The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
What does this mean?
Arjan:
I was not talking about going berserk and vendetta is what you get if a revenge cycle runs out of control. Just that revenge is a very basic human instinct. It has to be actively suppressed in society to get it under control.
And that control can slip. And Harry is not raised in medieval Iceland but he is continuously moving in such a world. It will influence him.
And wanting to kill the murderer of your lover is not exactly unnatural. It is just something we have mostly learned to suppress and now Harry is under strong influences not to suppress it. In the midst of a battle when a lot of brakes are less functional and people are in a highly emotional state anyway. And do not forget the mantle who really does not understand not killing Rudolph.
Mira:
--- Quote ---his isn't medieval Iceland and Harry wasn't raised there. And I don't think that every few books Harry is suppose to throw a temper tantrum and try to kill somebody. Here's what Harry says in Skin Game when he holds his temper in check.
--- End quote ---
No, nor was Harry's reaction premeditated, there is a difference you know? There is also a huge difference between a temper tantrum and Harry's emotional reaction to Murphy's death given the total context that it happened in. He'd been in fight or fight mode for several days leading up to the battle, he was working on little or no rest, plus pressure from all sides. Harry wasn't under any such pressure in Skin Game to begin with, he knew that Murphy wasn't dead. Interesting that Michael admits, himself, he'd have been really pissed.. And yeah, back in the Warrior, Michael was about to beat to death the guy who hurt and kidnapped his kid with a baseball bat.. Harry stopped him, understood and no one that I can recall was accusing Michael of being a cold blooded murderer because his impulse was to kill that guy in the most intimate of ways, beating him to death.. So temper tantrum or an angry distraught father reacting in a fairly normal way?
--- Quote ---In Battle Ground he's defending Chicago. So he stops, goes nuts, assaults a friend, and tries to murder a fruitcake for being a fruitcake. That isn't a vendetta. I don't know what it's suppose to represent, but it ain't that.
--- End quote ---
Assaulting a friend? No, not really, more like he wasn't going to allow anyone to stop him.. Not quite the same, and believe me, been there done that.. Sanya understood that, as did Butters, and they totally forgave him. Harry wasn't being rational in that moment, his friends knew that, but trying to stop someone in that mode can be dangerous, his friends also knew that.
--- Quote ---I was not talking about going berserk and vendetta is what you get if a revenge cycle runs out of control. Just that revenge is a very basic human instinct. It has to be actively suppressed in society to get it under control.
And that control can slip. And Harry is not raised in medieval Iceland but he is continuously moving in such a world. It will influence him.
And wanting to kill the murderer of your lover is not exactly unnatural. It is just something we have mostly learned to suppress and now Harry is under strong influences not to suppress it. In the midst of a battle when a lot of brakes are less functional and people are in a highly emotional state anyway. And do not forget the mantle who really does not understand not killing Rudolph.
--- End quote ---
Exactly, and also note that neither Butters nor Sanya faulted Harry for going after Rudolph, but hit him with the logic that if he successfully killed him, he'd be out of the bigger more important fight. That was the logic they hit him with, that and that justice would take care of Rudolph and it wasn't Harry's place to dish it out.
morriswalters:
@Mira
Jim telegraphs to you that Harry could be something called a destroyer. He retcons Morgan to put across that message and it never occurs to you that there is a reason for these passages?
@Arjan
If my wife were murdered in front of my eyes I don't know that I could move much less contemplate murder.
Arjan:
--- Quote from: morriswalters on June 24, 2021, 06:06:03 PM ---@Mira
Jim telegraphs to you that Harry could be something called a destroyer. He retcons Morgan to put across that message and it never occurs to you that there is a reason for these passages?
@Arjan
If my wife were murdered in front of my eyes I don't know that I could move much less contemplate murder.
--- End quote ---
That is good. That means you are thouroughly civilised. I can not do it either I think but it used to be pretty normal.
Mira:
--- Quote from: morriswalters on June 24, 2021, 06:06:03 PM ---@Mira
Jim telegraphs to you that Harry could be something called a destroyer. He retcons Morgan to put across that message and it never occurs to you that there is a reason for these passages?
@Arjan
If my wife were murdered in front of my eyes I don't know that I could move much less contemplate murder.
--- End quote ---
I am sorry for your loss, but understand that everyone reacts to violence differently. You were severely shocked by such a horrible thing, you reacted in a normal way for you, that doesn't make the reaction Jim wrote for Harry, abnormal. Myself I went through people much like Harry did to get to my dead son.. If I had to smack someone to do it, I would have, including my husband. Call that assault if you want to, I know now all he wanted to do was spare me the sight, but I didn't want to be spared.
--- Quote ---That is good. That means you are thouroughly civilised. I can not do it either I think but it used to be pretty normal.
--- End quote ---
I think it still is a normal reaction for some people.. When you witness that kind of horror, you react, it may mean that you are frozen in horror, you may scream, you may get very angry and try to get who did it, you may be silent and contemplate revenge, or all of the above, all are very human reactions, and normal for you.. There is no good or bad, that is something one also learns in the grieving process.
Yes, Harry maybe called a destroyer but that doesn't always mean that it is a bad thing.. It is a harsh word, but if he is a destroyer of evil, is that bad?
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