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Messages - Mira

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6421
DF Spoilers / Re: A Question About Naagloshii
« on: June 14, 2019, 04:03:34 AM »
First, rape is not just an act of violence.  It is a violation of free will. 

Secondly, from what Jim has shown us, the skinwalker is not the type to commit to a long term plot.  I don't think it would pretend to be a loving, caring mate for nine months just for one pay-off at the end.  It seems more likely to commit one act that would continue to torture the woman, making her fear what was growing inside her.

After giving birth she could do many different things (kill the baby, abandon it, etc...), but while still pregnant her options would be fewer.

Unless the creature's plan was to create an offspring.

That could indeed have been it's plan... Agreed that rape is a violation of free will, however posing as a lover or husband is also a form of rape..  As to long term plots, getting back at Morgan for killing one of them was a long term, plot.

6422
DF Spoilers / Re: What is Harry Watching?
« on: June 13, 2019, 08:39:33 PM »
Judging by his reaction to Mab's gift in the Christmas Eve story, he's probably seen Frozen more times than he'd have ever wanted to.

Or Frosty the Snowman....

6423
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(And back to Proven Guilty, under Illinois law, I'm pretty sure Harry would be guilty as an accomplice in murdering that warlock kid, but I do not have experience in Illinois accomplice liability laws).

    Or would that have been considered an execution lawfully carried out by another government, under the authority of it's governing body? 

6424
The failing of mortal law isn't that it doesn't foresee a Cassius like situation. That sort of thing happens all the time, and that's why I'm certain Harry's actions do not constitute the legal concept of self defense and do constitute murder. The problem is that Harry, having defeated his opponent, can't hand him off to the authorities because the authorities can't handle a warlock. Not that the Council could, either. That's why the Council has the death penalty for every breach of the Seven Laws.

While thinking of an alternative definition of murder, other than a legal one, I looked to some religious texts and could come up with an argument that Harry didn't commit murder, but instead he fulfilled a duty to protect others when he killed Cassius. I'm not going into detail because it's a "Forbidden Discussion Item."

Defense,  Harry feared for his life.... Evidence, multiple knife wounds on his body, torture, finger prints belonging to Cassius are on the knife, bonds that were used to tie Harry down...  We have a 200 pound sloppily grinning dog who broke the neck of the guy trying to kill his master.. But except for his size, Mouse would appear pretty harmless, and he has  the intelligence to appear harmless. To vanilla mortals, Foo dogs are stone statues that guard Chinese restaurants, not deadly divine guardians.  Harry, his mind clouded by pain, blood loss, and torture, gave the final command to his dog, but who is to say he still didn't still fear for his life?  It can be argued that he wasn't exactly rational at that moment.   Men have been acquitted of murder in real life on less compelling evidence ....   One case in particular comes to mind, but I don't want to step over the line..  You have the law, and then you have evidence, you also have circumstance....  That is why we have trials...

6425
DF Spoilers / Re: A Question About Naagloshii
« on: June 13, 2019, 06:57:58 AM »
If it were under orders/compulsion, then sure; it could have done whatever it needed to.  Then I move over to wondering who/what gave the orders, and why, and whether THAT is going to become part of the ongoing DF plotline(s)?

But if it weren't compelled... I return to thinking that any extended seduction would have been more time and effort than it would have found worth expending for ANY mortal.  I think a "simple" seduction, lost-weekend style, or overt rape, would be all the time & effort a naagloshi would be willing to expend on any mortal.

Except Mr Grey seemed to know his father, or at least what it was..  I think you are underestimating the amount of sadistic pleasure gained by the naagloshi...  It does have it's sadistic pleasures, that is why it spent so much time on poor Thomas...  The time and effort are worth it...

6426
DF Spoilers / Re: What does the White Council Do?
« on: June 13, 2019, 06:53:30 AM »
On what are y'all basing your estimation that the WC spends so much time on training? Based on Carlos, let's say an apprenticeship is 15 years. How many apprentices would a wizard have to have before they spent a majority of time on 3? Let's say it takes them 5 years to find an apprentice if they're out there looking. So let's say ten apprentices. Do we know of any wizard who has had more than two apprentices?

