed Emissary and then Winter Knight. Then the gossip began.
At this time Chicago was already a base for the Swartalves, the White Court, Red Court and Nameless was planning for Maeve to move her Court to Chicago, forcing a similar move by Aurora (whose Knight was already based in Chicacago)
That you confused Winter and Summer Knight is probably just a slip, I know exactly what you meant.
-
Oh nice point, a mortal who isn’t interacting with the Fae until Mab forces him to be her emissary in Summer Knight is a point of constant Fae gossip years before that event.
We don't know what the fae gossip about.
But Maggie Sr. was certainly one of their topics, and her son may have been of some interest (mortals' children, historically, are hugely interesting to the fey).
Lea only came back into his life in Grave Peril the year before
Lea made a bargain with Harry when he was 16. Did she leave him alone thereafter??!?
I don't think so.
The wiki says:
In Grave Peril, the Leanansidhe has spent many years attempting to get Harry Dresden to honor his bargain and become hers /quote]
- https://dresdenfiles.fandom.com/wiki/The_Leanansidhe?so=search#Grave_Peril
If she was throwing lures & tricks & pressures his way, it's entirely-possible a bunch of faeries knew about it, particularly those in Maeve's court: Mab's handmaiden is only slightly-less-interesting to Maeve than Mab herself!
But we also know that she was active with regards to Harry -- busy "Faerie-Godmothering" -- for a long time. Protecting him, without his notice.
... Lea ... is definitely not a ‘he’ ... Mab ... (definitely not a “he” either) ...
Definitely!
But I assert there's plenty of "he" individuals who could have offered Maeve info on Harry (the Redcap springs to mind, but a bunch of Maeve's bully-boy sidhe are "he's").
... Even the Erl King didn’t realise Harry was the son of Margaret Le Fay, that reveal didn’t come until Battle Ground I believe ...
Pretty sure you are mistaken, there: I'm away from home, can't check the scene, but in Changes when Susan & Harry were in his court, the Erlking referenced Margaret LeFey.
And Goodman Grey knew... Why the !?&%$ would a random deep-cover mercenary have track of the long-lost son of a 3-decades-dead wizard??!? If GG knew, I have to think it was well-known among the fey.
-
There is nothing as boring as talking about other peoples children, so no Harry was not gossip worthy.
Harry let Lea back in in Grave Peril. He studiously avoided her otherwise.
Lea is not going to let anyone know she was forced to re-negotiate a bargain with a mortal untameable would suggest they know despite her pride.
Which “he”? Not Lloyd Slate who as Winter Knight was supposed to be the go to guy on mortal matters. Who else had connection with the mortal world but was in a position to advise Maeve. Some new character we have never heard of still?
-
Eh, they were gossiping about who Margret had been "sporting" with and that he apparently "scored a goal" much better than lord Raith.