I'm writing, but it short, sourcebook pieces for a gaming company -- 150 - 250 word pieces that add color to the product. It's challenging to do, and I like doing it.
Craig
How did you get that job *droooooooooools*
put a few more words down but then I hate them and rewrite them. Its getting really frustrating that i am spending a good long while on a part but my story is not getting any longer.
Thanks Mr. King always good to get one of those much needed friendly slaps in the face to get me going lol.
I have gotten over the hump with a rather simple solution. Why try and explain everything in one scene when I can spread it out. I am planing on this being at least a trilogy, unless the characters go union then I'm screwed lol.
I find it funny that I am at almost two thousand words and my main character hasn't yet left his bedchambers, though granted a good chunk was prologue.
Had total brain constipation yesterday and got a word count of pretty much 0 :(
Fortunately, today worked out a lot better for me. I managed to knock out 3500 words. This brings the running total up to 39K on my current project. I'm exhausted right now but feeling a bit more accomplished.
Ack I've been a bad otter, I haven't written a damn thing in two days, and you guys are busting out three thousand words a night. *facepalm*
(yes I meant to write otter not Author)
the problem is that I second guess myself so much while I write that I end up only getting a few hundred words down a day when I actually get around to writing.
Though it does not help that the only time I have to write is in the evening or weekends which is also the only time I have for friends and other fun stuff.
Sometimes wanting to be a writer sucks lol but I wouldn't want to be anything else.
After a long time, back to work on Merlin's Legacy. Right now, it's finishing it, then worrying about all the changes I'm going to have to make. Still, at 90,000+ words, it's not a bad size.... ;D
Craig
fixed a few plot holes sorted out basic plane for my books ending witch is good
got some people to bata read by first book (the start of it at least)
good luke with your writting everyoone
So I actually sat down and counted what I've written so far, and it comes up to just under 20,000 words. Wow. Had no idea I'd put that much in since I work on it in dribs and drabs. An evening here, a saturday here, with lots of breaks for what I call "research."
You'd have to ask Shecky if what I'm doing is "writing" or "just doing fan stuff" I suppose. ;) Started out as a lit challenge/character bio with my fleetmates on Star Trek Online and it's grown into A Project. (I find myself compelled to be Super Power Uber Anal about fitting it into not only the series/movie canon, but also the stuff from the "classic" trek books.) I thought it was going to be a short story or two about a couple of my characters, but the stories climbed all up on one another and got to loving, and now more stories are happening, which is exactly what my wife told me would happen. So I don't know if I'm writing a book, a novella, or just a Class III Charlie Foxtrot Whisky Tango.
Cut and paste! Instead of dropping those deleted words, dump the stack in a seperate "scraps" document on the off chance you've got a scene, bit of dialogue or image you can re-purpose or simply draw some ideas from later.
Cut and paste! Instead of dropping those deleted words, dump the stack in a seperate "scraps" document on the off chance you've got a scene, bit of dialogue or image you can re-purpose or simply draw some ideas from later.
Way to go PG. Aim for the bleachers!!!
The Deposed King
i do chapter titles yes its fun some of them are rely quite good
or at least i think so
most of the work i am doing at the moment are for the second draft of the second book witch is around 4,050 words and growing as i am working on it wright now
good luck with your chapter titles :)
I've been playing with the free trial of the Scrivener program mentioned in the "Tools for Authors" thread. It's proven to be a very handy tool for organization and recording the odd fragment or idea for later scenes I'm not ready to write yet. If anyone has brilliant ideas, gems of dialogue and then uses them, this program will be invaluable.
Dog walking is good. Another plot fail sorted itself out today. The dog is going to be exhausted by the time I'm done.
Honestly my thinking place is in the bathroom. I have come up with some good plot points while taking a long shower or brushing my teeth.
I have been considering going to a Acupuncturist/chiropractor to help with my tension and sinus issues which make it hard to think. Luckily I live in a country where these things are affordable and can actually be covered by insurance. Yay Korea.
I live in a studio apartment in Korea, I don't have a bathtub.
having to take a back seat and only do bits and peases to the first draft of the second book till i get exams out the way and get the second draft of the first book back from being spell checked
but after exams i shall be more active with both maybe get the first one to a point where i will start liserning to the people telling me to try andget it published (i don't think its finished yet and want to get exams out of the way first)
Cranked out a couple thousand words. Up to 66k on the sequel right now!
The Deposed King
well goody for you
bet you don't have exams to revise for getting in your way (i am geluse sorry)
well done never got a story to be that long persanly 66,000 sounds like a lot of words
There is always something to slow you down. Life gets in your way. The important thing it tenacity and determination. The old Galaxy Quest line, 'Never give up. Never Surrender!'
The Deposed King
okay so got lodes of school wrk done this week so this morning i took a brake and wort about 500-600 words and broke the 8,000 word barier that has been aluding me these last few munths on my curent book
witch is good
CWG
P.s. good luck with all your writting everyone :)
Honestly my thinking place is in the bathroom. I have come up with some good plot points while taking a long shower or brushing my teeth.One thing I've seen suggested for this kind of thing is a dive slate (http://www.amazon.com/Scuba-Diving-Writing-Slate-Pencil/dp/B004UIDRXK/ref=pd_sbs_sg_20). Amazon has a bunch of different sizes.
@ StarbeamIf it's something completely major that changes a lot, I go back. If it's not something so much, I keep going. But in this instance, the first revision changed when and how a couple characters were introduced. I kept having a sticking point at just about the 10k point, because I had an organization that I couldn't give a motivation to, and my husband kept telling me to rip it out or introduce it later--I kept saying that wouldn't work, but in this latest revision, I figured out how to do it and make it work. Which mean I had to kill pretty much everything past about 7k.
This was something I've been wondering about--I started ripping through (one of the major plot revisions you talked about) and revising last weekend. But then I couldn't quit. I'm wondering, is it better to revise or just to make a note to go back and just keep working ahead with whatever change you made?
As for the long hand, I'm a legal pad and blue pilot pen addict :P Everytime I get stuck on something, I have to step away and go "old school"
thanks and well done any tips for edditing as i am getting to that stage for my first book now
the one i am mostly talking about is the siqual to the first one because i curently have to wait for sooper spell checkers to finnish with it
but its turt me some things about time manigment and asking someone to spellcheck 24,000 + words in one go is unrialistic
got to go do bio coruswork dam ;D
good luck with all your witting everyone
CWG
thanks thats realy helpful i have a few people i can ask witch
i will do when they wake up as it around 6:50 am right now and it would not me a good idea to wake them up
thank you
CWG
The long awaited screenplay is almost ready. 4 years in the making.
5 scenes left to revise for the new draft. Then one pass for typos.
Then off to posting to Amazon Studios.
Excited & Nervous Simultaneously....
Apparently I got con crud at I-Con. Or something. Scratchy throat and coughing aren't too conducive to writing. I've gotten maybe 1/2-3/4 page written the past two days. So less than 250 words. But I'm hoping this stuff will die quick, and the writing should pick up easily since I know where the next few scenes go.
Apparently I got con crud at I-Con. Or something. Scratchy throat and coughing aren't too conducive to writing. I've gotten maybe 1/2-3/4 page written the past two days. So less than 250 words. But I'm hoping this stuff will die quick, and the writing should pick up easily since I know where the next few scenes go.
The long awaited screenplay is almost ready. 4 years in the making.
5 scenes left to revise for the new draft. Then one pass for typos.
Then off to posting to Amazon Studios.
okay got about 100 or so words done to day
good luck with your writting everyone ;D
CWG
hay i just looked at my word count some how it increast by 300 words with out me noticing i have ritton more then i thought
but thanks
good luck with your writting everyone ;D
CWG
86K on Admiral's Gambit. Like a turtle I'll slowly push it over the finish line. 95 of 134k through the first editing pass.
