The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers

What about Etri? 12 Months

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Tinfoil hat:

--- Quote from: Mira on February 02, 2026, 02:43:04 PM ---There is a problem with that though, and it's an inconsistency in the series.  Remember back in Blood Rites when Eb said he tried to kill Lord Raith and couldn't?  This was Blackstaff talking right?  Margaret was able to block Raith's feeding with her death curse, but she couldn't kill him with it.  Harry sensed the cold emptiness inside Lord Raith, he wanted very badly to kill him, but didn't try it because of what Eb had told him.. Fast forward to 12 Months and Eb tells Harry in effect that he chose not to kill Lord Raith? The point I am making is if the general knowlege was that Lord Raith couldn't be killed, that wouldn't satisfy Etri.  Plus, even at this point, though most know better, Lara is still the power behind the throne not the head of the White Court, and if Lord Raith was handed over, that would blow the court up politically and destabilize things more.

He did try, but his options were limited, his political power is limited, or was.   He did come up with a solution, getting that boon from Mab.

I doubt that, she had negotiated it with Etri ahead of time.  Because if it was last minute as you say, there was no gararantee that Etri would have accepted those terms.  She didn't set the price, Etri did.

I am not sure of what you are trying to say here.  1] Would the child even have been born? Did the Outsider want it to be born?  Remember the mid-wife in this case was actually Mother Summer, was that necessary?  If it was a normal birth, there were several people on sight that could have assisted.  The fact that Justine was still possessed by the Outsider meant that it took someone like Mother Summer to assist and keep the child safe during the birthing process.2] Yes, if there was no negotiated  settlement, Thomas surely would have been killed. 3] Why would Harry and Lara fight over the baby?  They are still on track to marry if Mab gets her way, and she usually does, they would just be foster parents.. 

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Personally I don't think the baby could have been born any other way. You don't ask Mother Summer to be a mid wife if it's possible any other way. Either the Nemesis would have possessed the baby to use as an escape route or as a vector for possessing others.
2) the solution to Etri's demands
Finally hours of obsessing over a song of ice and fire, and history finally pay of.

Mab properly didn't discuss it with Etri beforehand but Etri conditions were clear a life for a life. Either Thomas or someone of his blood. The baby is of his blood. Giving your child as hostage or a price to your foes to ensure peace or as a weregild was not uncommon in past across multiple cultures.  Hell marrying Margie to Etri's son was not out of the question. Mab implies it although Harry sees it as a threat against Margie's life but I think this was what she was trying to get across. In the most Mab way possible.
Also Etri didn't have a choice in this situation. Someone had to be punished for the attempt on his life. Doing nothing makes him appear weak to both his allies and enemies. Even knowing about nemesis does not excuse Thomas. Thomas was not possessed he was forced to do it sure but he still did it of his own will even if under duress. He had to be punished and publicly at that. Etri taking his son is that. Then to show what a kind, noble , honourable and wise ruler he is to his people and other the baby has to be treated well to show that he is not driven by revenge and he can be a good Ally. Think Theon in asoiaf

Bad Alias:

--- Quote from: Mira on February 02, 2026, 02:43:04 PM ---There is a problem with that though, and it's an inconsistency in the series.  Remember back in Blood Rites when Eb said he tried to kill Lord Raith and couldn't?  This was Blackstaff talking right?  Margaret was able to block Raith's feeding with her death curse, but she couldn't kill him with it.  Harry sensed the cold emptiness inside Lord Raith, he wanted very badly to kill him, but didn't try it because of what Eb had told him.. Fast forward to 12 Months and Eb tells Harry in effect that he chose not to kill Lord Raith? The point I am making is if the general knowlege was that Lord Raith couldn't be killed, that wouldn't satisfy Etri.

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It was only magic that couldn't kill him.


--- Quote from: Mira on February 02, 2026, 02:43:04 PM ---Plus, even at this point, though most know better, Lara is still the power behind the throne not the head of the White Court, and if Lord Raith was handed over, that would blow the court up politically and destabilize things more.

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That's why Lara would probably have rejected it, but Harry never even considered it.


--- Quote from: Mira on February 02, 2026, 02:43:04 PM ---I doubt that, she had negotiated it with Etri ahead of time.  Because if it was last minute as you say, there was no gararantee that Etri would have accepted those terms.  She didn't set the price, Etri did.

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I mean Harry didn't realize the price until after the delivery and Mab set the price for her help to Harry. It doesn't really matter if she negotiated it with Etri before hand or just new he would accept as Tinfoil hat says.


--- Quote ---My stomach sank. Because I realized what was coming. What had to come next. What I had asked for.
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--- Quote from: Mira on February 02, 2026, 02:43:04 PM ---I am not sure of what you are trying to say here.  1] Would the child even have been born? Did the Outsider want it to be born?  Remember the mid-wife in this case was actually Mother Summer, was that necessary?  If it was a normal birth, there were several people on sight that could have assisted.  The fact that Justine was still possessed by the Outsider meant that it took someone like Mother Summer to assist and keep the child safe during the birthing process.2] Yes, if there was no negotiated  settlement, Thomas surely would have been killed. 3] Why would Harry and Lara fight over the baby?  They are still on track to marry if Mab gets her way, and she usually does, they would just be foster parents.. 

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Assuming everything happened as it did except trading the baby away, Thomas lives, Justine is captured, the baby is delivered safely, Mab does the torture/memory wipe on Justine. Neither Thomas nor Justine would be able to raise the baby.

At this point, Harry and Lara have an equal claim on the baby. They are not going to agree on how to raise him. Happily married biological parents often argue over how to raise their kids. I don't see how Harry and Lara would agree on much besides maybe sending him to St. Mark's.

Harry and Lara are going to keep separate households. How else is Harry going to keep Maggie away from the White Court?

Mira:

--- Quote ---Assuming everything happened as it did except trading the baby away, Thomas lives, Justine is captured, the baby is delivered safely, Mab does the torture/memory wipe on Justine. Neither Thomas nor Justine would be able to raise the baby.

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You are leaving out an important part here, this is how Mab cured Lea when she was possessed.  Maeve was too far gone and Mab had to have her killed.  Mab admitted that she doesn't know if this method or attempt will cure Justine.  At least Mab is giving it a shot, more than Justine would have had otherwise.  Do you know of any other ways to removed an Outsider soldier from a possessed mortal?

--- Quote ---I mean Harry didn't realize the price until after the delivery and Mab set the price for her help to Harry. It doesn't really matter if she negotiated it with Etri before hand or just new he would accept as Tinfoil hat says.

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Oh Harry knew there would be a price, what he wanted most of all was for his brother to live.  Mab told him upfront that she might be able to do that, but there would be a cost.  Namely because Thomas did commit murder.  Harry understood and said the word the third time to seal the bond for the boone he was asking Mab.


--- Quote ---That's why Lara would probably have rejected it, but Harry never even considered it.

--- End quote ---

Oh I think he did, but because of the polictical undercurrents he couldn't consider it.

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