The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
Q&A Fantasyfestival 2023 in Esbjerg/Denmark
magnuskn:
--- Quote from: g33k on September 26, 2023, 01:06:27 PM ---Harry got imprinted with the shadow of a Fallen Angel, spent years with her inside his skull.
He died -- dead enough to ghost-around for days -- and came back to life.
He's saddled with the personality-warping influences of a Winter Mantle.
And yet, you say, Harry's still Harry at his core.
But you seem adamant that Murphy cannot still be Murphy...?
I don't see anything to prevent her from still being herself (given the precedents that Jim has written)... except that you don't want her to be.
--- End quote ---
Yeah, I don't see either why she suddenly would stop being Murphy, only because her circumstances have changed. A person is defined by her outlook on life, how she treats with others, how she feels about herself. While some of those facets would of course be altered by dying and being brought back (Harry sure did have to adjust), at her core Murphy would still be herself.
Mira:
--- Quote ---But you seem adamant that Murphy cannot still be Murphy...?
I don't see anything to prevent her from still being herself (given the precedents that Jim has written)... except that you don't want her to be.
--- End quote ---
No, I'm arguing that there is a good chance she won't be.. I am also questioning what do her fans want her to be? What was it they loved about her before and what if that aspect of her changes will they still be happy? There are different forces playing with her this time.. Also as far as her "core" goes, Nic called that one into question when he tricked her into breaking a Holy Sword. Yes, I know it all worked out, but.... I always thought at her core, Murphy was a police officer, their job is to arrest the bad guys, but it is up to a judge and jury to judge, convict, and to punish.. The Holy Swords work the same way, she even said she couldn't be a Knight because she couldn't not judge the Denarians.. Very honest and Murphy, but then when she thinks Harry is in danger, she whips out the Sword, which apparently she had anticipated,so doing something she said she wouldn't do, put the Sword in danger because of her beliefs and why she said Harry couldn't be trusted to be their custodian.. Then when she has Nic on the ropes seemingly, instead of calling his bluff and accepting his surrender, the noose, and the coin, she plays judge as he anticipated, and breaks the Sword and gets her butt totally kicked.. So what messed with her core here? Love for Harry, yeah, a good thing, but it proves that her core values can be shattered.
That little bit of backsliding that could have ended in disaster, [yeah, I know it didn't] has never been discussed between Harry and Murphy. He discussed it somewhat with Michael, but not Murphy. Does she feel any guilt over her major screw up? Question any of her actions? Or because it turned out okay in the end with Butters getting a Holy Light Saber she can rationalize it away? Because what she did, she did out of love, well sort of, until she played judge and jury to execute Nic. Which also failed I might add. I think that would be interesting, mainly because she often plays the wise one in any talk her and Harry have...
Mira:
--- Quote ---Harry got imprinted with the shadow of a Fallen Angel, spent years with her inside his skull.
He died -- dead enough to ghost-around for days -- and came back to life.
He's saddled with the personality-warping influences of a Winter Mantle.
--- End quote ---
Yes, well, he was mostly dead... He managed to fight both with his stronger than average will.
--- Quote ---And yet, you say, Harry's still Harry at his core.
--- End quote ---
Yup, why you ask? Because he is a star born, he is also a wizard, he isn't an ordinary vanilla human.. At his core he is a star born powerful wizard, now events might outwardly change him, but at his core, what doesn't change is he is a star born powerful wizard.. That gives him a stronger than average will, which so far has kept most of his values in tact.. Recognized by Heaven apparently because he was gifted with Soul Fire.
--- Quote ---But you seem adamant that Murphy cannot still be Murphy...?
I don't see anything to prevent her from still being herself (given the precedents that Jim has written)... except that you don't want her to be.
--- End quote ---
Really? She was an ordinary vanilla human at her core, love, hate, the whole nine yards.. She has been stupidly murdered, she was then selected to be a member of the Valhalla club to fight for Odin in the final battle.. What is her emotional make up these days? So the Einherjar, the plural of Einheri, literally 'army of one', so they're the most fearsome and brutal of warriors according to Google. So do Einherjar even have an emotional core? You honestly believe that Murphy won't change?
As the old proverb goes, "be careful for what you wish for, you may get it..." That goes for Harry as well, he may wish her back, be glad at first to see Murphy come back, but in the end wish that she had been allowed to rest in peace.
g33k:
--- Quote from: Mira on September 26, 2023, 03:01:07 PM --- ... Also as far as her "core" goes, Nic called that one into question when he tricked her into breaking a Holy Sword ...
--- End quote ---
No.
Nic tricked her into making Esperacchius vulnerable.
It was Nic who actually broke the blade.
But please note: the Leanansidhe similarly tricked Harry into making Amoracchius vulnerable; this was every bit as much a violation of Harry's own ethics for himself, as it was for Murphy.
magnuskn:
--- Quote from: Mira on September 26, 2023, 03:22:08 PM ---As the old proverb goes, "be careful for what you wish for, you may get it..." That goes for Harry as well, he may wish her back, be glad at first to see Murphy come back, but in the end wish that she had been allowed to rest in peace.
--- End quote ---
The point here is, Murphy was able to see beyond the very suspicious behaviour Harry was exhibiting in Skin Game (which Butters couldn't, but listed out very succinctly), because she trusted that Harry was still, at his core, the same person. I can't see Harry not doing the same if Murphy comes back with some minor changes in her outlook. I'm confident that at her core, she'll still be the same person, just as Harry is still the same guy from book one where it counts.
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