The Dresden Files > DF Reference Collection
Questions for Jim 2012 style 2
KevinSig:
--- Quote from: TheCuriousFan on September 17, 2012, 12:42:27 AM ---I wasn't saying Lash was providing the Hellfire on her own, I would say it was Lasciel footing the bill with the channel between her and Lash providing Harry access.
--- End quote ---
With the circle barrier around her coin, I'm doubtful Lash was able to get anything from Lashiel. And while it isn't strictly laid out, I suspect in most coin possessions, the shadow construct does have communication with the Fallen trapped in the coin, giving it access to the Fallen's Intellecteus.
However, by placing the coin in the circle, Harry circumvented this.
I mean, from Micheal's comments, you'd think that the coin would present an impossible to resist temptation. While Lash was tempting at times, she never really came across nearly as manipulative as Michael seems to suggest.
So that's my reasoning for Intellecteus being a factor.
...
That aside, the point remains, I don't see Lash being able to work directly with Lashiel, thanks to the circle. I think the only reason Harry might have been able to summon the coin from the circle is because it was his Will that created it.
If another Wizard had so confined the coin, that might not even be an issue.
TheCuriousFan:
Hmmm, that would explain why Lash wasn't as tempting as expected. That that does leave me wondering why no slump post Hellfire use and why Bob didn't point out to Harry that he was missing chunks of his soul.
Sheaman3773:
--- Quote from: KevinSig on September 17, 2012, 01:11:52 AM ---With the circle barrier around her coin, I'm doubtful Lash was able to get anything from Lashiel. And while it isn't strictly laid out, I suspect in most coin possessions, the shadow construct does have communication with the Fallen trapped in the coin, giving it access to the Fallen's Intellecteus.
However, by placing the coin in the circle, Harry circumvented this.
I mean, from Micheal's comments, you'd think that the coin would present an impossible to resist temptation. While Lash was tempting at times, she never really came across nearly as manipulative as Michael seems to suggest.
So that's my reasoning for Intellecteus being a factor.
...
That aside, the point remains, I don't see Lash being able to work directly with Lashiel, thanks to the circle. I think the only reason Harry might have been able to summon the coin from the circle is because it was his Will that created it.
If another Wizard had so confined the coin, that might not even be an issue.
--- End quote ---
That's an interesting set of theories. I'm rather more in favor of the idea that placing the coin within the circle didn't do anything in and of itself so much as it symbolized a conscious rejection of Lasciel. That keeps the conduit between the Fallen and her shadow open and clear, so Hellfire is fine, but the rules prevent anything more overt--which further explains Malcolm showing up in the dream the same night that the shadow created the hallucination of Sheila.
I don't really buy the Intellecteus theory, partially just in response to the large number of theories that cropped up about everything and it's cousin having Intellecteus after finding out about the island and Shagnasty, but also partially because it just doesn't read that way to me. The shadow could only do so much because of the kind of person that Harry is; tell him to do one thing and he'll probably do the opposite just out of reflex. And since she could hardly tell him to make sure he never accepted her temptations...
It's also important to remember that circles aren't perfect--even in the first book, the backlash from Harry messing up Victor's circle destroyed the one around the Beckitts, so clearly it's possible for the coin's retrieval spell to be able to brute force or finesse its way past his precautions.
TheCuriousFan:
--- Quote ---I don't really buy the Intellecteus theory, partially just in response to the large number of theories that cropped up about everything and it's cousin having Intellecteus after finding out about the island and Shagnasty, but also partially because it just doesn't read that way to me. The
--- End quote ---
Uh, angels, Fallen or otherwise are confirmed to have Intellectus.
Sheaman3773:
I thought that it was Archangels who had Intellectus, not all angels. The Fallen aren't Archangels, are they?
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