The Dresden Files > DFRPG
Some Thaumaturgical Questions
Korwin:
I'm rereading the Thaumaturgical section, and some Questions are popping up...
--- Quote ---If the complexity of the spell is greater than your Lore, your wizard must enter a preparation stage during which he researches the spell further, assembles the necessary components, acquires additional sources of power, and finishes the spell construct.
--- End quote ---
I assume, if you do that once and need the exact same spell again (like summoning and binding the same creature again) you don’t need to research the spell again.
Should there e a rule for research between sessions? (Like Item creation.)
--- Quote ---Inflicting a mild disease on a fairly hale target—say, Good (+3) Endurance—would be a 13 complexity spell: 7 to match the best Endurance roll possible, 4 for the target’s stress track, and 2 more for the mild consequence.
--- End quote ---
The goal is to inflict an Mild consequence right? Wouldnt a 11 complexity spell be enough, since if they dont take at least mild consequence they pass out and you can dictate the illness?
--- Quote ---So a curse that acts as a maneuver to put Bad Luck on a target might start from “15 minutes” (about the length of that particular scene), and you could make it last all day by adding five shifts of complexity to the spell.
--- End quote ---
But only the first tag is free, right? It’s there to be invoked, but doesnt do a thing by itself.
--- Quote ---Make Declarations
As part of preparation, you can use your skills to declare you have access…
--- End quote ---
Hmm, can a skill be used multiple times for the same ritual for different declaration?
--- Quote ---Accept or Inflict Consequences, page 269
…Actually committing murder on a sentient being as part of a spell grants the wizard all of the shifts for all levels…
--- End quote ---
--- Quote ---Page 248
There are various sources that a wizard can draw on to power his spells:
…
Unwilling magical creatures; the deliberate sacrifice of humans or animals.
--- End quote ---
First magical?
Second, how much shifts would an animal grant?
Third, sacrificing animals isnt against the law, right?
I’ll try an Containment, Summoning and Binding Ritual.
Please tell me if I missed something…
My sample will be an Air-Spirit who is supposed to carry the summoner around.
I’ll give the Spirit
* inhuman Strenght
* Wings
* Veils aka. Glamours (so nobody is wondering about that flying wizard…)
What conviction should that being have? I’ll go with Superb +5 for the example…
Containment:
5 + 4 +2 for an Aspect to be on the save side is an +12 complexity containment.
Summoning
Would be the same +12 complexity.
Binding
Binding is a full conflict.
We need (+4 for lucky dice, +4 for stress boxes, +20 for all conditions [inkluding extreme condition], +5 to extend the duration of afternoon to a month) a +33 complexity ritual.
Casting that thing would’nt be that hard, if we play it save (+1 per exchange) and took our time.
Researching it would need many declarations or skipped scenes…
Korwin:
Can someone at least control my example?
Should an extreme consequence be in the calculation? (wrote condition instead of consequence in my example)
Ihadris:
Hey Korwin, I'm still learning the rules myself but Ill take a fair shot at some of this. I won't answer anything that I'm not too sure on as I don't have the time to look stuff up in the rule book right now.
--- Quote ---I assume, if you do that once and need the exact same spell again (like summoning and binding the same creature again) you don’t need to research the spell again.
--- End quote ---
You would need to do it again. In terms of game mechanics the preparation and the research is what makes up the difference between your wizards capabilities and the requirement of the spell. You'd still need to make up that difference again to cast the spell. In terms of narrative colour Harry still has to replace items used in rituals, meditate & prepare himself, wait for certain times of day etc all of which are things that can be used during the research phase to help. For example: Contacts roll to get the items, dicipline to meditate and prepare and tagging a scene aspect for the times of day.
--- Quote ---Hmm, can a skill be used multiple times for the same ritual for different declaration?
--- End quote ---
My first reaction to this is to say no. A player could just repeatedly roll their top skill to meet the requirements of the spell. Perhaps if they could frame it differently?
--- Quote ---First magical?
Second, how much shifts would an animal grant?
Third, sacrificing animals isnt against the law, right?
