The Dresden Files > DF Reference Collection
Doylist analysis on LC fix timing
TheCuriousFan:
--- Quote ---Intersting. This gets me thinking... Whoever Thomas could have let in would have to be someone that doesn't care about a WCV living with Harry or flat out knows their relationship.
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It would also have to be someone Thomas trusts enough to let them risk Harry's life by fiddling around with his equipment.
--- Quote ---Jim didn't write the DFRPG, he just read over it and told them things like, "You can't use that, I won't be revealing it until much later in the series." However, seeing their writeup might have motivated him to flesh out the points for your #2.
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Reading this, I have to wonder, did they get to look at notes detailing various concepts and backstories of creatures in the dresdenverse to make so many accurate guesses about future content?
Serack:
--- Quote from: TheCuriousFan on April 03, 2012, 03:21:50 PM ---It would also have to be someone Thomas trusts enough to let them risk Harry's life by fiddling around with his equipment.
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I added a few extra thoughts in an edit to that post. I hope you don't miss em.
--- Quote ---Reading this, I have to wonder, did they get to look at notes detailing various concepts and backstories of creatures in the dresdenverse to make so many accurate guesses about future content?
--- End quote ---
Yes and no. Since Iago says he has been sitting on the spoiler for the event at the conclusion of Changes since before the books were published, I get the idea that he was probably privy to Jim's original notes on the series that he wrote during his "writing a series" class. However Iago didn't do most of the writing for the books.
Here's something Iago said about the Watsonian PoV of the DFRPG books:
--- Quote from: iago on June 13, 2010, 12:49:01 AM ---It is not Word of Jim, but it's close. The blacked out stuff that folks can discover in the PDFs are 4th wall breaking stuff, mainly an in joke for people who figure out how to read it. Beyond that there are elements of the text that are at least slightly inaccurate or more often incomplete because the rpg as presented is being filtered through Billy -- a version of Billy who was more clued in prior to Turn Coat, so the rpg itself is at least a little alternate universe in its conceit. But regardless we made it as close to the spruce material as we could manage, because we wanted the setting parts of it to work as a legitimate fan guide too.
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I take this to mean that pretty much the main source material for the DFRPG books is the case files themselves up to TC, with a little bit of interpolation and spin put on it by the writers from the perspective of Billy.
Priscellie:
--- Quote from: Serack on April 03, 2012, 03:18:25 PM ---Intersting. This gets me thinking... Whoever Thomas could have let in would have to be someone that doesn't care about a WCV living with Harry or flat out knows their relationship. It also inspires some other thoughts that if expressed, I fear could lead to derailment. I'd rather hear more opinions like this one first.
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Ooh, good point.
--- Quote ---Jim didn't write the DFRPG, he just read over it and told them things like, "You can't use that, I won't be revealing it until much later in the series." However, seeing their writeup might have motivated him to flesh out the points for your #2.
--- End quote ---
While it's true that Jim didn't "write" the DFRPG, he answered a LOT of questions for the team, clarifying points that were unclear or thusfar undefined. A LOT. STAGGERING amounts of text. He also provided a lot of answers to questions they didn't ask, providing huge, wonderful insights into the Dresdenverse. (Good lord, how I wish I could see all that correspondence! And all the future developments Chad figured out from text alone that Jim made him remove from the published version! Covet!) I think the DFRPG provided an excellent catalyst for him to solidify concepts in his mind he may not have taken the time to complete worked out.
Still, Jim is pretty good at keeping his books lean and relevant. If something isn't necessary for a book, why put it there? The Doylist argument of "He just figured this out and wanted to show it off" doesn't hold up to me. I don't think he'd contrive to include a "this is how time travel works" treatise in PG if time travel wasn't crucial to the events of that novel.
Also, while I know the DFRPG was in progress at the time Jim was writing Proven Guilty, I don't know how actively Jim was contributing at the time. I didn't become a beta until just after White Night was published, so my Behind The Scenes-foo was weaker.
--- Quote from: Serack on April 03, 2012, 03:39:01 PM ---Since Iago says he has been sitting on the spoiler for the event at the conclusion of Changes since before the books were published, I get the idea that he was probably privy to Jim's original notes on the series that he wrote during his "writing a series" class. However Iago didn't do most of the writing for the books.
--- End quote ---
Nah, Jim just likes tormenting those close to him. :D He told me the first line of "Changes" over a burger at New York Comic Con two years before the book came out, because he wanted to see my flailing reaction. XD While Fred is certainly the non-Butcher person who knows the most about what's going to happen in future books (unless it's Debbie Chester), I don't think it was because Jim let him see his notes. I think it was because Jim had to share his evil genius plan with someone. :D
Serack:
--- Quote from: Priscellie on April 03, 2012, 04:09:23 PM ---Ooh, good point.
While it's true that Jim didn't "write" the DFRPG, he answered a LOT of questions for the team, clarifying points that were unclear or thusfar undefined. A LOT. STAGGERING amounts of text. He also provided a lot of answers to questions they didn't ask, providing huge, wonderful insights into the Dresdenverse. (Good lord, how I wish I could see all that correspondence! And all the future developments Chad figured out from text alone that Jim made him remove from the published version! Covet!) I think the DFRPG provided an excellent catalyst for him to solidify concepts in his mind he may not have taken the time to complete worked out.
Still, Jim is pretty good at keeping his books lean and relevant. If something isn't necessary for a book, why put it there? The Doylist argument of "He just figured this out and wanted to show it off" doesn't hold up to me. I don't think he'd contrive to include a "this is how time travel works" treatise in PG if time travel wasn't crucial to the events of that novel.
Also, while I know the DFRPG was in progress at the time Jim was writing Proven Guilty, I don't know how actively Jim was contributing at the time. I didn't become a beta until just after White Night was published, so my Behind The Scenes-foo was weaker.
Nah, Jim just likes tormenting those close to him. :D He told me the first line of "Changes" over a burger at New York Comic Con two years before the book came out, because he wanted to see my flailing reaction. XD While Fred is certainly the non-Butcher person who knows the most about what's going to happen in future books (unless it's Debbie Chester), I don't think it was because Jim let him see his notes. I think it was because Jim had to share his evil genius plan with someone. :D
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You mind if I pin some of this down in my "Word of Mods" section? I ask because I don't want you to constantly feel like you have to self edit because you are considering what might be claimed for posterity.
Vairelome:
--- Quote from: Serack on April 03, 2012, 03:18:25 PM ---Edit: Also, the fact that Thomas greeted Harry with the sawed off Shot Gun at the beginning of Ch 18 when he is coming in the door made me think that maybe he was particularly jumpy at the time, and wonder how that flavors this theory. I started going down the train of thought that maybe the perp was still in the appt at the time, but if so, Mouse would have probably keyed in on a veiled exit.
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This is a very clever point; what do you think of this explanation? (The following would be consistent with Mab as the culprit.)
Thomas let someone into the apartment (random girlfriend, perhaps?), and then something happens that demonstrates she wasn't who Thomas thought she was. Suppose she managed to...outlast Thomas's WCV endurance and then cased the place while he was all happy and comatose. She fixes LC and then exits the apartment through a portal to the Nevernever starting in Harry's basement and ending in Lea's garden. Thomas wakes up before Harry gets home and is freaked out by the fact that he fell asleep leaving a stranger in the apartment, and the stranger is gone leaving everything bolted shut from the inside. When Harry returns, Thomas thinks it might be "mystery girlfriend" back for round two, and while he's OK with part of that idea, he'd really like some answers first. Hence the shotgun.
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