The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers

Marcone's Age @ SF

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raidem:
I wanted to establish a lower limit on Marcone's apparent age via Priscilla's timeline, text, and WOJ's.  I say lower limit because as we have seen with Sarissa, Wizards, etc apparent age can be drastically different than actual age.  Much of this is brought over from the Harry/Marcone Relationship thread as I believe discussion focused on his age is more appropriate in its own thread.

Establishing lower limit on Marcone's age via Priscilla's timeline to include events surrounding Amanda Beckitt.

--- Quote ---Amanda's birth via Priscilla's timeline prior to Storm Front
~13-17 14* BSF: Amanda Beckitt born.  [Age:0]
--- End quote ---

--- Quote ---[2,4-7* 3 years BSF] What I could see was the Beckitt family. Husband, wife, daughter, a little girl maybe ten or eleven years old. [Age: 10-11]
She is "in her late teens or early twenties" in DM which takes place about 3 years after SF. [Age 18-23] [~16-17]
--- End quote ---

--- Quote ---
--- Quote ---Murphy's jaw tensed, little motions at the corners of her face. Then she said, "Greg and Helen Beckitt. Three years ago, their daughter, Amanda, was killed in a cross fire.
Johnny Marcone's thugs were shooting it out with some of the Jamaican gang that was trying to muscle in on the territory back then. One of them shot the little girl. She lived for three weeks in intensive care and died when they took her off life support."
I didn't say anything. But I thought of Mrs. Beckitt's numb face and dead eyes.
"The Beckitts attempted to lodge a wrongful death suit against Johnny Marcone, but Marcone's lawyers were too good. They got it thrown out before it even went to court. And they never found the man who shot the little girl. Word has it that Marcone offered to pay them blood money. Make reparation. But they turned him down."
--- End quote ---

--- End quote ---

--- Quote ---~3-4 BSF: Marco Vargassi decides Marcone has become a threat to his father Tony's organization and tries to stage his death. Amanda Beckitt, daughter of Helen and Greg, is shot.  She is about 10 or 11 at the time, and she is in her late teens to early twenties in DM.  Tony Vargassi bribes the medical examiner to forge Amanda's death certificate to protect his son.  The Vargassis are still in power at the time of "Restoration of Faith."
--- End quote ---

--- Quote ---~2-3 BSF: Marcone learns of Amanda Beckitt, two years after her "death." per Marcone in DM
--- End quote ---

--- Quote ---~2 BSF: Marcone topples the Vargassis and founds his own empire.
--- End quote ---

Now for Marcone

--- Quote ---@BillyYank Marcone was a Marine. [Age>17 when he entered service]
--- End quote ---

--- Quote ---I looked over my shoulder to see a very, very young-looking Marcone.
He wasn't wearing a business suit. He had on jeans and a black leather jacket. His hair was longish, a little mussed, and he also sported a stubble of beard that gave him the kind of rakish look that would attract attention from the girls who fantasized about indulging with a bad boy. [Age:?] [BSF]
--- End quote ---

--- Quote ---"Gentleman" Johnny Marcone had been the thug to emerge on top of the pile after the Vargassi family had dissolved into internal strife. The police department saw Marcone as a mixed blessing, after years of merciless struggle and bloody exchanges with the Vargassis.
--- End quote ---
SF: Marcone's appearance during first Harry/Marcone encounter

--- Quote ---Gentleman Johnny Marcone didn't look like the sort of man who would have my legs broken or my jaw wired shut. His salt-and-pepper hair was cut short, and there were lines from sun and smiling etched into the corners of his eyes. His eyes were the green of well-worn dollar bills. He seemed more like a college football coach: good-looking, tanned, athletic, and enthusiastic. The impression was reinforced by the men he kept with him.
--- End quote ---
Harry's Age 25@SF per Priscilla timeline.

--- Quote ---25 BSF, October 31:  Harry is born.  Harry's mother, now Margaret Gwendolyn Dresden, dies in childbirth.  She is murdered by a ritual entropy curse, courtesy of Lord Raith. [Harry's Age SF=25]
--- End quote ---
Based on time of shootout, estimate of Amanda's birth, Harry's birth, and Marcone involvement in a shootout 2-7BSF at age no earlier than 18, I estimate that Marcone is at least 6-10 years older than Harry.

