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The Dresden Files => DFRPG => Topic started by: sinker on October 12, 2010, 08:28:43 AM
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So I was reading through the book while thinking about rote spells for a character and the part about offensive blocks caught my eye. I decided to make a spell that would hold somebody (I.E. a block that prevented someone from moving). Days later I used it and it was less than effective, I couldn't draw enough shifts of power to make greater than a 5-shift effect at the time and 5-shifts really isn't that hard to meet or beat for someone remotely skilled and then the block is gone. A couple of days later I got an idea. A wizard can make a block, or using the same power make armor that is half as effective. So can we use that armor offensively, creating a lower level, longer lasting penalty to another's actions? What do you think?
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Or you could just perform an evocation maneuver with enough shifts to make it sticky... Probably more effective in the long run, and you don't need to house-rule it.
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I find an offensive block is very useful. My Chest Deep guy killed a Red by himself because he threw a block at the thing and started hacking away (he didn't have his spear in hand :( ). Just make sure the block is one shift or more above it, and you have a very good chance of getting it done.
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You brought up maneuvers and now that I'm thinking about the difference I don't think that I would allow it were I the GM. A sticky aspect would give him a -2 any time someone wanted to spend a fate point for the rest of the scene. This would allow me to give a -2 to everything (-3 if I wanted to spend another stress on it) for five or six exchanges, no fate points required. It's entirely too powerful...
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I was following up until the the -2 to anything and -3...
If you get a success for a maneuver, you get a fragile temp aspect that lasts one exchange (IIRC), you have to get more successes to make it last longer than one exchange (hence sticky). (YS114-115)
Fragile temp aspects go away as soon as you tag it. Sticky stays until it's removed (or times out), but can only be tagged once (invoked for no fate point cost) and requires expenditure of fate points afterwards.
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Just realizing why the concept of offensive armor is too powerful. An offensive armor spell (the second example above) would be like a maneuver with constant free tags.
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I don't understand how it would be "like a maneuver with constant free tags." As Drashna pointed out, only the first time the temp Aspect was tagged would be free. After that any time its invoked it costs one fate point. I'm still learning the game, but I'm relatively certain you're mistaken in this case.
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It's not an aspect that's why. Here is the whole concept. Blocks can be used offensively to stop others from doing something (I.E. Holding someone in place with a spell or covering a door with a gun so that no one can get through). One of the things evocation can do is block, or the caster can instead choose to create armor for half the value. So the original question is can that armor be used offensively like a block? If so a wizard could, with a 6-shift spell, give an enemy a constant -3 penalty to every action for as long as the wizard wanted to maintain the spell without spending a single fate point.
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You guys realize that you can use magic to Grapple someone and Block all actions, right?
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Yes, but like I said earlier a 5 or 6-shift block isn't terribly hard for anyone with a good skill level to break. Or maybe my GM was just rolling lucky...
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Possibly was just rolling lucky. Without invoking aspects someone with Superb as their skill level should only be breaking out of a block like that half the time (that's not taking into account supernatural powers). Superb skill level equating to "a veteran or masterful capacity, or the combination of extreme talent and good training."
It may be that your GM is setting the NPC abilities too high for your group - it's easy to do when you're getting used to the system. I've done it myself. Or you may just have been up against a particularly skilled opponent. NB The GM should be stating any aspects they are invoking in the same way that a player has to.
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What was preventing you from pushing the block strength up and taking backlash?
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Why is it every time I see this Thread header, I want to jump in and snark...?
Just wondering. I'll go back to trolling now. :P
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maybe it pushes your buttons, some threads just do that to me... usually ones about enchanted items and balance but eh every one has something
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Whenever I see this thread header I think of the comic at:
http://www.oglaf.com/breastplate/ (http://www.oglaf.com/breastplate/)
IMPORTANT warning: not safe for work, but funny.
Second warning: That's one of the cleanest panels for that comic. Seriously, some are little more than porn with a couple of jokes mixed in.
Richard
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I love Oglaf