The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
“You Know What He Was Meant To Be”
Conspiracy Theorist:
Martha Liberty to Eb page 51 Summer Knight I believe this is the earliest allusion to Harry being Starborn.
LTW is present so all three are aware.
Earlier in Summer Knight, Mab in her first meeting with Harry mentions that she watched Harry stalemate the Leansidhe. In Grave Peril I believe that Mab was told by The Gatekeeper of a potential divergence in futures the centre of which was Harry a Starborn. She was watching Harry, not the Leansidhe, and it was after that that she bought Harry’s mortgage, I don’t believe she had any interest in Harry until then.
g33k:
--- Quote from: Conspiracy Theorist on February 14, 2023, 12:53:14 PM ---Martha Liberty to Eb page 51 Summer Knight I believe this is the earliest allusion to Harry being Starborn ...
--- End quote ---
I don't think we know for sure what she meant.
Most-trivially, it could just have been "Justin DuMorne's pet enforcer," a bullyboy warlock. Here, I think, the part she's not saying out loud is, "all his basic training is from a black-magic practitioner, and while we didn't find any mental booby-traps we may have missed some; and because of that basic training, we cannot discount that his basic mindset may be fundamentally that of a warlock." This is the POV of those who distrust Harry & think it was wrong to levy the Doom of Damocles instead of just killing him.
I presume most of the SC understand what a "Starborn" is, and that Harry (at least potentially) is one.
I also presume that not all of them were aware of the Ariana/Pere-Raith/Margaret.LaFey "starbabe" plot; that info would have come from Eb (who they failed to enroll) and I think he'd have protected Maggie by only telling a few he trusted (not the whole SC).
My own theory is that Martha was being deliberately obfuscatory: she knew most or all of it, as did Eb, and she was reminding him; but at least one person there (besides Harry) did not know all of it. So by speaking in generalities, she uses "DuMorne's bullyboy" as cover for the more-dangerous plot. (n.b. there may have been other veiled parties watching & listening, who did not drop their veils -- why would the wizards do something aboveboard when they could do something sneaky?)
--- Quote from: Conspiracy Theorist on February 14, 2023, 12:53:14 PM ---... Earlier in Summer Knight, Mab in her first meeting with Harry mentions that she watched Harry stalemate the Leansidhe. In Grave Peril I believe that Mab was told by The Gatekeeper of a potential divergence in futures the centre of which was Harry a Starborn. She was watching Harry, not the Leansidhe, and it was after that that she bought Harry’s mortgage, I don’t believe she had any interest in Harry until then.
--- End quote ---
I disagree (strongly).
1. All the major powers see the signs and understand that something apocalyptic is coming (they likely have a very good idea what that "something" is).
2. All the major powers understand (a) what a Starborn is; & (b) that the conditions for a "Starbirth" were right, 30ish years ago... so there are 1 or more Starborn running around right now.
3. Mab, as warleader of the Outer Gates, is primarily about fighting Outsiders (being "Winter" on Earth is the smaller part of her duties).
4. Because a Starborn has both resistance-to and power-over Outsiders, Mab is keenly interested in bringing any Starborn (that she can) into her service -- particularly in such key roles as her Knight.
5. We know Mab lays plans -- long, long plans. WoJ says that Mab doesn't care about burning through most of her footsoldiers, because it only takes a generation to breed the replacements.
6. We have to presume that Mab knew (1) & (2) ahead of time -- that an apocalypse & a Starborn were both coming; given (5) I cannot believe Mab wasn't laying plans (at least a generation ago) to get her hands (and oaths) laid upon Starborn to fight the Outsiders.
Then consider:
7. Margaret LeFay was likely the most "faerie-famous" human alive (possibly excepting the ever-changing Knights); she was also an unusually strong wizard, and (via Salic Law) likely to birth a strong wizard as offspring. This would automatically put her on Mab's radar vis-a-vis point #6.
8. Mab's handmaiden is the Leanansidhe... who "somehow" ended up as Harry's faerie Godmother.
Really. Mab's Handmaiden as the Faerie Godmother to one of (if not the) strongest wizards of his generation, who "just happens" to be the Starborn that Mab wants and...
egads, man!
You're a Conspiracy Theorist and you can't see this??!? ;D
Mira:
--- Quote ---I don't think we know for sure what she meant.
Most-trivially, it could just have been "Justin DuMorne's pet enforcer," a bullyboy warlock. Here, I think, the part she's not saying out loud is, "all his basic training is from a black-magic practitioner, and while we didn't find any mental booby-traps we may have missed some; and because of that basic training, we cannot discount that his basic mindset may be fundamentally that of a warlock." This is the POV of those who distrust Harry & think it was wrong to levy the Doom of Damocles instead of just killing him.
--- End quote ---
I agree, I believe this is what she meant also. However I think you could lump starborn into that as well, given what we've seen of the overt starborns in the series so far, i.e. Drakul and Listens.. And perhaps that is the general rule for them? It also maybe the reason why Margaret chose to mate with a truly good man, Malcolm, to create one, to upset the chemistry...
g33k:
--- Quote from: Mira on February 15, 2023, 05:47:39 AM ---I agree, I believe this is what she meant also. However I think you could lump starborn into that as well, given what we've seen of the overt starborns in the series so far, i.e. Drakul and Listens.. And perhaps that is the general rule for them? ...
--- End quote ---
I think the message was more layered than that; she was saying different things to different audiences.
Maybe there was a cadre of combat-Wardens, both veiled and standing out of Harry's line-of-sight, ready to take him down if he offered any sign of violence. Seriously: if you were Captain Luccio, protecting multiple Senior Council members from a suspected Warlock (who was known to be an unusually-strong Wizard already) ... wouldn't you insist on a precaution like that? (I mean... the Blackstaff likely needs no protection, but -- as Harry's advocate there -- his willingness to act swiftly in taking-down the warlock is subject to doubt; so, a backup plan).
Thus -- so I WAG -- Martha needed to speak "plainly" to Ebenezer, but have her context (Starborn, Adriana/Raith "starbabe" plan, etc) be completely-misunderstood by the magical brute-squad standing by.
And yes (given, as you say, Listen & Drakul; and also (as of the Journal microfiction) Morgan's mention of a "Destroyer") it seems possible that many (most?) Starborn turn to evil. I don't think we have complete info, but Jim seems to be hinting that way.
OTOH, I've also seen the theory (is there WoJ on this?) that Rashid himself is a Starborn... So it's also very possible that we simply don't see enough known Starborn "onstage" to have a good basis to judge.
--- Quote from: Mira on February 15, 2023, 05:47:39 AM --- ... It also maybe the reason why Margaret chose to mate with a truly good man, Malcolm, to create one, to upset the chemistry...
--- End quote ---
If you're arguing that "goodness" (and evil) is a heritable characteristic, I've got to disagree with you strongly. That idea underpins some of the worst instances of racism the world has ever known.
If you think she wanted Malcom to be the father-figure raising Harry (inculcating ethics & morality in an Aristotelian "give me a boy until he is seven years old..." sense) then I suspect you're right; although I also suspect she simply fell in love with him.
Conspiracy Theorist:
“Aurora nodded, slowly. ‘From the beginning, you have been meant to be a destroyer.”
Page 239 of Summer Knight - the second reference to Harry’s Starborn status, we only know from Morgan’s Microfiction of Starborn/Destroyer duality
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