The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
Why is Mab trying to change Harry?
Mira:
--- Quote from: Ed0517 on February 03, 2023, 05:52:22 AM ---I don't know how much she is trying to change him. He's a powerful agent without the mantle. With the mantle, he's likely far more powerful than most past Winter Knights. But that will and power...he's not an iron hand in a velvet glove, he's an iron hand in a spiked cestus. He is going to piss off Summer - getting the Lady killed will do that. He will piss off some other powers - like the Red court. Remember them? He causes trouble. But Mab will take the trouble to have his abilities.
--- End quote ---
I wouldn't say he causes trouble in the cases you sighted.. In the case of Aurora, she was infected and started a war between Summer and Winter, yeah, getting her killed pissed off her mother, but she knew it had to be done. What pissed her of is how it was done, the little folk using steel box cutters. He didn't make the trouble with the Red Court they have been trouble for a millennia, but he finished it.
g33k:
--- Quote from: Ed0517 on February 03, 2023, 05:52:22 AM --- I don't know how much she is trying to change him. He's a powerful agent without the mantle. With the mantle, he's likely far more powerful than most past Winter Knights. But that will and power...he's not an iron hand in a velvet glove, he's an iron hand in a spiked cestus. He is going to piss off Summer - getting the Lady killed will do that. He will piss off some other powers - like the Red court. Remember them? He causes trouble. But Mab will take the trouble to have his abilities.
--- End quote ---
Mab thrives on conflict & violence; all of Winter does. Remember Harry's experience of the WK Mantle -- violence. Molly's testimony is that it's the same. Mother Winter took a cleaver to Harry. I think we can be confident that Mab's own Wintery urges are similarly violent & bloody. She's just very, very self-controlled.
Also, remember that most of Winter is actually out very-deep in the Nevernever, fighting at the Outer Gates... most of Summer is Mortal-centric (in the mortal realm or the close-in Nevernever), and Winter only keeps enough of their forces in similar positions to be able to match Summer.... Mab is the warleader for the mortal realms, she is all about war.
She may lay deep & subtle plans -- particularly as compared to Harry -- but she finds Harry's propensity for mayhem & anarchy to be both useful (in uncovering hidden forces) and likely very sympathetic to her own drives toward violence.
--- Quote from: Mira on February 03, 2023, 03:27:53 PM --- ... He didn't make the trouble with the Red Court they have been trouble for a millennia, but he finished it.
--- End quote ---
He did "make" the trouble with the Ramps; Vamp's are always trouble, as you say. They were not ready to actually declare war on the WC, though -- Harry forced their hand, he "made" the trouble.
Thing is... they were actually already planning to go to war, they just had planned another decade or two of prep-work before striking; their war-effort was unready, their early strikes less devastating than planned. So (as he so often does) Harry's propensity for violence + investigation led him to act in ways too provocative for the Ramps to ignore, and they moved early.
As he often ends up doing, Harry uncovered an Evil Plan(tm) to the benefit of his allies (one must admit, being attacked by a nation of supermonsters with addictive spittle didn't feel like a "benefit" to the White Council).
Mira:
--- Quote ---Thing is... they were actually already planning to go to war, they just had planned another decade or two of prep-work before striking; their war-effort was unready, their early strikes less devastating than planned. So (as he so often does) Harry's propensity for violence + investigation led him to act in ways too provocative for the Ramps to ignore, and they moved early.
--- End quote ---
That's a bit more complicated though.. Bianca invited Harry to her party.. He wasn't going to go, then Susan stole the invitation and he screwed up and lost Michael's Sword to Lea. He and Michael had to go to the party, from that moment on it was a set up,if not before. Remember Mavra had a little something to do with Harry, Michael, and Susan not leaving the shindig. When Harry went to rescue Susan and Justine, Ortega just happened to be there to blame it all on him and declare war.. If anyone was the blame it would be Bianca, who wanted revenge on Harry because she blamed him for her losing control and killing her beloved secretary. Shiro did tell later that Bianca miscalculated, because her actions forced the Red Court into war before they were ready.
g33k:
--- Quote from: Mira on February 03, 2023, 09:48:49 PM --- ... He wasn't going to go, then Susan stole the invitation and he screwed up and lost Michael's Sword to Lea. He and Michael had to go to the party, from that moment on it was a set up,if not before ...
--- End quote ---
I suspect it was already a set up.
I'm not sure whose set up it was; I suspect Mab, tho -- Lea's boss -- having Lea get Harry motivated to go to Bianca's party. I remain convinced that Mab was deeply interested in recruiting a Starborn -- Harry -- as her next WK. So Mab was both testing his mettle, and tempering him in the crucible of violence & confusion.
Mira:
--- Quote from: g33k on February 04, 2023, 04:55:26 AM ---I suspect it was already a set up.
I'm not sure whose set up it was; I suspect Mab, tho -- Lea's boss -- having Lea get Harry motivated to go to Bianca's party. I remain convinced that Mab was deeply interested in recruiting a Starborn -- Harry -- as her next WK. So Mab was both testing his mettle, and tempering him in the crucible of violence & confusion.
--- End quote ---
I doubt it was Mab. Remember Harry's total fear of Lea at that point? He was afraid she was going to turn him into a hound. That's why he tried to kill her with Michael's Sword, which it wouldn't let him do. It fell out of his hands and she picked it up and took off with it, remember? At the party Lea gave Bianca the Sword, and Bianca gifted Lea with the Knife that Cowl had presented to her.. Or someone fitting Cowl's description. The Knife that turned out to be infected with Nemesis. Which in turn infected Lea, infected Maeve and led to her death, and may have tried to infect Mab until she figured out what was going on.. No, it wasn't Mab that set up Harry.
Here is my theory, I have posted it before. When we first meet Lea, she appeared to me to be a bit power hungry. When she got hold of the Sword, she made a bargain with Bianca, the Holy Sword, for the Knife. She thought that the Knife would help her overthrow Mab. I don't think Lea had any idea that the Knife was infected, but I do believe that Bianca knew. Not sure how she knew of the Knife, but Cowl seemed to be merely the delivery man in this case. Also remember Harry telling Morgan in Dead Beat I believe, that the Red Court were mere cat's paws of a more powerful group. That will be who Cowl works for, though we don't know who that is yet. Bianca, as arrogant as she was and ambitious as she was, wouldn't have realized that she was being used, nor frankly did Lea.
The plan was to take out the Winter Court by stealth with the infected knife, while occupying the Red Court and the White Council with fighting a war. The guard at the Outer Gates would perhaps be down and the Outsiders could attack. Not unlike during the battle for Chicago, the Outer Gates were attacked. Hmmmm, looks like the Fomor and even Ethniu herself were only cat's paws in the end to distract with that huge battle. Thank goodness for Rashid, who kept to his post.
Navigation
[0] Message Index
[#] Next page
[*] Previous page
Go to full version