The Deposed King
okay now my 24.5K looks pethetic :(
well done though
i hope so thanks The Deposed King
i got 200 word done to day wow thats bad :( oh well there is always tommorow
*wimpers* a good day for me is when i get to open the document due to school mostly
and then i come here and read stuff like this it makes me want to cry :'(
well done you two hopfuly i will get some more done soon but now back to maths :'( (thats worse)
Don't think in terms of numbers of words, everyone has a different writing style and pace. My time actually spent typing comes in spurts. I'll spend a week or three just replaying scenes, coming up with the odd phrase or image, and spend an evening or two hammering it out, so it's not like I'll sit down and pull 2 or three thousand words out of my brain at once. They've been up there fermenting for a while. ;)
Now, if I could sit down and write 2 or three thousand words every night, then I'd be a real handful.
As you can tell by my Sig, my seventeeth BattleCorps story was published today. My goal of 8 stories this year is one closer to reality! ;D
Craig
Don't think in terms of numbers of words, everyone has a different writing style and pace. My time actually spent typing comes in spurts. I'll spend a week or three just replaying scenes, coming up with the odd phrase or image, and spend an evening or two hammering it out, so it's not like I'll sit down and pull 2 or three thousand words out of my brain at once. They've been up there fermenting for a while. ;)
Now, if I could sit down and write 2 or three thousand words every night, then I'd be a real handful.
Triumphant Napoleon! (A bit of a premature pete moment, as I still have to revise the opening chapter to more fully sink in the hook for all you little fishes) I had about 20 paragraphs of preamble before diving into the dialogue/action, it might be too long.
But other than that Admiral Who is coming in at a cool 125-126K fully edited and ready to rumble. Baring unforseen difficulties it should be available in an Amazon near you probably next week sometime. Fingers crossed and knock on wood.
Also decided the last 18K of my second potential cut off point did better as a free excerpt of book 2 put in the back of Admiral Who to get you to want to read the next book. Plus I managed to nail in part of the overarching series plot line that I was struggling with finding the right place to insert.
On the sequel front, I'm up to 92K under the previous counting system but with the addition of this 18k that I wasn't sure which book to fit in. (The original question was did I want the knock down drag out battle scene in the end of Admiral Who or the beginning of Admiral's Gambit? Well that's been decided.) The new count official count for the first draft of the sequal will is 110K.
Still got another 15k+ to before I can possibly call the 2nd book finished though. But I'm feeling pumped. Got to go get a new job so that's going to seriously cut into the writing time and motivation but I'm determined not to let anything ruin this awesome feeling.
Have a good one guys and remember to keep plugging away no matter what.
And don't ever let anyone get you done,
The Deposed King
Big hairy step! Congrats TDK!
OK, so in another thread we are talking about shitty first drafts. I was re-editing and going gangbusters and then I hit that god awful chapter of disaster we all have lurking in our first drafts. I mean so bad that I needed crest toothpaste up the nose to cover up the smell. If it weren't for you guys, i would be hung up on that blasted thing for weeks, probably get discouraged and my process would turn into molasses. Thanks to you guys, I just highlighted its royal ugliness and moved on.l I can fix it later. Onward into the pages!
You've got your own process so go for it cenwolfgirl. I just urge you to give yourself the permission to write something less than what you want and move on. Find yourself a good editor (a friend or fellow author who you can return the favor for) and fix it up when you get a completed draft.i would go donw lode this now but i have to revise for exams and know it would be more intresting then maths
By the way guys, as I mention in another thread I just put my first book up on amazon. Put it under my son's name, out of love.
http://www.amazon.com/Admiral-Spineward-Sectors-Novel-ebook/dp/B007WQSY44/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1335232665&sr=8-1
I don't have access to word right now, so I have to make a few minor changes in format as soon as I do. But you can read the first 10@ for free on Amazon's Kindle for PC. Or kindle if you have one!
I'm kind of interested in how the first chapter plays out. The original draft had about 20 paragraphs of preamble and I chopped it down.
Always follow the dream,
The Deposed King
You've got your own process so go for it cenwolfgirl. I just urge you to give yourself the permission to write something less than what you want and move on. Find yourself a good editor (a friend or fellow author who you can return the favor for) and fix it up when you get a completed draft.
By the way guys, as I mention in another thread I just put my first book up on amazon. Put it under my son's name, out of love.
http://www.amazon.com/Admiral-Spineward-Sectors-Novel-ebook/dp/B007WQSY44/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1335232665&sr=8-1
I don't have access to word right now, so I have to make a few minor changes in format as soon as I do. But you can read the first 10@ for free on Amazon's Kindle for PC. Or kindle if you have one!
I'm kind of interested in how the first chapter plays out. The original draft had about 20 paragraphs of preamble and I chopped it down.
Always follow the dream,
The Deposed King
I've just started writing again after a hectic end to my college semester and I've hit a brick wall. I'd joined a writing group and received a lot of lovely feedback from the members, but one of them hit on something that really slapped me into reality. My novel is very similar to DF. I had intended it to be alike, but different, I mean there are a lot of novels with a P.I. for a MC right? But while they loved the voice they said that the fact that he's a P.I., broke, and involved with the Fae might be too close for comfort. Then the idiocy of my Bob-like character, a ghost that speaks through a radio, really hit me as just too much. I'm not sure if I'm worried over nothing or if I should work on changing these similarities asap. The story itself is certainly different and by the end my MC isn't even a P.I. anymore, but the beginning needs to bring in the readers.
I say finish it as is. Of course that depends how far you are into the word count. But honestly, I wouldn't let others stop you. Pump out the product. You can always go back and edit some of the more egregious stuff out if its truely full of the suckage.
Pearls and Swine. Pearls and Swine.
My 2 cents anyways.
don't let anything stop you,
The Deposed King
I agree. Just finish it. Get the entire manuscript done as a first draft. There is nothing more satisfying for projects as big as a novel.
I would politely beg to disagree.
Finishing a through draft is really good, granted. Having an established writer whose work you deeply respect read it and say "wow, that's genuinely good" is better, IME. And I have a ticking suspicion that having an editor actually buy one of the things might feel better again.
Also, from my observation of writers, getting a Hugo nomination also seems to be up there as a candidate for most satisfying thing that can happen with a novel-sized project.
Not sure if it has that delightful ra-ra-re spin at the end of it, to help encourage completion of that very first hill! Which I will maintain is a big accomplishment.
Oh, absolutely and utterly, and I do not mean to diminish that for an instant. Sorry, just being OCDish.Just so long as you leave my spelling out of your OCD then we will be fine ;D
Just so long as you leave my spelling out of your OCD then we will be fine ;D
oh and your old :P ;D
and i just did (five maths questions) and 200 words in my little side project
the latter was more fun
I've had some of the stories I've written compared to both Terry Pratchett (Discworld) and William Goldman (The Princess Bride). It bothered me some, at first, because I felt like they were saying I had no voice of my own. But, upon further review, it could have been a lot worse. If I'm going to be compared to someone, it might as well be someone whose talent I respect and enjoy. :D
I don't know that I've ever been directly compared to someone I really admire, though people have commented on a certain Douglas Adams influence in some of my work (not for the humour, but for the doing complex ideas well in a few lines, which I take as a high compliment.)
Steven Brust did say I was cute once, though.
Cool
You two are making me want to though one of my stories to the preverbial wolves
Witch is a first normaly I think such ideas as laughable
When you're ready I wouldn't be afraid. You can't let fear stop you. On the other hand make sure your draft is done, and you've done enough editing that you are proud of what you show.thank you i needed that kick up the but :)
Sometimes comments can be harsh, when readability is low. It takes a while to build a thick skin.
You can try on baen's bar. Look around the slush pile and see what others are doing. Or find some beta readers.
Don't let anything discourage you. Don't be rushed either but conversely, don't hesitate. She who hesitates is lost after all.
Just be brave and be ready. That's all you can do. I'm sure you'll do fine. It took me lots of years, and even some comments asking if english was my second language. Which stung. But finally I created something I'm very proud of. I know you can too.
The Deposed King
hey, empty your inbox neuovore! meg
Nice one shades.
I tacked on another 600 words today, it seems to be my limit after a day at work :(
*sigh* didn't get anything done this week, so it will probably be three weeks from today before I get time to write seriously again.
