The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
“You Know What He Was Meant To Be”
g33k:
--- Quote from: Conspiracy Theorist on February 26, 2023, 08:54:19 PM ---I had thought of that, Thorn Manacles or power burnout from the Darkhallow collapse would remove a mortal practioners aura, and she isn’t strictly mortal, she’s a Changeling. If she chose human perhaps, yes, Fae definitely not ...
--- End quote ---
Thorn manacles are a hard no. They are strictly temporary; there has never been any indication it could produce a "burnout" (Lash would surely have told Harry, if it were possible). Also, Sarissa had no scars from them.
I guess the Darkhallow maybe could produce burnout ... ?
The thing is: I'm not sure "burnout" is a thing that happens in the Dresdenverse. Fading happens: Charity Carpenter was a low-grade talent, presumably near-ish to the Ordo Lebes... all of whom (that he touched) tingled Harry's wizardly spidey-sense; but never Charity.
Why doesn't the WC just burn-out captured warlocks, if it was a thing (or, for that matter -- why not thorn manacles?)
Mira:
--- Quote ---Why doesn't the WC just burn-out captured warlocks, if it was a thing (or, for that matter -- why not thorn manacles?)
--- End quote ---
That is an interesting idea, but like a lot of things maybe either more complicated than just burning out a warlock... In the case of Charity, even though she was well on her way to becoming a warlock, I don't remember it being said what level her talent really was, her talent did fade.. Or it hasn't faded, but since she is in total denial of it, cannot be detected. There might be several reasons, maybe Harry's spidey sense doesn't work on her because her talent is competely dormant from total lack of use"? She was saved from that dragon by a Holy Knight whom she fell in love with, her desire to quit to win Micheal with intervention from the Almighty made it happen. I really think Charity is a unique case. In the case of your garden variety warlock, the desire to stop being one doesn't exist. They are addicted to using the black magic, Molly is a good example of this, even Harry, the temptation to back slide is very great.. And when they do backslide the consequences are usually dire. The White Council doesn't have their own Demonreach Island to rehab young warlocks, and there are so many it isn't practical to use the one that exists. Nor do they care to take the time in what most likely be a fruitless effort at rehab. If a wizard is willing, they take a shot at putting them under the Doom if rehab is deemed possible, otherwise, the chop is considered the best solution for all concerned.
Conspiracy Theorist:
--- Quote from: g33k on February 27, 2023, 06:26:56 AM ---Thorn manacles are a hard no. They are strictly temporary; there has never been any indication it could produce a "burnout" (Lash would surely have told Harry, if it were possible). Also, Sarissa had no scars from them.
I guess the Darkhallow maybe could produce burnout ... ? I suspect that Cowl was diminished for at least. Time by the Darkhallow, by the time Proven Guilty he still doesn’t display power relying on others for the assault on Arctis Tor .
The thing is: I'm not sure "burnout" is a thing that happens in the Dresdenverse. Fading happens: Charity Carpenter was a low-grade talent, presumably near-ish to the Ordo Lebes... all of whom (that he touched) tingled Harry's wizardly spidey-sense; but never Charity.
Why doesn't the WC just burn-out captured warlocks, if it was a thing (or, for that matter -- why not thorn manacles?)
--- End quote ---
I suspect a wizard trying to cross the Carpenters threshold without permission would suffer permanent burnout, and removing the power from a warlock doesn’t render them sane or harmless.
Page 139 Proven Guilty ‘Your wolf children did me a petty wrong,’ Maeve replied. ‘They killed a favorite hireling of the Winter Court.’ Maeve confirms the Tigress was a repeat contractor for the Winter Court to which Nameless was attached at the time. Lloyd Slate forced Ace to hire the Tigress to kill Harry, even though Harry was doing Mab’s bidding.
g33k:
--- Quote from: Mira on February 27, 2023, 04:36:30 PM --- ... In the case of Charity, even though she was well on her way to becoming a warlock, I don't remember it being said what level her talent really was, her talent did fade.. Or it hasn't faded, but since she is in total denial of it, cannot be detected. There might be several reasons, maybe Harry's spidey sense doesn't work on her because her talent is competely dormant from total lack of use"? She was saved from that dragon by a Holy Knight whom she fell in love with, her desire to quit to win Micheal with intervention from the Almighty made it happen. I really think Charity is a unique case...
--- End quote ---
Charity's own testimony was that her talent was minor. I think she was being honest.
The head of her coven was stronger... but not WC-caliber strong.
But we have other indicators that power fades: When Harry finally admits to Michael that he picked up Lasciel's Denarius, Michael advises him to "put aside his power," and the Shadow would fade as his power did (to which Harry replied, "fuck that." Michael winced.).
I'm pretty sure there's WoJ to this effect, too; mortal magic in the Dresdenverse is a "use it or lose it" thing (except for the "anyone can do it" rituals that have been described as "like a vending machine, put in the ritualistic coin & get out the magic spell").
g33k:
--- Quote from: Mira on February 27, 2023, 04:36:30 PM --- ... In the case of your garden variety warlock, the desire to stop being one doesn't exist. They are addicted to using the black magic, Molly is a good example of this, even Harry, the temptation to back slide is very great.. And when they do backslide the consequences are usually dire.
--- End quote ---
Agreed on all points.
--- Quote from: Mira on February 27, 2023, 04:36:30 PM --- ... The White Council doesn't have their own Demonreach Island to rehab young warlocks, and there are so many it isn't practical to use the one that exists. Nor do they care to take the time in what most likely be a fruitless effort at rehab. If a wizard is willing, they take a shot at putting them under the Doom if rehab is deemed possible, otherwise, the chop is considered the best solution for all concerned.
--- End quote ---
I think there's very little "rehab" happening on Demonreach; only for Harry, really: he can lair-up there to heal. The inmates... not so much.
Seems to me that Thorn Manacles would be a perfect solution, actually.
The warlock can do a bunch of normal-ish things in life; MUNDANE things. Every time they try something magical, they suffer intense agony. Pavlov showed the way, here (and Harry avers, "pain is an excellent teacher"). They'll learn, on a reflexive level, not to do magic. After they stop even trying, their powers will begin to fade. 10-15 years later, they should be safe to release (at least, magically safe).
They could spend that time being educated for a mundane career... college, trade school, etc. They will get out with no "criminal record" in the mortal world, so they can go get a mortal job in their career of choice.
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