I'd say the main purpose of the Council is enforcing the Laws of Magic. I base this on things like the conversation between Harry and Luccio in White Night about it.

That is the problem, remember in Proven Guilty when the Korean kid got the chop, the Merlin explained to Harry that there were too many kids with talent and not enough wizards to train them...
So they go warlock and get the chop... Part of the reason being the penalty is so harsh if the wizard makes a mistake with his or her charge, they both get the chop, most just do not want to take the risk...

6427
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Initially Mab only saw Lea having both a strong Word-promised debt of Harry which would allow her to manipulate and control the young mortal wizard, and the Athame as too much power initially, so, she took Harry's debt because that would be a better long term use than the evil blade.  After all, Harry used impressive guile to outwit Lea while in Winter's domain specifically when she had all the power and courage to risk his own life in saving himself.  Mab probably watched the confrontation of Harry and Bianca, either in live form or some fae observing (she isn't bound from not using the information to harm Bianca because she is dead), and sees Harry's wrath and love driving him to make war.  Remember that Mab respects Love and the way it can drive people to do some very dark things.

I think Mab is well aware that Harry is starborn as well as a wizard,  she most likely impressed how he managed to clear her of the charges of murdering the Summer Knight, which also left her short a Winter Knight... So quite natural she'd want him on her team.... Let's not forget that though Mab may have taken on Harry's debt to Lea, she still could not force him to become her Knight.  As a mortal, Harry still has free will...

6428
DF Spoilers / Re: A Question About Naagloshii
« on: June 12, 2019, 06:11:00 PM »
Very true.  Even if the woman wasn't a nun, the woman could be a very religious person and holder in strong beliefs.  Though, to go darker, the skinwalker might not even have killed the man, yet.  The man's torture, if he loved his wife, would be to be forced to watch from some portal or crystal his wife having dinner with the skinwalker, and then the sex and then the rape.  If the family was ignorant to the supernatural, the skinwalker might not even reveal his ruse to the wife, leaving her to think her husband did this to her.

Yeah,  it doesn't take a lot of imagination from what we know of the skinwalker to think it not capable of that.   It also goes a long way to explain Goodman Grey's bitter attitude about a lot of things...  What comes to mind is he was a big reason why the mission to the vault ended in success yet, because of who his father was he cannot cross the threshold into Michael's yard..  Another thought just hit me, it could be the reason why his mother named him, "Goodman."   It's sending a message that genetics aside he is still basically a good person willing to fight the good fight.

6429
DF Spoilers / Re: What is Harry Watching?
« on: June 12, 2019, 05:25:32 PM »
Just means he's watching Frozen, as a good Winterling should.


Try Princess Sophia..... 

6430
DF Spoilers / Re: What is Harry Watching?
« on: June 12, 2019, 02:16:48 PM »
I was just thinking if Harry is crashing in Molly's apartment for the past few months, the Svartálfar likely have a means of allowing the internet into their place for communication.  So, if Harry or Molly are paying a subscription and the TV is protected from magic, what shows on Netflix, Hulu, Amazon, or others do you think Harry is enjoying to allow him to keep up to date on his cultural wiseassery?

The whole Star Wars saga, and the newer Trek movies, he maybe even watching the new series... But somehow I doubt he is watching all that much, Harry is a reader...  Also little Maggie will be keeping him very busy...

6431
DF Spoilers / Re: A Question About Naagloshii
« on: June 12, 2019, 11:22:38 AM »
Seduction comes in several sorts... there's the "fling" sort of thing, the one-night-stand, the lost weekend, the week-on-vacation-and-never-seen-again, etc.  That isn't really "in love," and the "big reveal" might be horrifying, disgusting, etc...  Inducing someone to fall deeply in love?  I agree that the sadism is far greater; but I doubt that a Naagloshi would care enough about any mortal, be patient enough, to invest all that time... they despise humans too much to invest that much into any of them!