*sigh* didn't get anything done this week, so it will probably be three weeks from today before I get time to write seriously again.yep this dose not seem to be a good week for writing
Hitting your word count is always good.I've had to pretty much build up the momentum from writing nothing for several months last year-wedding and all that-and I started slow--at first just trying to get anything written--then setting myself a word count-started at 250 a day, now up to 500, and anything I don't get, I try to make up for on the weekends. More often than not, I'm getting maybe 100-300 during lunch, and sometimes I can manage a little bit more after work. But for me it is definitely one of those things where the more often I write, the more gets written.
I had to give up on it. My method is slightly... erratic, so I just find if I've got anything down on paper at all it's a good thing.
Do you find the best ideas always come when you're stuck at work?
Hitting your word count is always good.or school
I had to give up on it. My method is slightly... erratic, so I just find if I've got anything down on paper at all it's a good thing.
Do you find the best ideas always come when you're stuck at work?
so juelus shades good luck
How can 168 pages only be 33.7k words. It just seems unfair. It should be so much higher dammit.Manuscript pages? My WiP is 50.8k, and it's 102 manuscript pages. 131 paperback pages, according to Scrivener. Can depend on a lot of stuff, like font size and white space and all that.
I'll give it another pass, possibly adding in another subplot I've been sitting on for a potential sequel. I dunno, what's really the target for novels these days? I wanna say I heard it was 80k once. I know Nanowrimo aims for 50k and that's only supposed to be a stop gap to something larger.
I'll give it another pass, possibly adding in another subplot I've been sitting on for a potential sequel. I dunno, what's really the target for novels these days? I wanna say I heard it was 80k once. I know Nanowrimo aims for 50k and that's only supposed to be a stop gap to something larger.
I'll give it another pass, possibly adding in another subplot I've been sitting on for a potential sequel. I dunno, what's really the target for novels these days? I wanna say I heard it was 80k once. I know Nanowrimo aims for 50k and that's only supposed to be a stop gap to something larger.All depends on the kind of book you're writing. For fantasy, it depends on the subgenre. An urban fantasy is generally around 80-100k. Anne Sowards said the first Ilona Andrews novel was 90k and after that they're around 100k. Another author of hers, Myke Cole, had his first book come in around 125-130k, and the second is supposed to be around 100k. Epic fantasy will be a lot longer, usually around 250-300k. Some of the tomes come in even higher, like Martin's books. I believe Dance with Dragons was somewhere around 500k.
how?I have to sleep normally--from around 11pm to 6:30am. I can't stay up any later because it keeps my husband awake, and he has to get up even earlier than I do. It's figuring out what's important. I set aside time to write--a half hour at lunch, 15-30 minutes between exercise and dinner, Friday nights, and Saturdays. I cut out a lot of reading, movies, tv, internet, anything that takes away from writing. I made certain to fly past my word goal this week because I'd had a trip planned for the last couple months. But I'm still taking my notebook with me, so that if there's time, I can write. I keep my phone or ipod with me all the time so that I always have that to put down notes. I keep my phone by the bed to jot down anything that comes to me then. If I get an idea anywhere that kinda thing's not possible--in the shower, driving--I get it down as soon as I can.
do you lot not sleep or some thing?
:(
by the way very well done
I think doing this edit is actually harder than writing the damn thing to begin with. Doesn't help that I am rolling on Dayquil and what feels like Small Pox - but trying to go back and edit sections of my tome while trying to remember what has and has not yet happened in the story as I go along. So I edit chapter three with quotes from Character A, only to realize they died in Chapter 1. Or adding in character's wielding MacGuffin A (prop) in chapter 1 and realize that its not even built until Chapter 10. That sort of thing.
Damn you, Small Pox. Damn you.
thank you yes it is only the second one i have done that with out side of class projects
so am happy with my self
i don't think it is any good and proberly will never show it to any one but hay i finnished a story
now back to the book i was writing before the exams and RL stole me
You should be happy with yourself. Congrats. I didn't read back very far can I ask how long it is? But you should show it to someone, that is how you get feedback. And is one way writers can stick together by helping each other.um it is just over 1,600 words 1,700 ish
um it is just over 1,600 words 1,700 ish
but its rely bad and i know its rely bad
but okay i might go find some one to tourcher with my first atempt at a short story at some point to dayy or tommorow
thank you
and good luck everyone
Finally got back to this sorry it took so long.
Number one: It's not up to you to decide if it's really bad or not. Yours is to do or die...oops I mean practice-practice and more practice. But and excuse me for saying it this way--but it might be rely bad as in awful or it could be your inner critic coming out to play but in either case having someone who sort of knows writing critique it is a good idea. That is one way you learn. There are online writing groups and critiquing groups if you don't know anyone.
fine i yeald i will go find so one to kill with this short story
but trust me it is teriable by almost every defonition of the word
or at least the ending is
fine i yeald i will go find so one to kill with this short story
but trust me it is teriable by almost every defonition of the word
or at least the ending is
lol i think i am right but i must ask HD??? who or what is that?
Harry Dresden. He can survive anything...well (This is not spoiler country so I dare not say more even though by censoring this I hint at something that is a spoiler so this becomes one of those bad if you do bad if you don't time paradoxes that gives everyone who tries to figure it out a headache so don't think about it) :)ooh lol well its is not yet 5 am and i have been up 2 hours head ace eh bring it
323 words so far to day witch is good
at some point i will have to get back to editing my other book (not the short story that is being left alone for now *shuders*)
good luck every one
Yeah, we merry little wanna be writers need to stick together!
I remember what it was like for me when I wrote a story, my first, and didn't have a clue whether it was any good. Someone, a very brave soul, volunteered to read it (at over 60,000 words), liked it and gave me some great advice. And here I am, still improving, I hope. But without her encouragement I might have given up.
Pardon me for saying it like this but that is some story...how long is your novel? :)
I should talk my first novel came in at 320,000 words.
Pardon me for saying it like this but that is some story...how long is your novel? :)
I should talk my first novel came in at 320,000 words.
yes all us trying to improve have to stick together
thank you so much
i think with out all of you i might have given up by now
and i am rely glade i did not
yes i now have it back
now making corections to try and improve it
good luck al of you
AIIEIEEEEE!!!Isn't that such a great feeling? I love it. :D
Too many thoughts, lines, images and scenes from the story I wasn't ready to work on are piling up and creating a self-sustaining reaction. Problem is, I can't write while I'm researching the things I need to because I cant' write them until I research them but I can't research them because the WORDS ARE TRYING TO GET OUT OF MY HEAD AND THEY AREN'T TAKING NO FOR AN ANSWER!
A kind of awesome sensation, I must admit.
AIIEIEEEEE!!!
Too many thoughts, lines, images and scenes from the story I wasn't ready to work on are piling up and creating a self-sustaining reaction. Problem is, I can't write while I'm researching the things I need to because I cant' write them until I research them but I can't research them because the WORDS ARE TRYING TO GET OUT OF MY HEAD AND THEY AREN'T TAKING NO FOR AN ANSWER!
A kind of awesome sensation, I must admit.
Ok, 2000 words from this morning's rather brief session, and more to come this evening after I go forth into sunlight and do Social Things Involving People. For me, the getting things started is the most time consuming part. Once I've herded some electrons, it's easier to sit down and continue. Having a lot of fun with it, particularly making the narrator's tone and language fit just right.2,000 and brife?
another 116 words down
to day is going well
Indeed! Keeping up a good steady pace gets more done in the long run than fits and spurts like I do.
^Very true.
Did you enjoy your episode of Andromeda?
I finally settled down last night and worked on one short story I'd been neglecting. Got 860 words added to my 10,000 words, which was good for me, since I've done zilch lately. Now I need to go back and refine, as I always write what I call quick and dirty, then edit, usually on another day when I'm fresh and new ideas are more likely to pop into my head.
