The Dresden Files > DF Reference Collection
Questions
Cozarkian:
The whisper didn't change the route, it just added the step of calling Kincaid.
Whisper thought: I'll call Uriel first, but he won't be able to help, so I'll call Mab and turn into a monster. I need to make sure I am stopped before that happens. Calls Molly in to help.
After-whisper thought: I'll call Uriel first, but he won't be able to help, so I'll call Mab and turn into a monster. Calls Uriel.
Harry wasn't going to skip calling Uriel, he was just being realistic because he knew Uriel wouldn't help. And if by some miracle, Uriel did help, when Molly found out he wasn't the WK, she would have given the memory back so Harry could call off the hit. In fact, the hit was on the new WK, so if Harry didn't become the WK, Kincaid wouldn't have shot him (it's not unreasonable to think Kincaid would have a way of learning whether Harry actually became the WK).
DragonEyes:
--- Quote from: Cozarkian on March 19, 2012, 06:49:09 PM ---The whisper didn't change the route, it just added the step of calling Kincaid.
Whisper thought: I'll call Uriel first, but he won't be able to help, so I'll call Mab and turn into a monster. I need to make sure I am stopped before that happens. Calls Molly in to help.
After-whisper thought: I'll call Uriel first, but he won't be able to help, so I'll call Mab and turn into a monster. Calls Uriel.
Harry wasn't going to skip calling Uriel, he was just being realistic because he knew Uriel wouldn't help. And if by some miracle, Uriel did help, when Molly found out he wasn't the WK, she would have given the memory back so Harry could call off the hit. In fact, the hit was on the new WK, so if Harry didn't become the WK, Kincaid wouldn't have shot him (it's not unreasonable to think Kincaid would have a way of learning whether Harry actually became the WK).
--- End quote ---
He never reasoned that he would call Uriel after the whisper. It was only when the whisper was taken away that he arrived at that decision. I just reread the entire scene and Uriel isn't mentioned once after the whisper. It is only in the memory without the whisper that Uriel comes up.
Edit:
Okay, I went back and looked at Uriel's exposition of the Shadow and he's pretty sure of what it was.
--- Quote from: ---Uriel looked at me and smiled faintly. "It added enough anger, enough self-recrimination, even guilt, and enough despair to your deliberations to make you decide that destroying yourself was the only option left to you. It took your freedom away."
--- End quote ---
Based on that quote, its pretty clear that Uriel believes the only real change was the suicide. I'll defer to his judgement since my argument was all about nuance.
Cozarkian:
--- Quote from: DragonEyes on March 19, 2012, 06:59:06 PM ---He never reasoned that he would call Uriel after the whisper. It was only when the whisper was taken away that he arrived at that decision. I just reread the entire scene and Uriel isn't mentioned once after the whisper. It is only in the memory without the whisper that Uriel comes up.
--- End quote ---
I recall it as more of a contextual conclusion than an express statement. Harry isn't outlining exactly what he is going to do, he's just skipping to the inevitable outcome - Harry becomes WK - and then setting up his suicide plan before going through the motions (the first motion will be calling Uriel and having his plea for help rejected).
Mr. Death:
--- Quote from: DragonEyes on March 19, 2012, 06:59:06 PM ---Based on that quote, its pretty clear that Uriel believes the only real change was the suicide. I'll defer to his judgement since my argument was all about nuance.
--- End quote ---
I disagree--he used the word "destroy," not "kill." Harry felt that becoming the Winter Knight would destroy him--destroy Harry Blackstone Copperfield Dresden, the man he had been and replace it with a monster. He chose to avoid that destruction by dying. There's a distinction there that needs to be made.
DragonEyes:
--- Quote from: Mr. Death on March 19, 2012, 07:46:06 PM ---I disagree--he used the word "destroy," not "kill." Harry felt that becoming the Winter Knight would destroy him--destroy Harry Blackstone Copperfield Dresden, the man he had been and replace it with a monster. He chose to avoid that destruction by dying. There's a distinction there that needs to be made.
--- End quote ---
See... that's about the argument I'd been making and I had just about given up. I also think that nuance is important.
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