--- End quote ---
I don't think it has to be magical. (click to show/hide)Viktor Sells used rabbits. Further more in the example on page YS:301 it gave +2 bonus as a component. As for the Law, I would say no. The laws seem there to protect "mortals" in the sense of humans and you wouldn't be killing it by magic for the ritual.
--- Quote ---5 + 4 +2 for an Aspect to be on the save side is an +12 complexity containment.
--- End quote ---
Correct, that is the safes minimum except that 5+4+2=11.
--- Quote ---+20 for all conditions
--- End quote ---
I remember this being in one of the examples. Just to point out, incase you took it from one of the examples and didnt realise, that it is at 20 due to the extra mild consequence from having such high conviction.
--- Quote ---+33 complexity ritual.
--- End quote ---
As far as I can see yes it is.
I hope that goes someway to answering your questions. I can try having a go at the others one when I have time to look through the rule book.
Korwin:
--- Quote from: Ihadris on April 15, 2010, 08:32:11 AM ---Hey Korwin, I'm still learning the rules myself but Ill take a fair shot at some of this. I won't answer anything that I'm not too sure on as I don't have the time to look stuff up in the rule book right now.
--- End quote ---
Thanks for the answers, even if I dont agree, by talking about it many things get clearer.
--- Quote ---You would need to do it again. In terms of game mechanics the preparation and the research is what makes up the difference between your wizards capabilities and the requirement of the spell. You'd still need to make up that difference again to cast the spell. In terms of narrative colour Harry still has to replace items used in rituals, meditate & prepare himself, wait for certain times of day etc all of which are things that can be used during the research phase to help. For example: Contacts roll to get the items, dicipline to meditate and prepare and tagging a scene aspect for the times of day.
My first reaction to this is to say no. A player could just repeatedly roll their top skill to meet the requirements of the spell. Perhaps if they could frame it differently?
--- End quote ---
You brought up Victor Sells, did he research his spell new after each casting?
--- Quote ---I don't think it has to be magical. (click to show/hide)Viktor Sells used rabbits. Further more in the example on page YS:301 it gave +2 bonus as a component.
--- End quote ---
Yeah, I think thats an typo
--- Quote ---As for the Law, I would say no. The laws seem there to protect "mortals" in the sense of humans and you wouldn't be killing it by magic for the ritual.
--- End quote ---
I was thinking the same.
--- Quote ---Correct, that is the safes minimum except that 5+4+2=11.
--- End quote ---
Dont you need one more sucesses than the defender?
--- Quote ---I remember this being in one of the examples. Just to point out, incase you took it from one of the examples and didnt realise, that it is at 20 due to the extra mild consequence from having such high conviction.
--- End quote ---
No I counted. But I missed the extra mild consequence so it would be +22 for the consequences +26 if the target has the stunt for 2 extra mild consequences.
Will reread the example again, I think now I will understand it better.
Ihadris:
You brought up Victor Sells, did he research his spell new after each casting?
It details it on YS:301. In game terms you'd only be able to pull the spell off as it is detailed in that example once because much of the difference was met with consequences, including an extreme consequence.
However if you look back to the book he had to wait for the next storm, he had the Beckits involved each time (Re-read the 'Using Help' section on YS: 272), he killed a few rabbits each time (harry sees their corpses hanging up), the entire room was dedicated to creating an ideal atmosphere for the ritual so more then likely had a scene aspect on it.
On top of all of that he would have had to find something to connect the ritual to the intended victims. So in those terms yes he would have had to research some new parts of the spell each time.
--- Quote ---Dont you need one more sucesses than the defender?
--- End quote ---
So you do. When I read the scentence I thought you were saying that 5+4+2 was 12 but you were adding an extra to be above the chance of them invoking an aspect. Apologies for not taking a bit more time to read it properly.
--- Quote ---No I counted. But I missed the extra mild consequence so it would be +22 for the consequences +26 if the target has the stunt for 2 extra mild consequences.
--- End quote ---
Yeah. Thats me answering off the top of my head and not checking things again, I forgot the value of the consequences.
Navigation
[0] Message Index
[#] Next page
Go to full version