The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
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Fcrate:
--- Quote from: groinkick on April 22, 2018, 06:35:32 PM ---Come on, that's not the same as a DarkHallow. There is a difference in killing people for power, and casualties if war. His targets were the evil Red Court vampires, the innocents that died as a result weren't targets, but other victims of the Red's who'd been infected without permission.
--- End quote ---
I agree with your first point.
--- Quote from: groinkick on April 22, 2018, 06:47:41 PM ---I think the innocence being talked about were the people infected, but not turned who died. Only the younger once's survived I believe.
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No, he's right, I meant the vampires. And from their perspective, they're innocent. They have to feed in order to survive, they see humans as herd animals, so they have no qualms about slaughtering them to feed themselves.
Yes, they still have to be killed on basic principle, it's an "us and them" kind of situation. Wiping out an entire species was a concious choice for Harry, fueled by need and much anger. He was quite unhinged in Changes, and DarkHallow was a step away. That's still a moot point though, I can't see how he could manage DarkHallow in such little time, he didn't prepare the way as the Kemmlerites did in Dead Beat, no collective fear, necromantic energy to protect him, and with a broken back. At that point the only viable options were the Coin or Mab.
jonas:
--- Quote from: groinkick on April 22, 2018, 06:47:41 PM ---I think the innocence being talked about were the people infected, but not turned who died. Only the younger once's survived I believe.
--- End quote ---
Think then on the years they actually lived vs us normals, they owed Father Cronos a debt just as the denarians do, he collects. Dresden didn't 'take' anything from them except a curse they were fighting they're whole existence, acceptance of the curse and it's fringe benefits is one step closer to acceptance of the benefits of Rampirism. Notice the exact attitude of the one person whose had a problem with the fate of the fellowship? If any of them cared it would have been in the same vein of selfishness... considering they devoted their existence to fighting the Ramps I don't believe for one second any one of them was not ready and willing to die for their cause.
Snark Knight:
--- Quote from: Fcrate on April 22, 2018, 04:33:14 PM ---I can. Lucky for him and us, he had other options. I believe that the evil scale is: Winter Knight<DarkHallow<Coin. And Harry's preference: Winter Knight>Coin>DarkHallow.
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The Darkhallow is probably more evil than the coin. The way the Fallen work is the first taste of power is free, to get you dependent on them.
You can always choose to drop the coin once you've got what you need from the Fallen, before you have to do anything monstrous to pay them back for what they've given you. The issue for a wizard is that means losing your power and going into retirement, but at least it's you paying the price rather than a bunch of dead innocents you had to drain.
Fcrate:
--- Quote from: Snark Knight on April 23, 2018, 01:36:21 PM ---but at least it's you paying the price rather than a bunch of dead innocents you had to drain.
--- End quote ---
Isn't DarkHallow supposed to be about sucking in spirits to increase your power? (Drunken Master. Heh) The vortex sucking life is more of a byproduct.
The Fallen will have more power over you, influence your thoughts, and eventually turn you into a monster that would just love to cause a Mini-Apocalypse. With DarkHallow you're still your own man, with nothing influencing your choices, so its more of a "Right-now-evil-act" vs a "Later on- a -chaos-loving-maniac" thing.
groinkick:
--- Quote from: Fcrate on April 22, 2018, 07:51:19 PM ---No, he's right, I meant the vampires. And from their perspective, they're innocent. They have to feed in order to survive, they see humans as herd animals, so they have no qualms about slaughtering them to feed themselves.
Yes, they still have to be killed on basic principle, it's an "us and them" kind of situation. Wiping out an entire species was a concious choice for Harry, fueled by need and much anger. He was quite unhinged in Changes, and DarkHallow was a step away. That's still a moot point though, I can't see how he could manage DarkHallow in such little time, he didn't prepare the way as the Kemmlerites did in Dead Beat, no collective fear, necromantic energy to protect him, and with a broken back. At that point the only viable options were the Coin or Mab.
--- End quote ---
In the Dresdenverse there is right, and wrong. Good, and evil. Angels who violate laws fall. White Court/Red Court vamps must kill to transform, and become 1 with their demon.
The vampires thinking they are innocent doesn't matter. In that universe they are evil. The only exception are those very few who are like Thomas who fight their evil demon. Very few have shown any care about killing though.
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