At least my little writing session last night got me motivated again. :) And that's a very good thing.
good luck with that Neuro
Once I even had a character commenting about something that hadn't even happened yet in the story! Argh. I felt pretty stupid about that. Thank goodness I found it and quickly fixed it. :)
I suppose this is the benefit of being an architect or outliner. Of all the problems or things I might have and might need to change in the re-write rearranging chapters has never been one of them and that sounds horribly painful.
Yep, it's always something getting in the way, isn't it?It only gets in the way if you let it. This blog- Time Management (http://workawesome.com/productivity/time-management/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed:+Workawesome+(WorkAwesome)&utm_content=Google+Reader) might be helpful. Or this one, Manipulation of Time (http://critiquesisterscorner.blogspot.com/2012/01/manipulation-of-time.html), which equates time to money. And what it all boils down to is what are you doing instead of writing, and is it more important?
Sometimes I think the world conspires to inhibit my creativity. :-\
It only gets in the way if you let it. This blog- Time Management (http://workawesome.com/productivity/time-management/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed:+Workawesome+(WorkAwesome)&utm_content=Google+Reader) might be helpful. Or this one, Manipulation of Time (http://critiquesisterscorner.blogspot.com/2012/01/manipulation-of-time.html), which equates time to money. And what it all boils down to is what are you doing instead of writing, and is it more important?
For example, I've used up 3 hours that could've been spent writing. Two of those hours were sorta related to writing-I was hashing stuff out with my husband, working through a Mexican standoff sort of scene. I spent about a half hour trying to look up something relating to a different post, and then about another half hour finding these links.
While I might be a slight bit annoyed at myself for doing all that instead of writing, I'm also not beating myself up for it because I made my weekly word goal yesterday. Some things you can't get around doing-school, work.
But you can find time there to write. I write during my lunch hour-the half that I'm not eating/reading. I've had to make sacrifices--I don't read anywhere near as much as I used to. If I'm lucky, I read a book a month. However, I'm also very lucky in that my day job allows me to be able to listen to audiobooks, sometimes, while I'm working. Which also feeds the writing side of my mind because I've noticed that while I listen to audiobooks, I'm picking up on the craft.
And now I have to go find the shatterpoint for this Mexican standoff to get my characters out of the kitchen they're trapped in. Either that, or sleep.
*edited for getting rid of the OMGblockoftext*
I was sort of half way joking, but RL does, on a regular basis, interfere and there's nothing I can do about that, unless I find a cave and go live as a hermit, so I try not to waste the free time I have. Lately I've been re-reading DF and that is consuming my extra time. Once I'm done with DF I should be back on a semi-regular schedule of writing.
Yeah, RL can interfere quite easily at times...too easily.
But as to rereading DF Um,(Clears throat) Urm...I hate to tell you this but there's 13 novels published now--not sure if that includes "Side Jobs" and unless it takes you less then a week to read one--which would mean way too little writing time--number 14 will be out by the time you finish. All together it could take a year or more of waiting to get back on "a semi-regular schedule of writing".
Yeah, RL can interfere quite easily at times...too easily.
But as to rereading DF Um,(Clears throat) Urm...I hate to tell you this but there's 13 novels published now--not sure if that includes "Side Jobs" and unless it takes you less then a week to read one--which would mean way too little writing time--number 14 will be out by the time you finish. All together it could take a year or more of waiting to get back on "a semi-regular schedule of writing".
yesterday you did just under the length of the entire part of of my story that i am writing
oh and i have another 190 something words since i was last here
that for me is productive
(being slowne down by sneezing all most all the time ::) )
good luck everyone ;D
yesterday you did just under the length of the entire part of of my story that i am writing
oh and i have another 190 something words since i was last here
that for me is productive
(being slowne down by sneezing all most all the time ::) )
good luck everyone ;D
Even though I didn't come here for this I say that some writers need deadlines, they need the pressure. Others do quite well without them and some do badly with them. Cen you could be one that needs them. :)
And BTW I came to this discussion late I didn't know you were still in high school. Too bad about your relationship with your sister, that happens at times for various reasons, I hear.
But I wanted to say is that I have been revising too much lately. Can't take my laptop to work because it's too hot so last night I was feeling the Need To Write. Restarted a steampunk story and something else, I can't think of right now.
But my actual new writing has been way down sometimes less than a hundred words a day. Still feeling that way so I will be leaving to Write.
yeah i am still in high school (well we don't call it that over here in england but sumantics)
yes i work best with deadlines and proberly need them
but suck at setting them for my self as then i would never meet them ::)
also good luck
revising is hard
i could never do it on my own
there are some amazing people i rope and hood wink in to helping
good luck everyone
(me and my sister thats complicated)
good luck with your dead line starbeam
Having just finished my tenure at Google, I am now without much to do. I would look for more work, but I have the dreaded degree, "Interdisciplinary Studies".
So rather than try to get a job in insurance that will crush my proverbial soul, I've decided to take some time doing what I've been putting off because of work: Writing.
Well, writing and learning some 3D software packages. And proactively going to the gym for the first time in my life.
But, so far....not much writing. I know I can do it. I've done it before. I've churned out a buttload of pages in a few days...
And I'm sure I can do it again. Now is the time for self-development. For blazing a new trail. For finding what I want to do. Maybe now I can see if I have what it takes so-to-speak.
writing is like a gerny
its about the traverling not the destination
That sounds good. Writing can improve and exercise your mind and be a chance to learn to new things and meet new people. New things not just in writing, but you can find interesting by research and chatting with follow writers.
Prequel to TISBWO: through passes on one of the new chapters I worked with last time and two other chapters. May attempt the other compress-stuff-into-one-thing tonight, or may just go through one more chapter and call it a day.
Couple thousand words tonight, and a thousand or so yesterday.This is pretty much what I'm doing. I set myself a 500 word/day goal--or Rob did, I'd actually planned on 250 and upping once that was consistent--and for the first few months, it was a bit of a struggle to hit each day, but I always made up on the weekends. Now I'm hitting my goal, and often going a little over-usually depends on whether my only writing time is the half hour at work, or if I find time before dinner. And I've been doing so well at it that I've changed my deadline to finish this draft from October(my birthday) to August(my anniversary). But I'm actually hopeful that I'll finish sooner, since I'm taking off most of next week, and I have very few plans.
What seems to work best for me is the David Drake approach: Plan on writing 500 words a day, barring illness or unexpected houseguests and the like, anyway. Drake Lite I guess?
Both times, once I sat down, I realized I'd blown way past my quota and had fun doing it.
Another thing I've decided works for me is not to force myself to write the story chronologically. Today I had a particular scene just come to life and do a song and dance number in my melon while I was doing my Cubicle Drone In Sub-section Whisky Tango Foxtrot. It was a scene that was a couple chapters down the road, but when I got home I figured I'd get it while it was hot because the way my brain works, the intervening scenes would ripen and demand attention in their own good time. Worked out pretty good.
again wow you must have like all day to write or something
Oh, yeah...the temp thing...I should have indicated 104 C degrees. Forgot you go by F over your way. :P
aw well i have school
aand i could write more if
a. i did not like to sleep for at least 6 hours everyday
b i spent less time trying to be sociable round here
c i did not get so grumpy with RL as i don't do good writing when i am grumpy
ooh well done The Deposed King
Thanks C-girl. Best of luck in your own endeavours.thanks
The Deposed King
If you spent that long rereading then it must be good!
Chapter 6 done, 2846 words, which puts this whole beast over 20kwords. Now there will be cheering, and also dinner.
Cranked out another thousand words. Up to 117k on the sequel. I might just write some more.
Seeing 149 sales for the first 17 days of this month for my first book has really fired up my excitement to finish the sequel. Despite the fact I'm working a more than full time job right now.
The Deposed King
why did you just quate your self?
i got an idea for a story
in the same world as my main project
but in a different pireod of its history
lol King your silly
but very well done ;D
i plan on handing in my bio paper to day yes!
last day of the school year for me
so i shpould have time to do lots of writing i have at least three projects
two to start one to maybe get closer to finishing :)
good luck with the hamering out a few thousend words thing PG
good luck everyone ells ;D
CWG
Congrats, Deposed King. Keep up the good work everyone. 8)
Nice going there Mr. Lurker.
