The Dresden Files > DF Reference Collection
Harry's murders of Non-humans! (Cold Days spoilers)
Elanmorin:
--- Quote from: raidem on November 05, 2013, 07:15:14 PM ---Not true, I can do all the judging I want based on my moral standards.
--- End quote ---
Not true. You cannot do all the judging you want based on my moral standards. Consistently applying moral relativism leads to absurdity.
--- Quote ---By believing in moral relativism, I must allow that there are others who would disagree with me. Case in point, you disagree with me regarding Harry's morality.
--- End quote ---
And according to moral relativism I am correct. Obvious contradiction is obvious.
--- Quote ---I disagree. Harry wants to be a good guy. Also, I am the person who is real; Harry isn't. Therefore, mine is the opinion that matters. And, as such, I will hold him to my moral standards whether you agree with that fact or not.
--- End quote ---
And good is subjective according to moral relativism. If either Harry or I believes that killing Sidhe is good (or at least "not bad") then killing Sidhe is good (or not "bad"). And mine is the opinion that matters. ;)
the neurovore of Zur-En-Aargh:
--- Quote from: Gigglestomp on November 05, 2013, 06:13:16 PM ---The only time he ever really REALLY felt bad were after executing Cassus, Luccio(Corpsetaker), and Susan. He either did it cold or without thinking, and that is what scared him.
--- End quote ---
The degree of different Harry feels about killing people from rationally thought-through reasons and killing people in the heat of passion is one of the things I find most morally unpalatable about him, fwiw.
the neurovore of Zur-En-Aargh:
--- Quote from: raidem on November 05, 2013, 07:15:14 PM ---Not true, I can do all the judging I want based on my moral standards.
--- End quote ---
Well, while you totally can do so, it's a mite counter-productive from an analytical perspective because it kind of cuts off a whole range of enjoyable debates about the books to funnel them into one's own personal moral standards, given that arguing our own personal moral standards is not a thing this forum is for.
raidem:
--- Quote ---Not true. You cannot do all the judging you want based on my moral standards. Consistently applying moral relativism leads to absurdity.
--- End quote ---
I didn't argue that I would judge Harry according to your moral standards, rather I said my own. And no, consistently applying moral relativism leads to the fact that we have a difference of opinion.
--- Quote ---And according to moral relativism I am correct. Obvious contradiction is obvious.
--- End quote ---
There is no 'correct.' You are allowed your opinion, I am allowed mine.
--- Quote ---And good is subjective according to moral relativism. If either Harry or I believes that killing Sidhe is good (or at least "not bad") then killing Sidhe is good (or not "bad"). And mine is the opinion that matters. ;)
--- End quote ---
This is true, but I do remind you that you were the one who argued that I could not judge Harry.
--- Quote ---Well, while you totally can do so, it's a mite counter-productive from an analytical perspective because it kind of cuts off a whole range of enjoyable debates about the books to funnel them into one's own personal moral standards, given that arguing our own personal moral standards is not a thing this forum is for.
--- End quote ---
The key here is I can judge all I want. To the point that it lessens my enjoyment, that is something I wouldn't "WANT." Also, I am not arguing my personal moral standard. I am defending my right to use my morals in deciding what type of guy Harry is. And, defending my judgement of Harry's actions based on those morals. The following is one of my statements regarding morality that I made. As you can see it is far from being TT or an alarming argument of what my personal moral standards are.
--- Quote ---I hope Harry starts to feel more compassion for those he kills that are of the sidhe. The wall between killing a sidhe and killing a mortal seems to be weakened each time he kills one of the Fae.
Of course, Mab is fine with it. She is quite happy with her Monster in Traning. Inez would be so proud.
--- End quote ---
Moral Relativism allows for equally 'right' points of view. I can judge Harry according to my morality. You are equally able to judge Harry according to yours. Moral Relativism says nothing about who is "correct;" it simply states that there can be a difference of opinion regarding morality.
newfan09:
Harry referred to his party as his first day in the prison yard and I think he treated it as such.
I just got done reading Ender's Game and I think that Harry treated this interaction with the Sidhe much the way Ender handled his fight with Stillson.
(click to show/hide)“Knocking him down won the first fight. I wanted to win all the next ones, too. So they’d leave me alone.”
Card, Orson Scott (2010-04-01). Ender's Game: 1 (The Ender Quintet) (Kindle Locations 633-634). Tom Doherty Associates. Kindle Edition.
Does this make it morally right? No, but Harry will be among the first to tell you that he isn't a hero. Look at how he dealt with Snake boy in the Hotel room in DM
--- Quote from: raidem on November 05, 2013, 03:52:46 PM ---I have wondered if perhaps Harry's instructions to Cat Sith or Harry's new rule led to Cat Sith being susceptible to a mortal who infects him.
--- End quote ---
I also wanted to address this comment. It wasn't a mortal that infected Cat Sith. We have yet to see a proven instance of a mortal being infected.
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