The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers

RNT Episode 6: What Changes (Mentally) When a Person Goes Full Red Court?

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Talby16:
Loving this lively discussion. I would like to toss another factoid out there for discussion. In Changes Chapter 38 (pg 399 of the paperback)it says

--- Quote ---"Poo," Lea said. "Arianna still hates the Europeans with a vengeance, you know. It was why she took a conquistador husband."
I blinked. "Ortega?"
"Of course, child," Lea said. "Love and hate are oft difficult to distinguish between. She won Ortega's heart, changed him, wed him, and spent the centuries after breaking his heart over and over again. Calling for him and then sending him away. Giving in to him and then reversing her course. She said it kept her hatred fresh and hot."

--- End quote ---

From this we can determine that Arianna kept her hatred of the humans from her mortal self into her vampire self. Acting on that hatred she pursued Ortega because he was a conquistador and thus representative of her hatred. Essentially, in my opinion, she took actions as a vampire based upon her human experiences/emotions. Food for thought.

Mira:

--- Quote from: Talby16 on May 01, 2025, 01:39:36 AM ---Loving this lively discussion. I would like to toss another factoid out there for discussion. In Changes Chapter 38 (pg 399 of the paperback)it says
From this we can determine that Arianna kept her hatred of the humans from her mortal self into her vampire self. Acting on that hatred she pursued Ortega because he was a conquistador and thus representative of her hatred. Essentially, in my opinion, she took actions as a vampire based upon her human experiences/emotions. Food for thought.

--- End quote ---

So you are saying when Arianna was human she hated all her fellow humans?  Or she hated humanity as a human, and as a full vampire, who don't like humans anyway except as food proves she kept some of her human emotions?  Or is it a coincidence?  Like the rooster crowing at sun rise has nothing to do with the sun rising..

Talby16:

--- Quote from: Mira on May 01, 2025, 01:45:31 AM ---So you are saying when Arianna was human she hated all her fellow humans?  Or she hated humanity as a human, and as a full vampire, who don't like humans anyway except as food proves she kept some of her human emotions?  Or is it a coincidence?  Like the rooster crowing at sun rise has nothing to do with the sun rising..

--- End quote ---
I am asserting that as it says in the quote from the book, Arianna hated Europeans. Specifically conquistadors due to their actions in South America. Not quite all humans, just a subsection. Due to her hatred she sought out a conquistador to turn and marry so she could torment him for all eternity.

Mira:

--- Quote from: Talby16 on May 01, 2025, 01:49:53 AM ---I am asserting that as it says in the quote from the book, Arianna hated Europeans. Specifically conquistadors due to their actions in South America. Not quite all humans, just a subsection. Due to her hatred she sought out a conquistador to turn and marry so she could torment him for all eternity.

--- End quote ---

Perhaps, but it still doesn't prove that it was a particular human trait left over from when she was human..  Also unknown, was she half turned when she decided this?  That isn't clear, if it happened before she was fully turned, she was still human.

Talby16:

--- Quote from: Mira on May 01, 2025, 12:52:37 PM ---Perhaps, but it still doesn't prove that it was a particular human trait left over from when she was human..  Also unknown, was she half turned when she decided this?  That isn't clear, if it happened before she was fully turned, she was still human.

--- End quote ---

That is definitely a valid question. We do not know what the Red Court Traditions are for turning a family member. Can they turn a child and have the vampire grow? We know that someone can be a half vampire and then make that choice to sate their thirst turning fully (ex Susan). We know that there are others who serve as half vampire agents and then are granted permission to turn and thus status in the Red COurt (ex Martin). Would Arianna the daughter of the Red King have spent time as a half vampire or would she have been able to turn full vampire in one night? It is conceivable that she spent plenty of time as a half vampire living through the conquistador time enough to build up a hatred or she might have already been turned fully. Inquiring minds want to know Mr. Butcher!

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