The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
Justin DuMorne
Mira:
--- Quote from: Ed0517 on November 06, 2022, 01:14:05 AM ---I have to point out, though, Chauncy could have been EXPECTING her to damned.... "She's on the way!" - as many have said about HARRY himself - plenty would have been willing to see the warlock chopped.... The Dark Prince couldn't quite set the hook.
...and "piece of work" does not mean damned. Maybe Grey thought she was a Grade A witch. Hated her. Does not damn here either.
Heck, it does not mean she was NOT headed there. But there seems to be almost infinite forgiveness available for the truly penitent - didn't Michael even say if it was sincere, they would take NICODEMUS back?
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But Nic isn't going to get forgiven unless he truly repents and changes his life. Even if he does, that doesn't change who he was or what he did before hand. Before she met Malcolm and apparently repented and changed her life around, Margaret was a piece of work and was headed for Hell and damnation. Those who knew her before Malcolm will tell you that. Michael might have faith that even Nic can repent and be forgiven for his sins, i.e. especially now that he has the Grail. However until he does repent and is forgiven, Nic is what he is, and that isn't a very nice person. That part of his life remains what it was, repented or not, forgiven or not.
Ed0517:
--- Quote from: Mira on November 06, 2022, 10:57:26 AM ---But Nic isn't going to get forgiven unless he truly repents and changes his life. Even if he does, that doesn't change who he was or what he did before hand. Before she met Malcolm and apparently repented and changed her life around, Margaret was a piece of work and was headed for Hell and damnation. Those who knew her before Malcolm will tell you that. Michael might have faith that even Nic can repent and be forgiven for his sins, i.e. especially now that he has the Grail. However until he does repent and is forgiven, Nic is what he is, and that isn't a very nice person. That part of his life remains what it was, repented or not, forgiven or not.
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Oh, no one EXPECTS Nic to repent and atone. But the path is open should he choose to take it. I am saying Margaret may have been HEADED that way before she changed her ways. But it doesn't say she was definitely damned yet. She might yet have been that kid that hangs out with the wrong sort. the kids with records, felonies, many have been in prison. You expect she is on that path.. but she hasn't done that felony YET. Only misdemeanors. Even the sanctimonious WC has not decreed she be executed. She may have still been dancing the tightrope.
Mira:
--- Quote from: Ed0517 on November 08, 2022, 01:18:49 AM ---Oh, no one EXPECTS Nic to repent and atone. But the path is open should he choose to take it. I am saying Margaret may have been HEADED that way before she changed her ways. But it doesn't say she was definitely damned yet. She might yet have been that kid that hangs out with the wrong sort. the kids with records, felonies, many have been in prison. You expect she is on that path.. but she hasn't done that felony YET. Only misdemeanors. Even the sanctimonious WC has not decreed she be executed. She may have still been dancing the tightrope.
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From what Luccio said, and even Grey she did more than just hang out with the wrong crowd, she broke several of the Laws. I do believe there was an execution order out on her. Being described as a "piece of work," in this context isn't a title that one earns for misdemeanors.. Chauncy said, "her coming," that sounds like a pretty sure thing. No one expected her to repent or atone either, but upon falling in love with Malcolm, she did. But all the forgiveness, repentance, or atonement in the world can't change what went on before. Her past is her past and those who only knew her then, know her by that past.
g33k:
--- Quote from: Mira on November 08, 2022, 10:53:26 AM --- From what Luccio said, and even Grey she did more than just hang out with the wrong crowd, she broke several of the Laws...
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I don't think Luccio said that; I think it was Eb himself.
Luccio was far kinder than that, speaking to Harry... OTOH, Luccio at the time was being mentally-influenced by Peabody, to get closer to Harry. Dumping on his mom was probably not her go-to strategy.
--- Quote from: Mira on November 08, 2022, 10:53:26 AM --- ... I do believe there was an execution order out on her ...
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I don't think there was; but I don't recall any definitive statement (either way) in the books, or in any WoJ.
Specifically, I suspect that (despite Eb's confident statement of Law-breaking) I don't think the larger Warden/WC knew of that, or had held the trial necessary to order an execution (and I WAG it as very-possible that someone deceived Ebenezer into thinking his daughter was a murderer &c (just as he feared she was): it would be a masterful manipulation-tactic to use against the Blackstaff).
morriswalters:
--- Quote from: Blood Rites ---"The Council knew that you were the son of Margaret LeFay. They knew that she was one of the wizards who had turned the Council's own laws against it. She was guilty of violating the First Law, among others, and she had… unsavory associations with various entities of dubious reputation. The Wardens were under orders to arrest her on sight. She'd have been tried and executed in moments when she was brought before the Council."
"I was told she died in childbirth," I said.
"She did," Ebenezar confirmed. "I don't know why, but for some reason she turned away from her previous associates—including Justin DuMorne. After that, nowhere was safe for her. She ran from her former allies and from the Wardens for perhaps two years. And she ran from me. I had my orders regarding her as well."
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