Keep it up and you wil lbe done in no time. :)
Deposed King....Very good.
126 down, another... 20-40k to go. What with finishing this book and writting the sneak peak for the next one.
thanks for the encouragement.
The Deposed King
Boy, that is going to be a long book. But then again my first one was 320,000 words long. Second was only 76,000 or so. ;D
But still sounds good.
Keep going! :)
Still blocked.
The ideas are willing but the pen is weak. :-\
When I'm on a scene that I'm excited about, I'll hammer through two or three thousand at a sitting while giggling and rolling my eyes like a mad prophet.
Now I don't feel so worried about my own behaviour.
Even one word in the right place is progress, Darkshore.
WTG TDK!
A little editing has happened. It was good.
wow you lot seem to have been having a productive few weeks
lucky
i have been away from my lap top for two weeks
and only been back for less then 24 hours
so i have not done any writing in a wile
:(
yeah
http://www.jimbutcheronline.com/bb/index.php/topic,33411.msg1518657.html#new (http://www.jimbutcheronline.com/bb/index.php/topic,33411.msg1518657.html#new)
is mostly why you have not seen me
well done you are making a lot of progress
to night i must actualy right something for the first time since before
events mentioned in link
btw why are we spelling my name in the wrong order?
um 482 words
not bad for first day back to writing
it is somthing at least :)
that project I was working on --- 72,000+ words and still not quite finished. Sent an Email asking for another day to finish it up, as it was due today. Now I'm wondering if the guy asking for it (Assistant line developer for the gaming line) will either be impressed or think I need Professional help..... :PCant it be both? :D
Craig
i don't rely watch tv so no i have notLately its been work and family obligations, but thats not really an excuse. The biggest problem is too many projects that I want to get done all at once, and only the two of them that are writing. I have been productive in that I borrowed some library credentials to get research materials, but I havent made any progress on the actual word count. Or on the Electric sword. Or on the Fusion reactor. Or on the Tesla Coil. Or on the kinect powered sketchpad software. Or on the musical ball bearing fountain. Or on the EEG controlled Quadrocopter. Or on that thing they call sleep.
lol its okay i am helping some one ells be productive at the same time
wow i am being productive for two people cool ;D
why can you not be productive what is stopping you?
Cant it be both? :D
I have one chapter and an epilogue left to write and then my first novel is complete. It's gonna end up around 40k so I guess it's really a novella. I tend to write short first drafts it seems. I keep my language extremely simple and use minimal description. Hopefully I can crank up the word-count in the re-write, but maybe I'm just more of a novella guy.
:o
wow T D King you rely can cover ground :o
good for you :)
right give me 5-10 years more expirence
not having to go to school most days might help
no work
um a cafinated drink or three
and then maybe i might be that good
but right now if i hit 500 words i am happy
but i do a lot of reasurch and stuff witch takes time when i am wroking o a project
plus right now i have things to eddit for a project i have been negelcting
and now i have a dog pestering me for a walk
As far as I'm concerned 500 words a day out of highschool, when you put your mind to it, is a major accomplishment. That's way ahead of where I was at the same time. And David Drake an author who has dozens of books out, says 500 words a day is his bench mark goal, one he has a hard time exceeding! And that's with writing as his full time career! If you can reach 500 you're already as good David Drake on the production side and that's while still going to school!
The way I look at it is this; what you want to demonstrate to publishers, and to your audience, is probably the ability to produce one novel a year, possibly two, unlikely to be more than that.
One novel a year, call it 100,000 words +/- 20,000. Which if you take two weeks off during the year to make the arithmetic easy is 2,000 words a week.
Whether you do that as 400 words a day with weekends off, or 2,000 words every Friday night (between 2,000 and 4,000 every Friday night is my basic work pattern for the past fifteen years; I shift that around within the week about 20% of the time to fit around my RL commitments, and I totally could not write two novels a year and hold down a dayjob without major changes in RL, but one novel a year I've pretty much been doing for that long, counting one 470,000 word monstrosity of a story as three or four physical volumes) is immaterial. It's possible to have a successful one-novel-a-year career based on writing the whole novel within a couple of months and goofing off the entire rest of the year; Iain (M.) Banks has been doing it for nearly thirty years, and produced some truly awesome books in that span.
So long as you get the stories out there and done, don't worry about the shape of process that works for you.
The way I look at it is this; what you want to demonstrate to publishers, and to your audience, is probably the ability to produce one novel a year, possibly two, unlikely to be more than that.
One novel a year, call it 100,000 words +/- 20,000. Which if you take two weeks off during the year to make the arithmetic easy is 2,000 words a week.
Whether you do that as 400 words a day with weekends off, or 2,000 words every Friday night (between 2,000 and 4,000 every Friday night is my basic work pattern for the past fifteen years; I shift that around within the week about 20% of the time to fit around my RL commitments, and I totally could not write two novels a year and hold down a dayjob without major changes in RL, but one novel a year I've pretty much been doing for that long, counting one 470,000 word monstrosity of a story as three or four physical volumes) is immaterial. It's possible to have a successful one-novel-a-year career based on writing the whole novel within a couple of months and goofing off the entire rest of the year; Iain (M.) Banks has been doing it for nearly thirty years, and produced some truly awesome books in that span.
So long as you get the stories out there and done, don't worry about the shape of process that works for you.
It is important to remember that while learning you should write every day.
Sounds like good advice and a successful model to me. Albeit one slightly focused on traditional publishing as the winning route.
You know, the whole point of my post was to emphatically take the position that this statement is wrong. There are people for whom forcing words every day is actively harmful. There are people whose lives cannot be rearranged to write every day. Saying things like that can read as setting barriers to people still figuring out their own processes.
Also, "while learning" ? Do you actually intend to stop learning at any point ? I don't.
Do what works for you.is it me but this line apares from many people in many threads in many forms
words are hitting the page
that is what i am trying but it is time consuming
i wish they would play ball ::)
Oh God, I have to pull a neuro--
-for several weeks! EEEEKKKK! Brain fusion please. If that isn't possible, maybe I can get a blood transfusion sent down? *sigh*
This made me chuckle, because in my home strand of English, the primary meaning of that phrase would be that you felt compelled to take a romantic interest in me. (I do not mean to suggest I am actually parsing it as such, it just gave me an amusing moment.)what a riot and NO that was not my intent, only your dedication to cranking out the words!
I'm not sure it works that way, but if there's anything I can do to help, I have cleared down my PM box, or you know where to find me in mail; Thu and Fri of next week are my work AGM but other than that I should be pretty quick on responses.I'll let you know, but it's at that 'just get it down and stop editing.' I'm enjoying re-reading it too much while editing and not progressing like I should.
ARGH! One of my Beta readers just gave my book to his mom... Normally I wouldn't care, but she was my eigth grade reading teacher and argh... Had to vent. I'd have preferred to wait until I was published to let her read it... If then. Now I'm nervous like its getting graded. :(
my mother is a blaber mouth :(
she told a friend (of hers) about one of the books i have finished
said friend has a (family member) who owns a publishing business
he has asked to see a sample of said book
AAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH !
the book is not ready yet (i know this for a fact some of the chapters still have spelling errors in them)
what the hell am i going to do ? :-[ :-\ :o
The greatest part to reading this section of the forum is that I keep seeing so many others having the same issues but finding a way to keep going forward with their writing.
Everyone, good luck with your endeavors as a writer. Like the great and wise oracle known as the Deposed King, I spent a lot of time in the past not finishing projects. I know that like the Deposed King, I will keep moving this time.
Kept on writing. Past page 270 today.
Added a Cover Image to my Amazon Studios Project to make it more visible.
It's a very simple thing using a Public Domain image of the Andromeda Galaxy, a Creative Commons Star Trek font and a quote,
"Enlisted Men are stupid...
But extremely cunning and sly...
They bear considerable watching..."
-Origin Uncertain, but still true in the 24th Century
Note: at the time of this writing, my project is ranked 42/639. Hazzah...
