Author Topic: Help Design a Rote "Freeze" Evocation  (Read 2164 times)

Offline Wolfwood2

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Help Design a Rote "Freeze" Evocation
« on: September 08, 2010, 02:55:04 PM »
So I need to come up with a couple of rotes (Lore at +2) for my character in a chest-deep game.  He's got an affinity for ice evocations (specializes in water), so I am considering having one of them be a "freeze" attack spell that basically encases the target in a block of ice.  Can someone help me work out how this would work and how the rote should be best designed?

Right now the character has Conviction and Discipline at +4, a speciality in water (Power +1), and I have not yet decided on his focus items.  (Feel free to suggest; he has 4 slots.)

I imagine that the effect of this should basically be a grapple, though I'm not sure if I understand how grapples work.  Does a grapple prevent someone from acting defensively?  Like, say, using Athletics to dodge in response to being attacked?  It seems really powerful if it does, but I'm not sure conceptually how to explain an opponent still twisting and dodging when they're encased in ice.

How much power should I put into this thing?  Is it worth overchanneling as standard on a rote?  How many shifts is it useful to put into duration?  I want it to last at least one additional exchange, because I can't count on going before the opponent and that means it's basically wasted it it only lasts one exchange.

Just curious how the mechanics experts would do this one.

Offline MijRai

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Re: Help Design a Rote "Freeze" Evocation
« Reply #1 on: September 08, 2010, 04:32:59 PM »
Mkay, have your foci give +2 Water Offensive Control and +1 Water Offensive Power. That brings all attack Water evocations to +6.* As far as your spell, I suggest an Orbius remake.

Ice Cube
Type: Offensive Water Block, Adjucated as a Grapple
Power: 6 Shifts (4 Conviction, +1 Specialization, +1 Foci), 3 Effect, 3 Duration
Control: 6 (4 Discipline, +2 Foci)
Duration: 3 Exchanges
Opposed By: Dodge, Counterspell, Endurance if trapped, Armor Ineffective.
Targetting: Target in LoS
1 Mental Stress
Effect: The target is trapped in a magical block of ice, simulataneously being crushed and frozen. Every round, the target must roll Endurance against a +3. Failing the roll gives them a +1 Stress hit due to suffocation/being crushed, etc.

You can modify it how you want, making it weaker or stronger the way you see fit. Remember that you can add more shifts of effect later in the fight, letting you make it last longer if needed.

*If you really wanted to, you could have the foci give another +1 Power and +1 Control. However, said foci would only be useable with this specific Rote. You would use your one Focus Item slot, and the free one provided if you tie a foci to a single rote, which makes it useless for any spell but this one. I would go with using the one foci slot you have left as a +1 Water Defensive Control, so that you could have a Five shift Defensive Block for your other rote.
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Offline JesterOC

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Re: Help Design a Rote "Freeze" Evocation
« Reply #2 on: September 08, 2010, 04:35:45 PM »
Conviction of 4 with specialty in water gives you a 5 in conviction.

How do you intend to use it? As a last ditch effort to try to get away from someone, or as a main attack in a combat. If it is a main attack I would keep it within your conviction level, plus whatever focuses you have. Lets assume you have a +1 to power with defensive (or offensive it could be argued) making a total of 6 potential without incurring higher mental stress.

Base it off of the Orbius example spell. You will not that while it states that it is modeled after the grapple rules, it is not identical to those rules. Here are the major differences.
 
1) You don't need to invoke an aspect to trigger the attack like you need to do with grappling.
2) You can do other actions while the spell is in effect unlike grappling which takes your entire turn.
3) The block level is always the effect strength unlike grapple which is your might plus your roll.
4) Since it is a spell it costs you one stress minimum to cast. Grapple does not of course.

All in all it seems to even itself out. It is weaker and costs stress, but you can act on subsequent turns.

Since you get to act on subsequent turns I suggest at least one shift be put towards an extra exchange. However since it is limited to the effect, you want that as high as possible to I would with the rest of your shifts for effect. If you want it to last longer you can always prolong the spell in another exchange. Or you can choose to run.

So 5 for effect and 1 for duration, since it has no targeting roll it just works

***update after seeing MijRai's post.
You will notice some differences between my and MijRai's spell. I assume that the target is always the same, endurance because I assume you are going to hit automatically (just like Orbius) and the real contest is the target dealing with cold and suffocation.
Also since it is Rote, you don't need a control roll.
Yet again my assumption is to make the block as powerful as possible, and if you need to prolong it, then pile on the power next turn, and it will last until most things are dead.

Oh and MijRai's durration should be 4 exchanges (the first one is free).

Stealing MijRai's formating
Ice Cube
Type: Offensive Water Block, Adjucated as a Grapple
Power: 6 Shifts (4 Conviction, +1 Specialization, +1 Foci), 5 Effect, 1 Duration
Control: Rote
Duration: 2 Exchanges
Opposed By: Endurance
Targetting: Target in LoS
1 Mental Stress
Effect: The target is trapped in a magical block of ice, simulataneously being crushed and frozen. Every round, the target must roll Endurance against a +5. Failing the roll gives them a +1 Stress hit due to suffocation/being crushed, etc.
« Last Edit: September 08, 2010, 04:44:25 PM by JesterOC »

Offline DFJunkie

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Re: Help Design a Rote "Freeze" Evocation
« Reply #3 on: September 08, 2010, 04:42:01 PM »
Well there have been some spirited debates on what defenses a Grapple prevents, but Madge's Orbius spell (YS 294) is an example of a spell that enacts a Grapple on the opponent.  