Depends on what it's motives were....  What it did to Thomas for example, it didn't just beat him up to hold him to trap Harry... No, it sadistically did it over and over again to the point of death, so Thomas would have to feed until death over and over again, young innocent girls.. I call that sadistic...  So yeah,  depending on what it's orders were it is very capable of appearing as a handsome young man or worse yet murdering the husband or lover of the woman, taking his shape, get her pregnant, stick around as the loving lover or husband until she gives birth, then reveal the horror that it is... 

6432
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Cassius was not in the process of doing anything. He had been defeated. Mouse had him under control.

Harry wasn't in the best of shape, I believe he passed out moments later.. One could argue his state of mind wasn't the best... And absolutely, Mouse and Butters should both be convicted as well.. So if Butters and Mouse hadn't come on the scene, you would of called Cassius actions self defense?  It was premeditated on Harry's part?
Um, it was was Cassius with the help of Grevane who ambushed and got Harry down in the first place so Cassius could slowly take him apart in hopes of gaining a coin, thinking he had the coin of Lasciel on him, his intent was to kill Harry slowly if he didn't get one...  So perhaps that makes me a bad juror, not convicting Harry according to you is how the law reads.  But on this evidence?  Convicting would be bad justice...

6433
DF Spoilers / Re: Fate of the original Merlin
« on: June 12, 2019, 11:02:46 AM »
That was telepathy though, not a vocal conversation. Harry probably assigns attitudes of vague superiority as sounding British largely thanks to his experience with Langtry.

  How do we know that isn't how he is communicating with the "British" prisoner?   I also doubt that the original Merlin would use British slang like, "piss off.."

6434
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a. Murder is the [1.] unlawful killing of [2.] another [3.] human being [4.] with malice aforethought, expressed or implied. 1. Harry killed Cassius. 2. Cassius is not Harry. 3. Cassius is a human being. 4. Harry meant the action that killed Cassius. I'm aware this isn't a full explication of my case, but figured it was best to leave it simple and see which points you don't agree with instead of typing up a couple of weeks of law school classes for no reason.

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b. The innocence or guilt of the person killed is irrelevant.

I disagree, so would a jury in many cases... 

A technically maybe, but Mouse killed Cassius, not Harry... On Harry's orders perhaps, but Harry was on his back,bleeding, about to pass out, Cassius was in the process of killing him rather painfully and slowly, would have too, when Butters and Mouse came in to save the day. And it was Butters who sicced Mouse on Cassius.. You might call that murder, but it sounds more like self defense or at the very least justified homicide..Nor was it premeditated.   Don't know about law school but if I was sitting on a jury, that is how I'd see it.

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We next hear of Lea in Dead Beat.  When Harry summons Lea , Mab appears wearing a knife that is assumed to be the Atheme.  She tells Harry that Lea is detained but in no danger.

True, but what we don't know is how Mab acquired the Atheme..  We know that Lea is detained, but don't know if it is because she defied Mab or because she is showing symptoms of infection or both.. As of Summer Knight Maeve appears more or less sane if one can go by the scene in Mac's bar...  However at some point she came in contact with the Atheme, became infected to the point where Mab couldn't cure her as she had Lea or herself..  So was Mab's contact with the infected Atheme brief?  We next hear of Lea in Dead Beat.  When Harry summons Lea , Mab appears wearing a knife that is assumed to be the Atheme.  She tells Harry that Lea is detained but in no danger.

So one assumes that Mab got the Atheme from Lea... But in Cold Days after Maeve's death Mab says.  page 503 hardcover
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"It was the knife," Mab said.
"Knife?"
"Morgana's athame," Mab said in a neutral tone---but her eyes were far away." The one given by the Red Court at Bianca's masquerade.  That is how the Leanansidhe was tainted---and your godmother spread it to Maeve before I could set it right."

Which begs the question as to how the infection is spread in the first place...  Because either Lea gave the knife to Maeve and Mab took it from her before Dead Beat, or it can be spread through other means which Mab was unaware of before it had gone too far in Maeve...

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