The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
I think Murphy is going to get killed here is why
huangjimmy108:
--- Quote from: Bad Alias on June 04, 2019, 04:36:48 AM ---It's not just the punching. It's the repeated shutting down of him attempting to speak to her. It's her arresting him thus giving him additional constitutional protection form self incrimination. It's her reading him his rights while they are battling MacFinn. It's her still wondering if Harry is playing her while they are on Marcone's estate. Honestly, the punching is the least of it when it comes to my opinion that she's not going to listen to him any time soon.
--- End quote ---
Listen in the midst of Battle? Are you serious? That sounds suicidal to me.?
And as for Murphy reading Harry's rights when fighting Mcfinn. Well, Harry is a suspect. Not just a suspect, but a suspect that escape police custody. Reading his rights is as it should be. If she is still angry, she would have gave Harry another punch or just shoot him.
Having a good talk under those circumstances simply isn't right.
nadia.skylark:
--- Quote ---Harry has a guilt complex, but he always get things right in the end. He is slow, but he'll get there eventually. Six years has gone by, if Harry still can't straight things out in his mind, he is not worthy of his wizard title.
--- End quote ---
In that time, Murphy and he have become friends, so it makes sense that he doesn't really think about it that much. Also, in Fool Moon Harry's subconscious notes that he's been blaming himself for Elaine's fall to darkness (at that point, he didn't know that she had been enthralled) for ten years, so...
--- Quote ---With all those rumors running around, Murphy would not have involve Harry in the investigations if she do not trust Harry. So if you say there is no trust and thus no betrayal, it is wrong.
--- End quote ---
Really? So she has some other wizard she can go to for information on werewolves, then?
--- Quote ---If I want to talk and someone punch me in the face to shut me up, I will indeed assume that this person don't want to talk to me. In my anger and humiliation, I even may assume that this person will never talk to me again. But if I calm down and think rationally, I will realize that we should be able to talk again after both party calms down.
--- End quote ---
What if, prior to them punching you, they've made it clear several times that they don't trust you and therefore won't trust what you say? What happens if, the next time you see that person, while you are actively saving their life and the lives of their co-workers, they try to arrest you? What happens if, the time after that, while you are once again working to save their life, they tell you that they still don't trust you, even though they've been proved wrong about their suspicions of you?
I agree with Bad Alias--the punching is in no way the whole story here.
Also, you are far more all right with being physically attacked than I can ever imagine being.
--- Quote ---You say Murphy won't listen to Harry. I say Murphy won't listen to Harry at the moment.
--- End quote ---
I say that Murphy won't listen to Harry for a period of a few days to a month. If she were going to turn around and listen to Harry immediately, I would expect her to not try to arrest him in the middle of the Loup Garou fight in the police station, or at least to ask him what's going on first.
--- Quote ---Murphy has a temper. It is a character flaw. The same as Harry's character flaw which is his guilt complex. Maybe arrogance and some trust issue too. The character flaw causes problem from time to time.
--- End quote ---
Also control issues.
--- Quote ---There is nothing wrong with that. If you call this a patern, than perhaps it is. Murphy is not the only one who has it though.
--- End quote ---
It's a problem when she doesn't try to improve. I had thought she was improving in later books, and quite liked her, but then Cold Days made me re-evaluate, and caused me to conclude that she didn't actually improve that much, but rather her character flaws just weren't directed at Harry in those books.
I'm fine with Harry's guilt complex because he is improving, and we regularly see people call him on it. Actually, if we saw Harry actually get angry at Murphy during Fool Moon, rather than just roll over and take it, I'd be considerably more likely to excuse Murphy--which is not necessarily fair to her character, I'll admit.
--- Quote ---Listen in the midst of Battle? Are you serious? That sounds suicidal to me.?
--- End quote ---
If she had time to read Harry his rights in the middle of the Loup Garou fight, she had time to listen to him. And on Marcone's estate, they had the time in the pit where they actually had a conversation.
--- Quote ---And as for Murphy reading Harry's rights when fighting Mcfinn. Well, Harry is a suspect. Not just a suspect, but a suspect that escape police custody. Reading his rights is as it should be. If she is still angry, she would have gave Harry another punch or just shoot him.
--- End quote ---
They're in the middle of a supernatural battle! Furthermore, Harry was actively working to save everyone's lives. In those circumstances, I would expect her to save the arresting for after the fight.
--- Quote ---Having a good talk under those circumstances simply isn't right.
--- End quote ---
Nor is trying to arrest the person saving the lives of you and all your co-workers, and yet that didn't stop Murphy.
huangjimmy108:
I don't see Harry improving much either. His character flaw is still there and making trouble from time to time as always.
nadia.skylark:
--- Quote ---I don't see Harry improving much either. His character flaw is still there and making trouble from time to time as always.
--- End quote ---
To an extent. One major example of character development here is his response to Murphy getting hurt in Skin Game. In earlier books, he would have (and frequently did) blame himself for what happened to Murphy, but in this book he is able to acknowledge that she made her own choices, and he is not to blame for what happened to her. He also doesn't hold himself responsible for Butters being put in danger, for much the same reason.
huangjimmy108:
--- Quote from: nadia.skylark on June 04, 2019, 06:14:05 AM ---To an extent. One major example of character development here is his response to Murphy getting hurt in Skin Game. In earlier books, he would have (and frequently did) blame himself for what happened to Murphy, but in this book he is able to acknowledge that she made her own choices, and he is not to blame for what happened to her. He also doesn't hold himself responsible for Butters being put in danger, for much the same reason.
--- End quote ---
Murphy has improve too. She don't punch Harry anymore.
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