Now, to design a Grapple spell you'll need to assign shifts of power to the Grapple itself, one shift per level of effect.  Each shift of persistence increases the duration by one exchange (above the default of one exchange).  Your character can channel 5 shifts without taking extra stress, but only control 4 without an aspect or focus item.  

Personally I would recommend creating a +2 Offensive Control (Water) item, if only because it will also add to your Water targeting rolls, and attacking at Fantastic is always fun.

If you don't mind a rote that inflicts a 2 stress hit on you (not really a big deal since casting stress rolls up anyway) you can assign 5 shifts to effect and 1 to duration.  This would mean that the ice lasts for two full exchanges and, IIRC, end on your turn, not the opponent's, so your enemy will lose two full actions (assuming they don't break out).  The first turn would establish the grapple, and on the second turn, if they fail to escape, they will suffer 1 physical stress in addition to losing their turn.

As a final word, I would not recommend making this a rote.  The reason I say that is that the entire point of a rote is that it's a "one size fits all" spell.  Given that you can change your description of the spell to change the appropriate defensive skill (Orbius is resisted by Endurance of all things, since it's a glob of extradimensional goo that covers your face and suffocates you) for a non-rote Evocation you would probably be best served to come up with your descriptions on the fly to tailor the defending stat to your enemy's weaknesses.  Just my two cents there.

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Offline Wolfwood2

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Re: Help Design a Rote "Freeze" Evocation
« Reply #4 on: September 08, 2010, 05:50:26 PM »
As a final word, I would not recommend making this a rote.  The reason I say that is that the entire point of a rote is that it's a "one size fits all" spell.  Given that you can change your description of the spell to change the appropriate defensive skill (Orbius is resisted by Endurance of all things, since it's a glob of extradimensional goo that covers your face and suffocates you) for a non-rote Evocation you would probably be best served to come up with your descriptions on the fly to tailor the defending stat to your enemy's weaknesses.  Just my two cents there.

Hmm, that's a good point.  What kind of spells do make good rotes, then?  I'm tempted to just do one attack and one defense, but that seems a bit boring.

Offline Becq

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Re: Help Design a Rote "Freeze" Evocation
« Reply #5 on: September 08, 2010, 09:26:16 PM »
As an aside, this may actually be a fire spell, rather than water.  Or rather, maybe it could be either.  But Dresden has on several cases used fire magic to draw the heat out of something to freeze it.

Also, I would be tempted to make this attack a block against actions in both directions.  In other words, the block keeps the target from moving, but also creates an effective defense against incoming attacks, as well.  Sure, you could just shoot the target, but if the attack beat the block, it would shatter the ice, just as an attempt by the target to break out would (if successful).

Offline JesterOC

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Re: Help Design a Rote "Freeze" Evocation
« Reply #6 on: September 09, 2010, 02:52:33 AM »
I think this is a very good type of spell to use as a rote spell. Especially if you crank up the effect and go easy on the duration. With a normal attack spell you still need to roll to hit, this spell will be in essence an auto-hit. You can always use it in a non rote fashion if you want to use it another way.


Offline Becq

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Re: Help Design a Rote "Freeze" Evocation
« Reply #7 on: September 09, 2010, 05:17:13 PM »
I think this is a very good type of spell to use as a rote spell. Especially if you crank up the effect and go easy on the duration. With a normal attack spell you still need to roll to hit, this spell will be in essence an auto-hit. You can always use it in a non rote fashion if you want to use it another way.
This.  A short-duration, high-power grapple of the sort being discussed gives you flexible utility.  It gives you a greater assurance that your block of ice will stick (whereas a lower-power one might just get trampled on).  And if you want it to last longer, just extend the duration via the rules on YS259.

So, if I had base Conv/Disc of 4 each, a +1 spec in power, and, say, a +1 control focus (total of +5/+5), then I'd go with a strength 5, 1 exchange ice cube spell, knowing that I can opt to blow a second action (and one more stress) to add another 5 exchanges to the duration (and a potential 5 stress of damage to the target).

If you follow MijRai's suggestion and go with a +1/+2 focus (offensive water), then you get a strength 6 effect, and can bump the duration by +6 exchanges for the extra action and stress.  Better yet (if you don't mind losing another refresh) buying a level of refinement (increasing your water power by +1 and adding water control +1) would be more versatile that a stronger focus, since (a) you get the bonus for offense and defense spells, (b) you can't leave your refinement at home or get it disarmed, and (c) it frees up focus slots to be used for other toys (maybe enchanted items or potions).

Offline Becq

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Re: Help Design a Rote "Freeze" Evocation
« Reply #8 on: September 09, 2010, 05:24:26 PM »
Oh, and extra nastiness: refer to the 'redirecting' rules on YS260 to find out how the above spell can be converted, several exchanges later, into a 5 shift attack...

Offline JesterOC

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Re: Help Design a Rote "Freeze" Evocation
« Reply #9 on: September 10, 2010, 06:53:32 AM »
I forgot about the ability to convert this. Yes it makes it quite powerful.