The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
Are Soul gazes inherently subjective?
Arjan:
--- Quote from: g33k on April 08, 2022, 03:48:52 AM ---Very very little "hard objective" data... like, is this person a Whampire, or not? Yeah, you can get that as objective data (and such data can be important (e.g. may have saved Ramirez's life)).
But don't discount the idea that you can still get a very great deal of very "good hard objective data" from a 'gaze!
Repeating elements of the Dresden Files include that the "facts" (the "hard data") don't always tell the whole story; and that "objectivity" is more often a fools' errand than not.
I think the White Council relies (much!) too heavily on the results of a Soulgaze. But I think calling them "worthless" is even further off-base. They are the single most penetrating way to look into who a person is, down deep. And AFAIK we see no signs that a 'gaze can be substantively defeated, or defended-against (other than refusing to engage).
I seem to remember (unless I mis-remember?) that Warden SOP is to get at least 3 'gazes on someone who's on trial. That right there would go a long way toward circumventing any DuMornes who would subvert the system that way (if I am misremembering, then clearly they should do it!): if the Warden corps are so corrupt that 3 random individual Wardens can reliably be presumed to deliver any pre-determined testimony you want, then it's game-over and the Bad Guys have already won.
--- End quote ---
They only do a soul gaze when they think it necessary and they easily execute you without a trial if they are convinced enough you should die. Remember Molly's trial. Harry did a soul gaze but nobody else did and if it was left to the merlin she would have been executed without a trial which was clearly a waste of time and effort.
I am quite sure lots of warlocks are executed without trial or soul gaze, that is the impression I get. Partly because if they have any idea they will fight to the death anyway, partly because they are dangerous enough not to take the risk and partly because the wardens have serious manpower issues.
No doubt the council has an important task and we would be worse off without it but there are serious problems as well. The story would be too simple without them.
vincentric:
The Council can't save young borderline warlocks because their rules are insane.
They don't bring them to a central location for schooling(like say a giant castle with a huge underground complex under their total control), they'd rather foster them out to a single total stranger used to living in isolation. Oh, and while we hope you can bond with this kid who's led a hard and undisciplined life, if you don't get him straight, we'll have to just kill you both.
If the reward for failed altruism is death, there aren't going to be many volunteers. In fact, I'd be suspicious of the motives of any volunteer. They must have a hidden agenda of some sort or be recruiting a talented follower to go rogue with.
Mira:
--- Quote from: vincentric on April 08, 2022, 04:08:46 PM ---The Council can't save young borderline warlocks because their rules are insane.
They don't bring them to a central location for schooling(like say a giant castle with a huge underground complex under their total control), they'd rather foster them out to a single total stranger used to living in isolation. Oh, and while we hope you can bond with this kid who's led a hard and undisciplined life, if you don't get him straight, we'll have to just kill you both.
If the reward for failed altruism is death, there aren't going to be many volunteers. In fact, I'd be suspicious of the motives of any volunteer. They must have a hidden agenda of some sort or be recruiting a talented follower to go rogue with.
--- End quote ---
Yeah, all of that tends to happen when one goes zero tolerance.. Yes, it sound good, tough on warlocks can't risk one slipping through, they do too much damage.. But as we all know almost nothing is that simple, they lose a lot of potential good future wizards that way.
g33k:
--- Quote from: vincentric on April 08, 2022, 04:08:46 PM ---The Council can't save young borderline warlocks because their rules are insane.
They don't bring them to a central location for schooling ...
--- End quote ---
--- Quote from: Mira on April 08, 2022, 10:02:43 PM --- Yeah, all of that tends to happen when one goes zero tolerance...
--- End quote ---
I think the key issue is simply that the Council doesn't have enough people, or the right sorts of infrastructure. Even before the war against the Reds, and their struggles with the situations caused by a "Black Council" (who they wouldn't even admit existed), the wizards had no good way to spot any proto-wizards, nor to collect them for "proper" training.
Harry could probably have used Little Chicago for something like that... for the city of Chicago (I guess the entire rest of the world would need something else).
But... what would Harry have done with the baby-wizardlings he found? Become an (unpaid!) schoolteacher? Become a mass kidnapper (because you know there'd be plenty of "oh HELL no!" parents).
I'm not saying you're wrong; I'm just saying that a better option is not as easy as you suggest...
Arjan:
Also you don’t want to soul gaze too many warlocks. It can be bad for your mental health.
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