Brings to mind another classic bit...
"General Von Manstein of the German Officer Corps, said that there are only four types of officer. First there the lazy, stupid ones. Leave them alone , they do no harm. Second, there are the hard working intelligent ones. They make excellent staff officers, ensuring that every detail is properly considered. Third, there are the hard working stupid ones. These people are a menace and must be fired at once. They create irrelevant work for everybody. Finally, there are the intelligent lazy ones. They are suited for the highest office."
My project is all about, "Serious Characters in awkward situations" with the awkward situations being the whole of Science Fiction as a genre.
also, im not sure if this has been brought up or not, but what do yall think of books written in 3rd person, past tense? thats how i started this book and its flowing pretty good, but most of the books ive read recently are in first person, present tense...
I've not read those, but I'll have to put them on my list.
I've not read those, but I'll have to put them on my list. Present tense is often used as a Tension Generating or Look I'm Artsy gimmick, and it takes some good writing to convince me to overlook my prejudice against the tense.
On my own stuff, I'm up to 46K. And a good bit of that will get filled out later when I go through and take the "I told him make me sammich!" scenes and replace them with full conversations.
i appreciate the thoughts. im feeling pretty good about the third person narrative so far. i do have another question. when you do lengthy dialouge coming from a character when they tell a story, how do you use the quotation marks for the paragraph breaks? for example my character tells a story that requires about 5 paragraphs and there are some quotes inside that story, so do I throw the quotes at the beginning of the story and the end of it like a term paper where i steal info off google or do i put quotations for each paragraph? i hope this is an easy question to understand...
The standard I was taught at school, fwiw, is to put a quotation mark at the start of each paragraph of dialogue, but at the end of the last one only.This is what I've seen in several books that have long narrative dialogue. The one that comes to mind most readily is Blackwood Farm by Anne Rice, which is pretty much almost all one character telling a story.
So can anyone tell me how they plan to celebrate when they finally finish their next book? Fireworks? Champagne? A nice nap? ;D
Made it to 168k today. Working on the climax of the novel, at least for one character. Wish I had more time in the average week to work on it, but you know how that goes.
So can anyone tell me how they plan to celebrate when they finally finish their next book? Fireworks? Champagne? A nice nap? ;D
On my own front, revisiting a project I had shelved a while ago. Going back to school this coming week, I still want to write everyday.
Current writing problems I need to solve:
1. How to write a "First Book" without falling into the traps that lead to readers telling their friends, "You have to slog through the first book" because I hate when I hear that and when I have to tell people that. The only solution I can think of is, "Don't save the dinosaur riding for book 7. Give to me in Book 1!"
2. Avoiding #1 while the only plot that makes sense for the beginning of the epic narrative is, "The Main Character stumbles around for a while and has to learn the tools...blah blah blah...because heroes can never find their own A** with both hands and a map at the beginning of their journey." I wish I were a fan of the gritty fantasy like Joe Ambercrombie and George Martin that throws that kind of narrative out the window...but I'm not. >_<
3. Whether or not to roll with the idea of Obi-Wan Kenobi as my main character instead of Luke Skywalker(Metaphorically speaking). It fits and I find great humor & drama in the moment of "These are the kids I have to train to opposed the Empire and take the Death Star? We are so f****ed..."
14.5k
into Book 3: Admiral In Spite of Himself
The Deposed King
I had a similar problem when I started the outline for my first book that I am working on. Started a plot arc and was halfway through charting the arc when I blinked and said, "Dammit . . . this is the plot for X-Men." Tore the paper off the tablet, wadded it up, threw it in the trash can.
Tried it again. Started writing another plot arc and realized it was "Excalibur" or "Star Wars." Tore the paper off the tablet, wadded it up, threw it in the trash can.
It's hard coming up with something totally original. The reasons why the "ugly duckling" story works so often is because people like to think that through a little hard work and challenges through adversity they will come through the process changed for the better.
The only thing I can recommend is plotting out several arcs. Then, later on, you can decide which is the main plot arc and which ones are the sub-plots. Same thing with your characters. Figure out who they are, write down all the characteristics, traits, etc. And then figure out how they will develop during your story. And during that exercise maybe you come up with something different and original.
Me personally? Something like that I would celebrate by getting some luxury food like Pagliacci's Pizza(I live in Seattle) or a nice Porterhouse Steak from the local Butcher.
Personally I don't worry too much about totally new and original. If you're having trouble my advice? Make your plot some strange compilation between Excalibur/Starwars/X-Men.
23k
ssss-push it... push it real good!
You, sir, are making me feel tired just reading along.
Made it to 170k today. Slow, plodding progress. Still working on the climax, and realized I need to explain a little more about "how things work" to the reader in a prior scene in order to get the climax to work. May need to add another scene earlier in the book to prevent the horrible "mind dump" of explaining things all at once.
I think that is one of the greatest challenges in world building. How do you do it without creating a rant of 50 pages like John Galt's scene at the end of "Atlas Shrugged"?
I hope its from my word count and not my snappy little asides as I update you guys ;D
As it is I'm only really able to put out 5k on one of my two free days off work. And 1k is about what I can manage after work, although sometimes I get on a roll and go as high as 2.5k. Frankly I'm insanely jealous of Chris Nuttal, 9k a day as your daily target???? Jeeze luise, and I thought 5k was toppers! I'm feeling totally inadequate over here.
Sorry i didn't notice this until today; I meant the first, not the second, and I hope it did not read at all unfriendly.
I am totally happy on days when I get 2kwords, and very happy with days when I get 4k. (And _so_ looking forward to a point when I am writing anew again, i miss that.)
My personal record is 14.5k in 24 hours a few years back, and 45kwords in eight or nine days when I was between jobs two years ago (which was the second half of a novel.)
Sounds like you can get it cooking when you're on! Hope you get back to it soon!
because these books are reminding me of how effective a digressive prose style can be if done well, and they were pretty successful commercially too.
in an era that brought us, oh, Clan of the Cave Bear
God. Now I want to watch the Breakfast Club.
That would be why I specified "done well".
Now there's an example of something I admire a lot without finding sympathetic. (Pretty much everyone I am close to, regardless of gender, identifies with the Anthony Michael Head character, and being the nerd who doesn't get paired up at the end is a bit of a downer.)
You don't think his being paired up at the end would smack too much of Paulo Coelho-type determinate optimism? Granted, the 80s weren't self-critical enough for this to occur to the character in-story.
I don't honestly know. I'm not in the best of positions to assess potential sample bias in the sample of people I know well who were nerdy in high school and have positive sex lives since, what with being part of said sex lives in a probably statistically relevant fraction thereof.
134k
The Deposed King
tap, tap, tap....yup.
8 hrs in a train!!
Where are you headed PG?
Geez! You're hammering that thing out!
Oops. I meant 34k
sorry.
The Deposed King
She has surpassed even the Milla in awesomeness.
How dare you. That is not possible. Bite your tongue, fool. :P
Your insolence is forgiven.
Once.
(http://media.screened.com/uploads/0/3924/552986-lgp8.jpg)
Only managed to do 4 scene settings today, unfortunately they put two of my characters way beyond where I wanted them to be in general ability to cope.
Won't be writing much for the next week - sheared thumb tendon.
Broke 60K last night. Lots of 500 to 1000 word nights, but I need a few of those days where I can just sit back and spend the day knocking out 3 or 4k in a session. I know it all adds up, but those are the days where I can honestly feel like I really accomplished something.
Broke 60K last night. Lots of 500 to 1000 word nights, but I need a few of those days where I can just sit back and spend the day knocking out 3 or 4k in a session. I know it all adds up, but those are the days where I can honestly feel like I really accomplished something.
first day of NaNoWriMo, i figured id try it this year, i wrote 3496 words. i may write some more later tonight...
*Wait. Can it be blanced and healthy if I'm referring to myself as two entities?
The line between genius and insanity is both thin and largely irrelevant. Just enjoy it ;)
"...and I snorted it sometime in 1967."Bwahahaha!
