McAnally's (The Community Pub) > Author Craft
Kill them like a Joss: Musings on when and why to shiv a main character
The Deposed King:
Well one is planning to run the exploding football all the way to the sacrificial finish line. Should be a meaningful enough ending there.
The other went on a royal rumble and tried to save the day. When it all went to pot he stood fast and held the tail end of the retreat. Sadly he fell holding the line and despite his protests his boys rushed him out of there... sadly he didn't make it.
A number of named characters get shiv in this book. Not all of them recover... right now its running somewhere around 50/50. Even the miracle that is a healing tank can't perform the impossible.
The Deposed King
the neurovore of Zur-En-Aargh:
--- Quote from: arianne on March 03, 2013, 10:59:02 AM ---I think it's just that when someone we like dies in a book, we want it to mean something, and not just be pointless ("Oh, by the way, the guy you like just died. Deal with it. Haha."). Trying to give a death meaning by being "profound" or "moralizing" just makes it worse in a way.
I'm worried that a lot of fantasy sagas with the "someone important will DIE in the last book!!!!!" plotlines are making some writers think that they somehow HAVE to kill someone at the end of the book to prove something, and then they're left wondering what to do with the rest of the book, so they might as well add some profound bits to round it all off....
--- End quote ---
The thing is, though, if what you are writing is Epic Fantasy, of the All that is Good And Worthwhile is Under Threat by Terrible Evil variety, and you're depicting people who are supposed to be in great and terrible danger, it's not so easy to make it convincing if nothing bad ever happens to anyone important to the reader. Star Wars is a pretty light and family-friendly example, and even in Star Wars Obi-Wan dies and Luke loses a hand and gets pretty dark.
Personally, I appreciate it when a writer who is doing "these people are under serious threat" has the nerve to have a random chance of war take out a character who is of some significance and who had ongoing story stuff yet to resolve; it really ups the tension level about how everything else is going to work out.
Galvatron:
--- Quote from: the neurovore of Zur-En-Aargh on March 04, 2013, 04:31:55 PM ---The thing is, though, if what you are writing is Epic Fantasy, of the All that is Good And Worthwhile is Under Threat by Terrible Evil variety, and you're depicting people who are supposed to be in great and terrible danger, it's not so easy to make it convincing if nothing bad ever happens to anyone important to the reader. Star Wars is a pretty light and family-friendly example, and even in Star Wars Obi-Wan dies and Luke loses a hand and gets pretty dark.
Personally, I appreciate it when a writer who is doing "these people are under serious threat" has the nerve to have a random chance of war take out a character who is of some significance and who had ongoing story stuff yet to resolve; it really ups the tension level about how everything else is going to work out.
--- End quote ---
I agree with this, its hard for me as a reader to feel a sense of danger or really appreciate a threat, if nothing bad ever happens.
Now I dont mean someone gets beat up, heals, life goes on, I mean bad like dead/maimed.
I have no issues seeing characters die, I think its exciting knowing and author might off one of my favorite characters at any given momnet, I do think you can over due it of course (GRRM) but everyone likes different things I guess
The Deposed King:
--- Quote from: Galvatron on March 05, 2013, 06:44:31 PM ---I agree with this, its hard for me as a reader to feel a sense of danger or really appreciate a threat, if nothing bad ever happens.
Now I dont mean someone gets beat up, heals, life goes on, I mean bad like dead/maimed.
I have no issues seeing characters die, I think its exciting knowing and author might off one of my favorite characters at any given momnet, I do think you can over due it of course (GRRM) but everyone likes different things I guess
--- End quote ---
After a certain point somebody gets hurt they head up, oh the fear, oh the terror, oh the humanity, but no one ever dies? The readers are going, yeah right. Unless of course you're writing the kind of dark stuff that I don't care to read and have little interest in writing, with rape and torture, slavery and bondage, i.e. fates that can be portrayed as worse than death. Where is the tension, where is the risk?
For the victories of your characters to have meaning there have to be losses and real sacrifices along the way. Both prospective and actual. Then when they say, we did this, look at what we've accomplished, we're nodding our head and agreeing that they had a long hard slog.
The Deposed King
Paynesgrey:
--- Quote from: The Deposed King on March 07, 2013, 12:39:11 AM ---After a certain point somebody gets hurt they head up, oh the fear, oh the terror, oh the humanity, but no one ever dies? The readers are going, yeah right. Unless of course you're writing the kind of dark stuff that I don't care to read and have little interest in writing, with rape and torture, slavery and bondage, i.e. fates that can be portrayed as worse than death. Where is the tension, where is the risk?
For the victories of your characters to have meaning there have to be losses and real sacrifices along the way. Both prospective and actual. Then when they say, we did this, look at what we've accomplished, we're nodding our head and agreeing that they had a long hard slog.
The Deposed King
--- End quote ---
And also, for characters to be motivated to go to a certain level, to do certain things they wouldn't otherwise... somebody they care for has to have died. That loss can feed a wrathful vendetta or a cold, sober determination, but in either case, it's motivation for the character to grimly do what they need to do. And to make that loss resonate with the reader, to make that surviving character's motivation feel real, we've got to make that character matter to the reader so they share the sense of loss or outrage... or at least understand it.
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