The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers

Could the Za Lord's Guard defeat the White Council AND KotC Ways travel?

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Yuillegan:

--- Quote from: Mira on January 08, 2022, 03:11:31 PM ---Or does Uriel really have that much leeway?  I think it is more like he is given task by his Boss.  It isn't what Uriel wants as far as Christmas goes, or Harry's soul walk about, it is what his Boss wants.  He knows from the onset what he can give or not give..  Like an ambassador negotiating a treaty, yes, he/she is making a deal, but nothing can be bargained on his/her own, it is what the countries represented wants.

--- End quote ---
Ah, but is it a matter of Uriel being an automaton, an extension of his Boss' will? Or does Uriel get given tasks and it is up to him how to complete them (within his limits)?

I thin the latter is far more likely. Angels are not (as far as we know) merely extensions of their Creator. Uriel wouldn't have been able to con the Father of Lies if he didn't have some agency himself. Nor would he have been able to give Michael his Grace. That was the act of a being with will.


--- Quote from: morriswalters on January 09, 2022, 10:39:08 PM ---In the Dresdenverse Demonreach is the point.  It was there first. All else would seem to follow. You might speculate that the various factions sense something is going to happen there, even if they don't consciously know it.

--- End quote ---
That's a mildly linear way to look at it. Demonreach was there first to some perspectives but not to those who existed prior to Merlin messing with time (unless you are saying that Demonreach is an ontological paradox, which is fair). Regardless, you might be very right from a Doylist perspective also.


--- Quote from: Ed0517 on January 10, 2022, 07:54:19 AM ---i'd point out no one stacked Butters in Chicago, he was there already when he signed on. And the Svartalves..likely have a presence in most major cities if they are that powerful. We don't know enough of those guys. They sound more Swiss or the like. Consulates in most major world cities? Likely have them almost certainly in NYC and DC, probably LA, London, etc. 

I agree with Mira, if the Almighty wanted the Knights to have easy access to the Ways, He'd have done it by now. He doesn't always do such big things, just makes Forthill run out of gas in front of Michael's when he needs a babysitter. Heck, when Michael caught a Way in to save Molly... he still had to go back to Idaho or whatever with Harry to drive his truck back.....

(Ok, there was a little fringe - Michael's truck is fairly new, yet it works fine with Harry for a thousand miles? Some Heavenly mechanic adds Tempest level shielding? Just like Michael's house doesn't have issues...)

--- End quote ---
Depends how far back you go. We are talking multi-dimensional time chess here. When did Butter's move to Chicago? What events transpired to make sure he became an ME there? Even if he lived his whole life there, what events made sure he stayed and became who he was so that he could be in the right place at the right time? Angels are architects of fate, after all.

The Svartalves probably do have presences in other cities, same for the White Court. Yet, their leadership was based in Chicago. Apart from writing reasons, what in-universe reasons could there be for them all being in Chicago? The answer is something to do with what is going to happen there, and what has already.

Exactly right about the Almighty. He organises things for his agents, or he has other agents do it for them.

Conspiracy Theorist:
And who is to say he didn’t organise it for Butters to remove the steel from Mab and not one of Harry’s other allies? One of the other wizards, an alpha, Murphy, one of Harry’s Banner.

The White God has Mab beat hands down when it comes to forward planning, he wanted one of his Knights to be owed a major favour by Mab, so he arranged it. Likely he will arrange that Butters can use it when   Butters really needs something like this. Conclusion. Butters has something coming up which will require a MAJOR favour by Mab to resolve, something Harry can’t help him with alone, and which cannot be resolved by the normal manipulation of mundane means and which is within Mab’s power to resolve but something Uriel is forbidden to do.

Mention of the Banner now has me thinking that the Knights of the Swords can create a Banner if the Denarians can...and if it was Butters would his Banner include a marching Polka Band? bah!

morriswalters:

--- Quote from: Yuillegan on January 10, 2022, 12:07:33 PM ---That's a mildly linear way to look at it. Demonreach was their first to some perspectives but not to those who existed prior to Merlin messing with time (unless you are saying that Demonreach is an ontological paradox, which is fair). Regardless, you might be very right from a Doylist perspective also.

--- End quote ---
I hate it when you force me to a dictionary to understand your point. ;D

This all depends on when you think that Demonreach was created. Bob told you that Demonreach was created in five different times at the same time. So was it created in the past or the future?  Where did Merlin start drawing the pentagram.

Mira:

--- Quote from: morriswalters on January 10, 2022, 01:56:25 PM ---I hate it when you force me to a dictionary to understand your point. ;D

This all depends on when you think that Demonreach was created. Bob told you that Demonreach was created in five different times at the same time. So was it created in the past or the future?  Where did Merlin start drawing the pentagram.

--- End quote ---

I think the answer is it was created in both the past and the future if I remember and understood correctly what Alfred told Harry back in Cold Days.  That is why it is an effective prison, because some of it's inmates can time travel so if the prison wasn't created that way all they have to do is go forward or backward in time and escape.

morriswalters:
Sounds pretty cool, but it begs the question.  Here is the problem. You can always go to a point where the prison doesn't exist, unless you go to the point of creation. But once it exists at some point in the past, it exists everywhere in the timeline from that point until the present unless destroyed or removed. So why create it at five different times? It does make a certain amount of sense if you build it backwards.

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