I was informed by one of my betas that they were still upset over a character death a full day after reading that section.
It appears I'm doing something right...
Do you need anymore Betas Payne? I'd be happy to help if you do, if not then no biggie 8)
"...and I snorted it sometime in 1967."you make me feel very young when you say stuff like that :(
you make me feel very young when you say stuff like that :(
that makes you... 39?
DING...SMACK...YEOUCH!!its just simple mental math matics snow
You have just been hit by the age Fairy, Neuro.
Welcome to maturity. ::) ::)
Kids have a way of doing that without even trying.
Yeah, mums are like that.i wish she would just back up a bit and give me some space my grades are pass able and i have a hand up over most in my year
They have our best interests at heart but sometimes you'd like them
to be a little less intense about it.
would be nice if mum was not pressing me about my avrage grades i get Cs I am not the worlds smartest person considering the surcemstances i am happy with Cs but no thats not good enough :(
o_O - it's the difference between book smarts and street smarts.
Book smarts will help you get a good grade - street smarts will enable you to
walk into a local laundromat and be able to use it.
no A= I am a total juerk and show off myfravret thing to do is make people feel bad about them selves as i am perfect and they are not, i proberly have OCD and I like being an emoshanal vampire
You know, as a person who got a fair few As in my time, has been struggling with OCD much of my adult life, and have done my best to help people whose grades were not so good, I could find that a little hurtful; I am sorry that you've met people who got As who were jerks and show-offs, but that certainly wasn't my objective or motivation in the scene.sprry neuro i am steriotyping :( all the people i have met who get As normally fit this description :(
sprry neuro i am steriotyping :( all the people i have met who get As normally fit this description :(
A brutal truth: You probably have to sit down and make yourself knock out a few hundred words. I've found that to be the only thing that worked when I had a period of time when I "didn't feel inspired"
Can't get around dry spells, you have to go and just drive through them.
Having multiple projects going has worked for me as a way around that, fwiw. Haven't yet been blocked on everything at once.
I'm always a little wary of "push through"-type advice because I've seen successful published writers irrevocably screw up WiPs and be unable to finish them because of trying to push through something that needed to be mulled on more first.
Just finished the NaNo 50,000 words. Actual wordcount is now at 56,667.
This is the end tome of your space-opera trilogy?
Gave up on my main work to Nano. Actually won this year.
Well done to anyone with staying power on their work.
You have my awe.
(One of the things I hope to get done next year is finally do the last polishing edits on a project I started in 1996. You can call that staying power if you like, but it feels more like procrastination to me.)
Hey! Good seeing you around again!Thank you! It is good to be back.
3600 words last night, another chapter done. Just a hair short of 50kwords.*dreams of having that much time on her hands*
The book I started for the NaNoWriMo events is now over 68,000 words. Let's see if I can hit 75,000 words before Christmas....how? how how how how ??? :o ??? :o ??? :o :o ??? :'(
Craig
Kind of the opposite here: last night I somehow managed to delete the entire draft of my novel! :o
Thankfully, I had an earlier draft saved, so it isn't a total disaster, but I do have to re-write a couple of scenes from memory. Oh, well...
Ouch! :o As I was once told. Have at least 3 backups and at least one of them off site.I have one copy on my laptop, one on my pc, one in a flash drive, and one hard copy.
Ouch! :o As I was once told. Have at least 3 backups and at least one of them off site.
I'd been planning to go out today and write tomorrow, but as we are in the middle of having half a metre of snow and 50km/h winds, it looks like those plans will be swapped around.
Doesn't mean that you can't use something from it in the future.Yea, verily yea.
CWG, please stop putting yourself down. It isn't good for you.
I don't hate you... you just really annoy me... I am stuck with not having time to write
above comment made me cry :'(
Up to 222,000 words tonight. Curious as to the thought of the philosophical discussions in sci-fi/fantasy, or even discussions about politics. I suppose they can be used to flesh out your characters and make them more real, but I worry about venturing too far into "Atlas Shrugged" territory. Sounds like it would be hard to pull off without losing readers.
If it's in character for your characters, go for it. Trying to write without any philosophical position at all leads to bland books with no content, which also loses readers; one doesn't have to agree with a book's position, let alone that of characters in a book (which need not be the same thing at all) to enjoy it.
Got to disagree there. It's assuming that everyone's looking for socio-political enlearnment or somesuch, where many people are simply interested in a good story, engaging characters, etc.
And to be honest, people looking for socio-political fan service will invariably find it, even if the "message" they perceive is merely a product of their own baggage.
People looking for validation of their worldview will find it, just as people looking for something to take offense to will create a "message" sufficient to serve their need for outrage.
One could write an epic space opera in which all of the characters are magic space pandas,
And honestly, the socio-political themes will write themselves, so to speak, in a way entirely dependant on what the reader's looking for that day.
I think, from discussions you and I have had in the past, that you and I are seeing this on a somewhat different scale.
I'm not suggesting every book has to be Atlas Shrugged to be political. I am saying it's pretty much impossible to tell a story with meaningful conflict without that having some political position implicit, that is not entirely in the head of any given reader. The Dresden Files avoiding taking a specific position related to contemporary US politics does not make them apolitical, because Harry's strongly held personal moral beliefs, and the occasional thing Jim has said about his philosophy going into the books (such as free will being a good thing) are to my mind strongly political aspects.
To my mind it seems unambitious, to shrug one's shoulders and give up on the possibility of consciously doing something with those reactions, though. Given that the range of human reactions is such that one absolutely cannot please every possible reader, it seems worth thinking in terms of which readers one most cares about pleasing; for myself, as reader and writer both, the more ambitious something is, the more I will admire it (if not necessarily like it), and socio-political relevance would be a pretty large swathe of human nature and endeavour to decide not to try engaging with.
It would need to be some pretty serious magic to provide a solid world-building back-up for how one gets an interstellar civilisation from pandas; their food requirements, environment, and habits are none of them particularly credible as liable to lead to a technological civilisation. I'll stick with my Alien Space Bats and Flying Squid from Space for the moment.
Believing that entirely beyond my control would be extremely depressing.
If we micro-parse any conflict, it can eventually be considered "political."
Unambitious to not try to engage with this or that faction? Personally, I'm interested in telling a story, building a world, and developing characters which will be engaging to people of opposing sociopolitical viewpoints, and to do so without relying on sociopolitical issues.
They're too often merely a marketing crutch, a cheap marketing checklist.
So I want to create an engaging story without pandering to any faction, without relying on being just another source of external validation for their views.
It's easy to entertain someone you agree with, I want to entertain both people I agree, and disagree with.
And at the end of the day? Neither communityis entirely right or wrong, with good and noble people on both sides, as well as both sides having a few terrifying fiends.
Take 1984. Long held up as a cautionary tale denouncing socilism, communism, marxism, and likely a good number of other isms... but George Orwell was in actuality a devout socialist/anarchist who was attacking totolitarianism.
That's if you don't know about Proto-Bamboo which not only nourishes them, but gives them the Mind Power to fend off the Nether-Koalas and their Anti-Eucolpytus Space Drives.
I always thought Monty Python was brilliant for using the killer rabbit in "The Holy Grail." Pandas, sloths, banana slugs, whatever. All good.
I like some of the stories where the good guys wear white, but not so much as those with varying shades of gray.
If anything, the theme would be that too much of any one thing can be dangerous, even organized labor when it results in hegemony.
Oh, agreed entirely. Though people are really awfully willing to trust that a first-person protagonist is meant to be sympathetic, pretty much no matter how grey you make them.Im curious how you could make a first person protagonist completely unsympathetic. Isnt that sort of the key to drawing readers in? Im not saying that one couldnt be about as Black as they come, but to be devoid of anything the reader could identify with seems like it would make it especially difficult to draw the in, especially in a first person perspective.
Im curious how you could make a first person protagonist completely unsympathetic. Isnt that sort of the key to drawing readers in?
