The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
The way male writers describe women
Mira:
--- Quote from: KurtinStGeorge on April 13, 2018, 02:06:53 AM ---The only thing I can add to this conversation is the Dresden Files, and particularly the first three books, are very much influenced by 1940's detective fiction. In Storm Front, Jim lifted the basic plot structure of "Farewell My Lovely" by Raymond Chandler and made a few clever twists and then added magic. (Though a very well thought out magic system.) In both books the detective starts investigating a murder, there is a criminal who is not the murderer but for his own reasons doesn't want the investigator getting involved, there is another murder of someone who knows too much and in both novels it's a women. I almost forgot the best part; in both books the investigator is involved in a separate investigation, looking for a missing person, but in the end both investigations are really the same investigation.
So all the conventions Jim used to create and animate Harry can't just go away. They remain integral to who Harry is and how he relates to women in general. Now if you see the same or very similar descriptions of women in the Alera series or in the newer Cinder Spires book (books whenever we get more), then the criticism leveled against Jim's writing is a much more valid argument.
Of course, it might be argued that those two series are modeled after genres with a particular take on the world and the people in it. For example, Jim has said the Cinder Spires is basically Horatio Hornblower sailing ship adventure with a steam punk twist. I've never read any Horatio Hornblower books so I can't go any further than that. The beta readers who have read samples of other types of novels Jim has played around with; like a hard scifi X-Files on the moon concept that his beta readers weren't that hot on, might have better insight into this question.
--- End quote ---
I have read the Hornblower series but not Cinder Spires... So I cannot compare...
Dina:
About Ron, yes, but that is not a problem, because there are no men more complex. At least that is the simplistic point of view :)
BTW, I didn't like Hermione and Ron as a couple. And apparently JKR herself admitted it was a mistake.
knnn:
--- Quote from: Dina on April 12, 2018, 04:20:21 AM ---The interesting thing for me is that the person writing the files is Harry. So his descriptions of the women fit perfectly well with his personality. But Aftermath was quite well written from a female PoV (IMHO). I don't remember Thomas descriptions in Backup, but I suspect he is not as...teen ager as Harry is.
--- End quote ---
Interesting.
I have never been sure about Murphy's internal dialogue in Aftermath. I always thought she came off as a little petty.
Examples:
--- Quote from: Aftermath ---If I remembered right, most guys who looked at Andi wouldn’t be entirely certain whether or not she had lips afterward. But she’d probably have back problems at some point.
--- End quote ---
--- Quote from: Aftermath ---Two other people stood on the stage, slightly behind him, testimony to his ability to lead. The first was a woman, a blond amazon more than six feet tall in a grey business suit. She had the legs that had been cruelly denied me at birth, the bitch.
--- End quote ---
In both cases, this is Murphy feeling more than unkindly at other women apparently simply because they appear in her mind to look better than her (male-y tropes as a well I believe -- bigger breasts and longer legs). Not to mention that I've never called anyone a "bitch" in my life out loud or mentally. But maybe I'm just too sensitive that way.
Dina:
Well, Murphy is allowed to be petty. Women are allowed to be petty. And I won't say more because I don't want to be criticized.
Griffyn612:
I don't think it's really petty, but I guess it's up to interpretation. I could see where someone could read that and think she was being hauty, a la Housewives of Never-Never. But I read it as being said with more of an amused sardonic tone. Like Sam and Dean Winchester calling each other jerk and bitch.
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