Priscilla's Timeline
http://www.jimbutcheronline.com/bb/index.php/topic,1592.0.html

raidem:
Given this WOJ:"@BillyYank Marcone was a Marine", I really don't see Marcone on active duty as a Marine from the time of Amanda Beckitt's shooting onward. During this time, he is actively fighting to take over a criminal enterprise.  Therefore, he served as a Marine prior to his appearance as quoted below:

--- Quote ---I looked over my shoulder to see a very, very young-looking Marcone.
He wasn't wearing a business suit. He had on jeans and a black leather jacket. His hair was longish, a little mussed, and he also sported a stubble of beard that gave him the kind of rakish look that would attract attention from the girls who fantasized about indulging with a bad boy.
--- End quote ---
Or, he joined the Marines after the shooting but didn't serve a full term, or much of a term at all. 
So, Marcone's age for me is at least 31-35 during SF, that is the lower limit then. Harry is 25 during SF per Priscilla timeline.

That said, we actually didn't see Marcone appearance in the shootout which "a very, very young-looking Marcone" is based off of; we saw his appearance via a soulgaze between Harry and Helen Beckitt. 

Mira:

--- Quote from: raidem on September 26, 2017, 04:57:41 PM ---Given this WOJ:"@BillyYank Marcone was a Marine", I really don't see Marcone on active duty as a Marine from the time of Amanda Beckitt's shooting onward. During this time, he is actively fighting to take over a criminal enterprise.  Therefore, he served as a Marine prior to his appearance as quoted below:Or, he joined the Marines after the shooting but didn't serve a full term, or much of a term at all. 
So, Marcone's age for me is at least 31-35 during SF, that is the lower limit then. Harry is 25 during SF per Priscilla timeline.

That said, we actually didn't see Marcone appearance in the shootout which "a very, very young-looking Marcone" is based off of; we saw his appearance via a soulgaze between Harry and Helen Beckitt. 

--- End quote ---

Young looking is also very subjective,   some people have the kind of face that appears very young well into their thirties.. Others begin to look middle aged at thirty..

The man that Harry meets seems to me to be closer to forty if not older verses closer to thirty..

Which story is this from?  Was it a short story I don't recognize the initials for it.

--- Quote ---Quote

    He wasn't wearing a business suit. He had on jeans and a black leather jacket. His hair was longish, a little mussed, and he also sported a stubble of beard that gave him the kind of rakish look that would attract attention from the girls who fantasized about indulging with a bad boy.

Or, he joined the Marines after the shooting but didn't serve a full term, or much of a term at all. 
--- End quote ---

And where exactly is it placed in the book timeline?

raidem:
I added the first line of the quote as I didn't include it in the previous paste.

--- Quote ---I looked over my shoulder to see a very, very young-looking Marcone.
He wasn't wearing a business suit. He had on jeans and a black leather jacket. His hair was longish, a little mussed, and he also sported a stubble of beard that gave him the kind of rakish look that would attract attention from the girls who fantasized about indulging with a bad boy.
--- End quote ---
This quote is from White Knight during the soul gaze between Harry and Helen Beckitt when Harry is trying to decide if Helen is involved in the Ordo murders.

It (time of shootout when Amanda gets shot at apparent age 10-11) falls in Priscilla's timeline of 3-4 BSF but that depends on the age of Amanda with her being in DM as "late teens or early twenties." My math has it being between say 3-7 years BSF.  There is further restraints on the timeline of the shooting though where Marcone learns about Amanda surviving 2 years after the shooting, around the time of him taking over Chicago's criminal underworld which according to the timeline occurs 2 years BSF.  So, the shooting seems to be 4 years BSF.

BSF=Before Storm Front.
The
--- Quote ---very, very young-looking Marcone
--- End quote ---
reference is from Harry's perspective in WK looking back at events some years prior to SF.

Rhetoric:

--- Quote from: Storm Front ---Murphy's jaw tensed, little motions at the corners of her face. Then she said, "Greg and Helen Beckitt. Three years ago, their daughter, Amanda, was killed in a cross fire. Johnny Marcone's thugs were shooting it out with some of the Jamaican gang that was trying to muscle in on the territory back then. One of them shot the little girl. She lived for three weeks in intensive care and died when they took her off life support."
--- End quote ---


--- Quote from: White Night --- "When did you find out about the girl?"

"Two years later," [Marcone] said. "Everything was set up through a dummy corporation's trust fund."
--- End quote ---

I don't have anything to add to the conversation. Just wanted to throw in some in-book references.

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