"Interesting" is not the same thing as "sympathetic" is not the same thing as "can identify with".OK, I can see what you are saying; I was thinking of Protagonist in the classic use of the term, where it is specifically the character the audience is supposed to identify with most, as opposed to simply the Focal Character. The closest thing I have read to those is one of the Dexter novels, and while that guy is a clear anti-hero and psychopath, he does have a few redeeming qualities.
The examples I am thinking of, here, are first-person psychopaths/serial killers. I hope not everybody who read American Psycho was finding Patrick Bateman sympathetic, at any rate. My personal favourite first-person-deranged is Iain Banks' The Wasp Factory, which I must have read half a dozen times in twenty years, and I'd certainly not call Frank Cauldhame sympathetic - brilliantly fascinating, but not a person I'd wish to identify with at all. (What Banks does with the serial-killer POV second-person bits in Complicity is even nastier for getting under one's skin, but that's kind of stunt writing, not really a technique with much use outside that precise context.)
Agreed entirely. Everything is political, even the personal. I'm not seeing any way for it not to be - outside of writing SF about a species for which the whole notion of factionalism doesn't parse, I have one of those pencilled in for a small role later on. Humans scare them.
I am finding it as hard to imagine a story that does not somewhere, at some level, connect to some sociopolitical issues, as one about human beings that doesn't have, say, emotions in it.
Possibly you're looking at a very different section of the genre from what I read, then, because I can think of very few things I've read in the past several years that struck me that way. (R.M. Meluch's Tour of the Merrimack books, maybe; or at least, for something supposedly set that far in the future, it breaks my suspension of disbelief that there will be a US so much like the contemporary US and issues so much like contemporary issues - if it doesn't match fifty or a hundred years ago I do not believe it will match four hundred years' time.)
Right with you on that one. I would be surprised, and probably more disquieted than pleased, to find there was any faction out there that actually shared the views that my central characters hold and that I am interested in exploring. (Which do not overlap entirely with my own views at all.)
I'm not seeing where "agree with" has any relevance here, though. I mean, in the recent past, I've been rereading Daniel Keys Moran's Tales of the Continuing Time, which are books where I disagree philosophically, politically, and largely aesthetically with pretty much every character who is intended to be sympathetic, and find the antagonists much more to my taste, and I enjoy them immensely; and at the same time have read and been a bit bemused by some Christopher Brookmyre satirical mysteries, in which I agree almost entirely with his supposedly sympathetic characters and the overall effect waves back and forth between somewhat guilty pleasure and "dude, you're waving your id around in public and it;'s enough like mine that you;re making me wince from embarrassment."
One of the things I admire about Heinlein is his ability to convincingly get into and really explore the old-style conservatism of Starship Troopers, the right-libertarianism of Moon is a Harsh Mistress, and the hippie groovitude of Stranger in a Strange Land - I don't think there's any plausible way of deriving Heinlein's actual beliefs from those three texts alone, and the ability to that is one I admire. Not many people can do that - Ken MacLeod's Fall Revolution books are the only recent example I can think of on a similar scale - but it's definitely a thing I aspire to.
I'm not seeing how "both sides of this conflict have good people and both have fiends" isn't itself a political position on the conflict in question.
Indeed, and he also thought the book was a comedy, in the Swiftian satire direction. Lots of people seem not to get that.
Your caps remind me of Flash Gordon. I've nothing against the existence of good stories that people enjoy that hang together at a Flash Gordon level of realism; as a reader they're for the most part not my thing, and as a writer, I'm a mildly obsessive-compulsive professional molecular biologist; for me personally, making it work only at the Flash Gordon level isn't enough, and I see no reason why I can't make a story be exciting and have the virtues of a Flash Gordon story, while also having aliens whose entire evolutionary history makes plausible, rational sense if you care to poke at it.
OK, I can see what you are saying; I was thinking of Protagonist in the classic use of the term, where it is specifically the character the audience is supposed to identify with most, as opposed to simply the Focal Character.
The closest thing I have read to those is one of the Dexter novels, and while that guy is a clear anti-hero and psychopath, he does have a few redeeming qualities.
This would be where the microparsing comes in. If there is a "theme", it would be regarding things like personal and familial loyalty, the difference between a "community" and "a bunch of people living in the same place." Looking at the long-term (over decades and centuries) good versus the immediate goals of this or that ambitious person or group, and finally perhaps the potential value of both inter- and intra-community cooperation...
What would be accurate will be the rare bird who says "Oh, this bit reminds me of the Second Boer War, but that other bit's kind of like the Medici's, and hey, this guy's read his Thucydides..."
Well, my story's set on a colony world left isolated for a thousand or so years, following a huge interstellar war which shattered various empires and polities. Which itself came a couple thousand years after "The Fall of Terra." So any current socio-political events, nationality or ethnic issues, etc are pretty much irrelevant in there setting.
The fun thing is that I didn't create that setting with the intention of avoiding current political events. The story concept, main character & her community came first, and the period of time between then and now kept growing as I created the history necessary to put her where she is. A lot of "No, it would take at least this long for the planets's albedo to return to normal, that long for pioneering species to take root in this area again..."
I'm just waiting for someone to say "Well, that dialogue isn't appropriate or accurate, a Person of Color, particularly a female, wouldn't speak that way..." As if in 4,000 plus years, after the rise and fall of a planetary, then interstellar, then another interstellar civilization, people will even be speaking "English," much less worried about anything beyond whether or not the hydroponics are going to fail and leave them hungry before spring.
Oh, the Space Pandas are just there to provide an example of how some people will try to read socio-political statements into a soup label or the tag on a mattress. Or attempt to school the author of even such a silly space opera in their "responsibility" to address current social issues.
My actual story has fairly hard science, at least on the ground. The space-opera exceptions being limited to B-5 style hyperspace travel, the existence of "artificial gravity" (or call it "Mass Field Enhancement or some-such if you want to be picky"), and the means of keeping your crew from turning to paste on the bulkhead during maneuvers.
Plus, I have a species with lifespans in the thousands of years and non-hemoglobin based blood. Which I suppose might be feasible, but until I can find some more speculative science regarding that bit of speculative biology, I'm calling it "space opera.")
and a bit of business that's currently in the start of #3 moved back to #1 for character purposes.
Interesting.
The implications of working with someone who was a war hero a long time ago and has been using his reputation to keep himself in the field long after he should sensibly have moved to a staff job, in ways which are a pain in the behind to people with him, recomplicate interestingly when there is the setting's equivalent of a huge blockbuster movie about the character in question; lots of people know his name, and even more people have heard of him but think of the actor from the movie instead.
Now combine that with a context where moderately famous actors often licence their image for androids, and where some security forces are very keen to use known images that people will have positive associations with. (Imagine if two-thirds of the security guards in your local mall were Bruce Willis.)
Ah so. I have a " Vulcans making a movie about Kirk just as he's about to find out about Khan" image here.
So I think I found out a way around the block that's been holding me up for months.... [[[[[super!]]]]]] well the block plus procrastination. But I'm in the process of changing my story from Third Person limited to First person. [[[[ARGH the agony... Been there, done that. So frustrating. Story is written but you have do the whole damn thing over again.... My sympathies.}}}}} Once I eliminated the non-main chapters and changed a few things around it is starting to fall into place. Although at 14000 words it's still daunting to go through and change. I'm about a third of the way through... but it should make writing the rest of the story much easier. I hope. [[[Just celebrate that the work wasn't finished when you decided to switch POV. hang in there!]
I have a cold..... :'(
Between the cough, the running nose, and the out of it feeling, I can't think enough to do any writing.... :-[ :(
Craig
Shades my weird dreams normally involve ether buildings exploding or kissing :P
Buildings kissing - sounds like a job for Kafka. ??? ???
One more through pass on new 1 and 2 and first whack on moving old 6 to new 3, which is not working yet, but workable.
poor neuroFear not, you are 20 words ahead of me. And to top it off the voltage multiplier I built last night instead of writing is defying physics and my Will by not working!
20 words :-\
Fear not, you are 20 words ahead of me. And to top it off the voltage multiplier I built last night instead of writing is defying physics and my Will by not working!
The universe is trying to tell you something...